WHICH AMP WOULD BE RUN MY KEF REFERENCE 4.2

[admin_exported]

i am looking for a amp to run my kef reference 4.2 that i have just bought

i like old school music and drum and bass

thanks in advance

stuart

 

[Anonymous]

Im pretty sure David (FrankHarveyHiFi) will be along at some point to recommend Bryston as thats what he has advised me to be looking at for my KEF Ref 2s. Im guessing a 4Bsst would be ideal for your 4.2s

 

[CnoEvil]

You haven't mentioned a budget.

My suggestion would be to try Musical Fidelity M6 500i (500 wpc)

or if you have serious money - MF Primo + AMS50.

Regards

Cno

 

[MUSICRAFT]

i am looking for a amp to run my kef reference 4.2 that i have just bought

i like old school music and drum and bass

thanks in advance

stuart

Hi stuartwj

What amplifier are you currently using?

Your source component/s will be?

Is your preference for an integrated, pre/power or either?

Is there anything in particular which you would like the amplifier to have (remote control, mp3 input, headphone socket, phono stage, tone controls etc.)?

The size of your room?

Is the room lightly or heavily furnished?

Ceiling height?

Room floor (concrete, carpeted, wooden etc.)?

Your listening distance?

Your general listening level?

Any specific power requirements?

The speaker cables which you'll use?

Your overall budget?

What kind of presentation are you looking for the system as a whole to reproduce?

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Frank Harvey]

I'd ask the same as CnoEvil - are you working to a budget? I can recommend something within a budget, or I can recommend something that will do the job properly, which may not fit within the budget! Let me know and I'll let you know how I got on when I owned some 4.2's. Although, that may already be common knowledge :bigsmile:

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Hi Stuart

I hope you will not mind but just a few more questions

Will you be using the Boundary Compensation Device at all?

Will the speakers be used with spikes or with the feet?

Out of interest what finish are your Model 4.2's in?

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Anonymous]

forget budget just a list of your top 5 amps that will get the best out of the speakers

music is drum and bass and dance tunes with a good fast beat and i will be playing them loud

as for cd and so on lets just say a marantz 63 k sig for bad recording and lets say my linn majik ds for good recordings

as for cables and so on lets just keep it basic

so you top 5 amps for bass and drive would be great

thank you all again

stuart

 

[Frank Harvey]

The 4.2's are very efficient at 92dB, so don't really need a vast amount of power to get them going, but to make them rock takes something different entirely. They're a 4 way design utilising 6 drivers each, and impedance-wise are 4ohms so are very demanding. With two internal 10" bass drivers each, they need some serious current, and control.

I tried many amplifiers, from AV amplifiers like the DSPZ9 to dedicated hi-fi power amplifiers including Krell (which just didn't do what I expected with the KEF's). On a budget, I'd recommend the original Audiolab 8000P's or 8000M monoblocks, which have always worked well with KEF Reference, and you should find the new range will do too. Also, Quad amplifiers work well, a 909 would probably produce enough power for most people. A lot of older Musical Fidelity amplification worked well too - P180's and P270's always worked well with the 104/2's, producing buckets of power, but I always felt they lacked a little control, and produced a sound that was a little too warm for my liking. The new Cyrus X300 monoblocks are pretty special too - I've not heard them with the 4.2's, but after hearing them with 205/2's and 207/2's, they should work just as well with the 4.2's.

In the end I borrowed some Bryston 7Bst monoblocks. Almost 1,000 watts into 4ohms, each. This may sound excessive, but the dynamic capabilities of these monoblocks are truly stunning, and it doesn't matter how much you turn them up, they never change character. Lively (but smooth), controlled, dynamic, and neutral. Through good quality speakers, these amps never draw attention to themselves, and there's a lot to be said for feeling so at ease with these amps because whatever you demand of them, they'll supply it. Likewise the speakers. Every Reference model I've had have taken everything I've thrown at them - it doesn't matter how demanding the source material, nor how hard an amplifier drives them, they just get on with it.

At the time I'd got hold of a few DTS demo DVD's that included films and music, and of you ever want to hear some scary bass, try Insane Clown Posse - I don't think I've EVER heard such low bass so well controlled. If you've seen people's faces light up with glee when they hear their first real AV system, this will do the same for 2 channel.

