Am I going wrong somewhere? Your advice and views, please.

[lindsayt]

David, do you ever recommend anything that is not sold at Frank Harvey Hi-fi?

Is your advice is based on recommending the best sounding kit that can be bought for the money?

If it is, would you like to get together with myself to compare the Cyrus based system that you've recommended in this thread against something I can come up with at a fraction of the price?

And then we'll see if your recommendations have any merit whatsoever from a sound quality per pound spent point of view.

 

[Frank Harvey]

David, do you ever recommend anything that is not sold at Frank Harvey Hi-fi?

I have done yes, new and used. Knock yourself out searching for those instances. You seem to think that the recommendations are made to profit from them - I would only profit from it IF the OP decided to come to my store and IF he decided to buy anything. Considering there are about 100 Cyrus dealers in the UK, that chance is slim. I'm sure there are at least 50 dealers that are closer to him than we are. I'm making the recommendation to help him, regardless of where he regularly buys his equipment from. If I stop recommending stuff to people because our store sells it, what am I going to recommend him? At least I'm in a position where I have heard, and do hear, a lot of equipment to make a measured assessment, rather than just the system I own.

Is your advice is based on recommending the best sounding kit that can be bought for the money?

If you'd have read my posts, I recommended the OP try a more modern Cyrus system as they've made big advances in the past year. If he tried it and didn't like it, fine, dump it all. But, he may just find the newer Cyrus has what he's been missing. I made this recommendation based on the fact that his current Cyrus products can be 'upgraded', which means he won't have lost a huge amount of money on what he already owns, and he'd get good value for money with these upgrades.

Whether Cyrus is the best sounding kit at any price point is subjective, and only the individual could say. I could quite easily recommend a Naim or Bryston system, or how about a Leema or Classe system (we don't currently deal with those two) but seeing as the OP bought a Cyrus system, there must be something about it he liked. That, is worth pursuing.

If it is, would you like to get together with myself to compare the Cyrus based system that you've recommended in this thread against something I can come up with at a fraction of the price?

If you're talking about putting it up against second hand stuff, that's a different ball game. Having said that, I suppose I could put together a system based on B stock, which would be more competitive, and more in line with modern, used prices.

 

[paradiziac]

Since the OP talks about wanting "more and more detail" it would seem natural that he might give the new Cyrus stuff a listen, particularly if someone like David reckons the weak link is the pre-amp.

Then, maybe go listen to Naim or Rega to check it's not the boogie factor that's missing.

The used gear route needs dedication to get right and there's an element of trial and error. Even if he eventually went that way, it would be useful to know where his preferences were RE: mainstream gear, since the house sounds of various brands are reference points.

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Hi paradiziac

Imo all of the Cyrus pre amps which i've owned/heard have not been on par with their source and power amplifiers. I feel that alternative makes of pre amplification need to considered to unlock the potential of their source components and power amps. This is something which i've been saying for quite a while now.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Frank Harvey]

Judging by the last comment, and previous ones, a DACxp has never been heard then.....

 

[steve_1979]

if you want to get closer to what was recorded, try some active speakers, they can be amazing.

+1

If you have a budget of £1000 or more then a good pair of actives will beat passive speakers every time IMO. More detail and better controlled. It'd worth going to a pro audio shop and having a listen to some active monitors to see what you think.

Great first post BTW atticus.

 

[atticus]

Thank you to everyone who has contributed to this thread.

Active speakers seem to be a recurring theme throughout. I have an old friend who lives in Denmark and is rabidly pro-active speakers (haha). He uses AVI gear and is super keen on hearing the new ADM40S floorstanders that they will be releasing soon. Since I live just down the road from AVI HQ, he is keen to dispatch me to listen to them on his behalf (he will be FedEx-ing his ears to me). I am therefore put in the rather uncomfortable position of having to entertain the possibility that these 3K active speakers might sound better than my current 10K system.

Any views?

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Thank you to everyone who has contributed to this thread.

Active speakers seem to be a recurring theme throughout. I have an old friend who lives in Denmark and is rabidly pro-active speakers (haha). He uses AVI gear and is super keen on hearing the new ADM40S floorstanders that they will be releasing soon. Since I live just down the road from AVI HQ, he is keen to dispatch me to listen to them on his behalf (he will be FedEx-ing his ears to me). I am therefore put in the rather uncomfortable position of having to entertain the possibility that these 3K active speakers might sound better than my current 10K system.

Any views?

Hi atticus

It would not surprise me at all

Btw, if possible also try some ATC active monitors.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Craig M.]

I am therefore put in the rather uncomfortable position of having to entertain the possibility that these 3K active speakers might sound better than my current 10K system.

