Total doofus addicted to spotify needs help

[DKennedy]

Hi guys,

I used to use spotify on my old laptop but its now time to upgrade. As the pc/mac/laptop is primarily going to be used for music I'm looking for something that suits. Ive already decided on the CA dacmagic but I'm having trouble deciding on the source. The macmini looks good but ive been told by a computer nut friend that "you are paying for the box".

My budget is £500-600. (not including the dac)

any suggestions please?

 

[idc]

I went with a Sony Vaio based on advice on this forum on a previous, similar thread. It is the VGN - NW20EF, which has probably been replaced with another model, but at £480 its specs met and in the case of hard drive exceeded the cheapest Apple laptop.

 

[Anonymous]

Well, it depends on a lot of things unrelated to sound quality.Where you want it positioned relative to the dac and the rest of the gear, do you want to rip, is it the only computer you will use, do you want to store music also, what about streaming, do you use wifi or a nas, dnla, do you mind leaving the sofa if you want to change your playlist, etc.

Anyway, I'd go for something that is really quiet, like the mac mini or a (possibly fanless) netbook.

 

[DKennedy]

Thank for the reply pete, I think my basic question is "if im running the signal through the DAC does the quality of the laptop/pcs sound matter, or is it bypassed?".

A little background , I have no real interest in having a computer other than sourcing music (bit of a ludite) but since discovering spotify its like being a kid in a sweet shop!

I'm more inclined to a laptop (possibly vaio as recommended by IDC ) for convenience but dont want to compromise on quality, as little as possible anyway. Although I'm on Wifi, the source will be dedicated to one system so im not interested in slingboxes (?). At the mo im running from my toshiba's headphone jack into my amp using a profigold cable that works well, but I assume it will be hdmi to hdmi with a newer laptop and that the DAC will need to be installed?.

 

[DKennedy]

Cheers IDC, im researching now ;0)

 

[DKennedy]

oops, i meant usb-usb

 

[idc]

The type of music file you use to store you music and which streaming service you use is more important to sound quality than the laptop. Any lossless format for files and Spotify Premium for streaming have the highest bit rates and so the highest sound quality. But and it is a big but, many cannot detect between bit rates higher than 320kbps and others cannot detect the difference in bit rates over the basic 128kbps. It is nice to know that you have the highest bit rate

Most DACs now have USB because USB is the most common connection on computers. I have a Sony Vaio with unbranded USB to a Firestone Fubar USB DAC to my amp. Superb.

 

[DKennedy]

I have spotify premium because of bitrate envy.

A mate has just offered to build me a media pc (he's into all that geeky stuff). So as you can imagine im quite chuffed

BUT could he build a dac into it? all the digital ins on my amp are taken up.

 

[idc]

The DAC in a PC is called the soundcard and it has other processing jobs to do with sound as well as digital to analogue conversion. On that issue, the DAC connects to the amp with phono (RCA) connections, not digital, so all you need are any phono inputs that are not for a record player or the tape out for recording onto a cassette.

 

[DKennedy]

Quote from my mate "if you have a decent sound card you wont need a dac".

is he right?

 

[Anonymous]

this it is rather circular, given that there are cards >>1000 euro/pound..

A pc's inner is a rather hostile environment for analog signals, so you need a card with good shielding. Check out a card like the Asus Xonar Essence STX, it also has a digital out so alternative connections are possible, and a headphone out that can be configured. It has the BB chips also used in the V-DAC, and according to the specs op-amps that can be upgraded if you are into that. Not cheaper than a separate (v-)dac though.

 

[idc]

DKennedy:
Quote from my mate "if you have a decent sound card you wont need a dac".

is he right?

Yes, though many would debate the sound quality from different sound cards and DACs. If you get an audiophile sound card where consideration has been given to the reproduction of music, I am sure all will be fine. My bog standard soundcards in various Sony and Dell laptops have all sounded poor compared to my DAC.

 

[Anonymous]

Look for a laptop or netbook that has an optical out. Zero interference, whereas USB, especially on a laptop, can be a bit of a problem.

 

[DKennedy]

thanks for the replies guys. Ive specified the Asus Xonar Essence STX soundcard.

my mate has suggested using this

http://www.zath.co.uk/asrock-ion-330-bd-review-home-media-centre-pc/

as a base and upgrading it, or sourcing the parts using the ASROCK specs as a guide to see if it can be done better for cheaper.