At the time I couldn't afford them, and ended up buying a 3Bst. Treble and mod sounded fine, not too much of a downgrade, but the bass lacked in comparison. It seemed as though the bass had halved in comparison to the 7B's, although it was still tight and controlled. I think many people would be happy with a 3B, but if you really want to hear what the 4.2's are capable of, pick up some used 7Bst's, or even some new 7Bsst2's - with a 20 year warranty, you'll probably never need to replace them!! The 4Bsst2 is closer to the 7Bsst2 monos than the 3Bsst2 in sound and performance, and this is what I'd recommend as a minimum - a 4Bsst2. Earlier examples will be available on the used market.

I used my 4.2's in a room roughly 5m squared which had a carpeted concrete floor, and they were placed within half a foot of the front solid wall of the house, and I never had any issues with bass boom. Get an amplifier that will control the bass well enough, and you don't really need to worry about placement so much.

 

[Frank Harvey]

That was slightly messy - here would be my top 3 that I could vouch for without hesitation:

Bryston 7B monoblocks
Bryston 4B
Cyrus X300 monoblocks

The new Onkyo M5000R stereo power amp drives the 205/2's very well, so should be fine with the 4.2's, but this is a guess.

There's many power amps out there, and no doubt there's quite a few that will rival the Brystons, but I've not heard them.

 

[Thaiman]

Hi David, please don't take this in a wrong way (I am not disrespect your comment) but I think that list of amps above are overkill.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Do you have any experience of the 4.2's and what they're capable of?

Many people underpower quality speakers, and never gear what they're really capable of. I've just recommended what I found based on my own experiences. If I thought my recommendations were overkill, or not value for money, I wouldn't have made them. I can't stress strongly enough the sort of amplification these speakers need to give their best.

You know when you see people on forums saying certain high quality speakers sound harsh or rubbish? They've probably heard them with a 50 watt integrated amp, or some other unsuitable amplification.

Ask dogbait on the other forum, who has just bought 4x 7B's to drive his!

 

[Thaiman]

I have heard 25 watts mastersound 845 compact control my Sonus faber amati with total grip, My Mcintosh 275 is only 75 watts but have people shock with how well it can control a pair of 4 ohmes, 88dB speakers. I am sure the Bryston are very good (heard them with PMC a few time) and have enough power to control just about any speakers but 4 x 7B's??

 

[MUSICRAFT]

forget budget just a list of your top 5 amps that will get the best out of the speakers

music is drum and bass and dance tunes with a good fast beat and i will be playing them loud

as for cd and so on lets just say a marantz 63 k sig for bad recording and lets say my linn majik ds for good recordings

as for cables and so on lets just keep it basic

so you top 5 amps for bass and drive would be great

thank you all again

stuart

Hi Stuart

Thanks for your reply and fair enough.

If budget is not a concern then amplifiers to also consider for your Model 4.2's are (in no particular order)

Plinius Tautoro (pre amplifier) + Plinius SA - Reference power amplifier (x1) or 2 x SA - Reference power amplifiers (to bi-amp the speakers)

Chord Electronics CPA5000 (pre amplifier) + 2 x Chord Electronics SPM 6000 Mono Reference power amplifiers

Gryphon Sonata Allegro (pre amplifier) + Gryphon Antileon Signature stereo power amplifier

Krell Evolution 222 (pre amplifier) + Krell 402e stereo power amplifier

Plinius Hiato stereo integrated amplifier

I hope this helps.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[MUSICRAFT]

I have heard 25 watts mastersound 845 compact control my Sonus faber amati with total grip, My Mcintosh 275 is only 75 watts but have people shock with how well it can control a pair of 4 ohmes, 88dB speakers.

Hi Thaiman

I can see your point. As an example one of my clients uses a Krell FPB300 in preference to a FPB600 with his ATC SCM40 monitors. He can afford a FPB600 and accomodate the amp. The FPB600 powered and controlled the SCM40 monitors far more effectively compared to the FPB300 however he prefers the overall tonal balance/performance of the FPB300.

The quality and quantity of power are important factors to consider however all the control and power in the world will count for nothing if it doesn't also sound right to the end user/s of the system.