Any views?

it would not suprise me at all. i hear a pair of adm9.1s several times a week and they do nothing wrong at all, the 40s are supposed to be a fair bit better. on a certain forum with a lot of adm owners, there are quite a few owners who have traded multi thousand pound systems for them.

 

[Overdose]

If they are indeed better, then the bright side is that you could sell your kit and maybe have change after buying the new ADM40s.



I wish that I had the means to contemplate spending so much. They do look like an attractive proposition. Next step for me though, is a pair of exdem BM6A Mk IIs or a pair of well cared for Opals.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Any views?

There will be plenty of views. Everyone will have an opinion, but none of them will be right. These views and opinions won't really help you, only possibly alert you to one or two avenues that you may not have originally thought of. The only way you're going to find what it is you're missing is to audition.

 

[the record spot]

The ADM40s are at a late prototype stage I think, so for £3000 they'll probably turn in a pretty fine performance and given that current ADM9 (and variations thereof) owners rate them over gear costing many times more, then expect more of the same when the 40s come out.

All you'll need then will be a £30 supermarket player to plug in and off you jolly well go!

 

[John Duncan]

All you'll need then will be a £30 supermarket player to plug in and off you jolly well go!

And you were doing so well...

 

[the record spot]

Well JD, apparently in some quarters, that's the very ticket for some high end actives... :silenced:

 

[atticus]

Great to have so many views being aired and shared - thank you.

One point that has been mentioned by a friend and colleague who is an electronics and audio engineer is that while actives are superbly revealing and pinpoint accurate; the downside is that they can cause listening fatigue. This does concern me as occasionally I like an all-evening session. If I'm going to feel worn out after an hour or so, then this is no good to me. I will, of course, audition anything before final sale but would, once again, encourage your views....

 

[CnoEvil]

Great to have so many views being aired and shared - thank you.

One point that has been mentioned by a friend and colleague who is an electronics and audio engineer is that while actives are superbly revealing and pinpoint accurate; the downside is that they can cause listening fatigue. This does concern me as occasionally I like an all-evening session. If I'm going to feel worn out after an hour or so, then this is no good to me. I will, of course, audition anything before final sale but would, once again, encourage your views....

I always try to give recommendations that I believe will keep listening fatigue to a minimum....for me, it's the over-riding factor, as it stops people listening as often/long as they otherwise might.
It is subjective though..

 

[Anonymous]

I think the key part of that statement was "can caus e fatigue" I certainly wouldn't say this can be applied to all actives. Not something I encountered either.

 

[Anonymous]

I think the key part of that statement was "can caus e fatigue" I certainly wouldn't say this can be applied to all actives. Not something I encountered either.

 

[altruistic.lemon]

Interesting, isn't it? I can listen to friends (and me, albeit badly) playing acoustic guitar all night, but supposedly active speakers playing the same music would give the listener fatigue - who's kidding who?

Accurate seems to mean unlistenable.

 

[Craig M.]

Great to have so many views being aired and shared - thank you.

One point that has been mentioned by a friend and colleague who is an electronics and audio engineer is that while actives are superbly revealing and pinpoint accurate; the downside is that they can cause listening fatigue. This does concern me as occasionally I like an all-evening session. If I'm going to feel worn out after an hour or so, then this is no good to me. I will, of course, audition anything before final sale but would, once again, encourage your views....

the actives i've heard have shared the same type of natural sound, especially the mid range. personally, i think the lack of distortion from well sorted actives leads to zero listener fatigue. don't forget that studio bods, who have to listen all day, seem to do alright with actives. i think you'll see for yourself when you visit avi.

 

[altruistic.lemon]

So you think, for example, that Yamaha actives sound the same as Adams and Genelec?

If you read the pro and dj forums, you'll find that many find certain brands fatiguing. The fact a speaker is active doesn't automatically mean it will sound good.

 

[steve_1979]

One point that has been mentioned by a friend and colleague who is an electronics and audio engineer is that while actives are superbly revealing and pinpoint accurate; the downside is that they can cause listening fatigue.

I think that fatigueability (my new word) varies from speaker to speaker. I've heard both active and passive speakers that sound harsh and would cause listening fatigue very quickly. I've also heard both active and passive speakers that sound smooth and could be listened to for hours without any fatigue.

Accurate seems to mean unlistenable.

I generally find the opposite to be true. The more accurate a speaker sounds the easier it is to listen to for long periods.

 

[steve_1979]

The fact a speaker is active doesn't automatically mean it will sound good.

Agreed, I've heard some pretty terrible active speakers.

However, a good active speaker sounds better than ANY passive speaker and amplifier for the same price IMO.

 

[altruistic.lemon]

Prove it! I'll back my maggies against your AVIs any day

 

[Frank Harvey]

As a former Maggie owner, I'd like to see how that one turns out!