 

[idc]

Once you are done, some pictures of the new setup would be great

 

[DKennedy]

we are pricing it up today, ordering during the week and hopfully building on the W/end. I'l post the pics asap.

 

[DKennedy]

oh btw, my mate has just told me to point out that this isnt "high end tech time". I'm upgrading from laptop headphone socket->profigold cable->amp to media pc->amp (cambridge A5-wharfdale diamond 9s)

 

[DKennedy]

Damn and blast! we have run into a problem. The dimentions of the sound card (Asus Xonar Essence STX) > the media centre box!

I have 430x170x450mm (LxHxW) to play with but the ASUS is a couple of mm too big.

http://www.easypc-uk.com/htpc-media-centre-systems/112-core-i3-hdmi-media-centre-pc-system-htpc-full-1080p.html

Im pretty set on this pc because its already well spec'd for everything but music (and my mate says it will save him plenty of work).

can someone recommend an equally good (as possible) soundcard with slightly smaller dimensions?

 

[Anonymous]

Bummer, in what dimension? Both the PCI (ST) and PCI-express (STX) versions? It is a pretty big box so I am a bit surprised it does not fit.

 

[DKennedy]

LOL, soz but you've just spurred me to properly check the dimensions and what i mistook for width (see the way the dimensions of the box are, as posted from their website ) for hight. It was only when i got a ruler out and thought 19cm! thats a bit high for a few components? that I realised my mistake.

Ive also emailed easypc to see if they will swap the sound card out themselves and what kind of price they would be looking at, I'm waiting on their reply <hint hint any easypc people who may be passing through>.

Anyhoo, thanks for the reply

 

[Anonymous]

The audio is integrated on the motherboard (Realtek Azalia), so it would be adding not swapping. And in fact it has an optical digital out. You could order it as is, and see if the sound is good enough for you, and order the sonar later if needed. You do not have an optical input available in your amp?

 

[DKennedy]

Hi pete. Ive tried realtek on my old laptop and didnt like it. Also, no optical in on the amp.

We are having a major re-think right now because everytime something shiny is dangled in front of me (i-3) i say i want it and its getting silly. We are up to >£800 so far!.

The original challenge was to build a media centre with excellent sound for similar money to a laptop (£500 ish). Im pretty set on the soundcard as using spotify premium was the only real reason I want access to the internet (i have limited my internet use to only at work or a couple of hours Sat/Sun morning, because I found it was taking too much of my life away from actual face/face experiences).

So, we are going back to more basic/older components and starting again!

 

[DKennedy]

A: shameless bump!

B: ok, so Ive ordered this :-

spec'd to http://www.easypc-uk.com/htpc-media-centre-systems/112-core-i3-hdmi-media-centre-pc-system-htpc-full-1080p.html

CORE i3 HDMI MEDIA CENTRE PC SYSTEM HTPC Full 1080p 1TB 7200RPM 32MB , Windows 7 Premium 64bit , Blu Ray ROM, Digital TV Card + Remote, 1-Year RTB, USB 54g Wifi

and "Asus Xonar Essence STX" which my mate will fit, thanks pete10 for the advice. The reviews ive read are all excellent.

so Im guessing the sound should be pretty good.

however, I noticed the "how to get most from windows " thread but dont really understand most of the words.

can someone give me a quick point-by-point in how to set up windows 7 to prioritise the sound reproduction? I will mostly be using spotify but I have heard of "flacs" (?) and am intrigued. I also use last.fm occasionally and the odd you-tube track if im being particularly obscurantist (can anyone tell me why The Cramps: Smell of Female, isnt on spotify anymore?).

Thanks for all the help so far guys

 

[idc]

About the only thing I know of with W7 is control panel - hardware and sound - change system sounds - sounds - sound scheme - set to no sounds. Then maximise the volume on Spotify and the PC and use your amp to control the actual volume. That minimises distortion.

In Spotify go to edit - preferences - sound and see if there is any difference with checking/unchecking enable hardware acceleration and volume normalisation. I uncheck normalisation and check hard ware acceleration. If you have premium also check enable higher bit rate.

FLAC is a form of lossless music file, like Apple Lossless. Spotify uses Ogg Vorbis, which a compressed file, but I find it sounds as good as lossless in the higher premium bit rate and still very good in the lower bit rate.

Spotify gets and loses licenses to play music as publishers buy and sell the rights they have and contracts are negotiated. So you can find some bands come and go on the site.

 

[DKennedy]

Thanks Idc. I noticed that "smell of female " was recorded at a NY music venue so maybe there is a licence issue.