Btw, how do you find the overall performance of your McIntosh 275 compared to the ASR Emitter?

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[shooter]

I think the clues is in the heading!

Have a look at Musical Fidelity Stuart, the older KW series is good (550), class A/B switching. Forget the low powered Class A amp's, not enough grunt for you.

Bag's of power too control the Kef's leaving headroom for playing loud if you want. Unlikely you will find new but pre-owned prices are good.

 

[Anonymous]

at the moment i have a pair of kef reference 2.2 that i am running with a krell kav-300i i like the sound over the krell 400xi as it is more bass and treble and les mid which is how most of my music sounds

so i was looking of course to find a krell to do give me the same sound but more for my kef reference 4.2

so top of the pops is the bryston so far any more takers on this ?

if not thank you all again for your time

stuart

 

[Anonymous]

YOU COULD TRY ELECTROCOMPANIET.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Admittedly, 4x is a bit overkill! It's not so much about power, more about current capability and control - much of the time I'll use the term power in a general sense, but sometimes do mean current. There are some low powered amplifiers out there with a great deal of control, and will do a fine job. The new Onkyo M5000R is 80wpc into 8ohms on paper - doesn't sound a lot, but by God it's got some kick behind it! Great control and dynamics, and drives 205's just as well as a 4Bsst2 even though it's almost half the price. Unfortunately, it just doesn't sound quite as good as the Bryston. Beautiful looking power amp though, which I'd happily own. But let's not forget that your examples are Class A based, or valve based, which do possess different characteristics to Class A/B amplification. I have nothing against Class A - I love the Sugden A21se, but isn't something I'd be using in a Reference system. To me, it's no good putting a smooth warm amplifier on Reference speakers and taming their strong points.

 

[Thaiman]

I have heard 25 watts mastersound 845 compact control my Sonus faber amati with total grip, My Mcintosh 275 is only 75 watts but have people shock with how well it can control a pair of 4 ohmes, 88dB speakers.

Hi Thaiman

I can see your point. As an example one of my clients uses a Krell FPB300 in preference to a FPB600 with his ATC SCM40 monitors. He can afford a FPB600 and accomodate the amp. The FPB600 powered and controlled the SCM40 monitors far more effectively compared to the FPB300 however he prefers the overall tonal balance/performance of the FPB300.

The quality and quantity of power are important factors to consider however all the control and power in the world will count for nothing if it doesn't also sound right to the end user/s of the system.

Btw, how do you find the overall performance of your McIntosh 275 compared to the ASR Emitter?

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

ASR is all about sound floting effortlessly across the room and behide spakers (and spookly behide my head too), very very impressive amp but with all that voltage they suck out of main couple with safety cut circuit protection, it often trip my main (common problem I have been told). Mcintosh C275 is a very good power amp, it has kick and slam of big solid state but still have a touch (just enough) of valve romance in the top end and midrange that is very very close to a highend 300b amp.

 

[shooter]

at the moment i have a pair of kef reference 2.2 that i am running with a krell kav-300i

stuart

You can use the 300i as a pre if you want, have the tonal qualities of your amp with more power by adding a power amp.

The output's aren't balanced but single ended RCA.

 

[shooter]

ASR is all about sound floting effortlessly across the room and behide spakers (and spookly behide my head too), very very impressive amp

Yep my set up does this but i've never heard of ASR ive just called it holographic.

What does that abbreviation stand for?

 

[CnoEvil]

ASR is all about sound floting effortlessly across the room and behide spakers (and spookly behide my head too), very very impressive amp

Yep my set up does this but i've never heard of ASR ive just called it holographic.

What does that abbreviation stand for?

It is a shortening of ASR Emitter.

Cno

 

[shooter]

ASR is all about sound floting effortlessly across the room and behide spakers (and spookly behide my head too), very very impressive amp

Yep my set up does this but i've never heard of ASR ive just called it holographic.

What does that abbreviation stand for?

It is a shortening of ASR Emitter. Cno

Oh yea!

 

[Anonymous]

Since you specified that budget is not a concern, I would recommend Musical Fidelity AMS100. It is unlikely that you won't like this amp.