Hey Guys! As i may of mentioned in another thread i am in the process of downsizing my system. Having sold my Eclipse speakers and Kw550 amp i have been looking for a smaller system. I have brought a Cyrus 8XPD and have been demoing speakers today. My Shortlist for the speakers was: Dynaudio focus 110 Spendor SA1 Proac D1 Kudos x2 I started off with the X2 and liked the sound. The soundstage was suprisingly large and the detail was also good. I found the bass to be very good but on some of the music you could hear they were struggling to make the lowest frequencies. They also have a slightly forward treble that was not to my taste but overall i was very impressed with them. I thought that they could have imaged a bit better too. Dynaudios next and i really liked the warmth of the sound, however in almost every other area i was sorley dissapointed. The sound clearly came from speakers and they did not "disapear" as they should do. The bass was overwhelming and also uncontrolled. Overall i really liked the treble but every thing else made me want to quickly move on to the next speaker. It is very possible that the 8XPD amp was having trouble controlling them. Finally I heard the Proac D1s. These were by far the best speakers i heard all day. Imaging was spot on, fantastic timing and detail. Bass was also good - accurate and tight. In a different league to the Dyns IMO. Although i really really like the sound, there is one problem. I heard the spendor SA1s a while back and loved the sound. This essentially made them my first choice and the demoing was to see if they could be knocked off. Basically its a very very close call from what i remember of the spendors. The proacs are slightly more forward and do more bass. The Spendors Image better and i prefered the mid range. They are a close call. Unfortunatly i could not demo them side by side and this is somthing my dealer is arranging for later in the week. Its going to be close and it may even be decided by asthetics with the spendors being MUCH nice looking. If anyone thinks i have missed out a compact speaker that i should also definatly audition please let me know...
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System Downsize Demoing...
- Thread starter SHAXOS
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Hi,
Im looking at the D1 with Cyrus kit as well and have a demo later in the week. Did they sound to forward with the cyrus amp or were they quite smooth and releaxed?
Anymore information on them would be great. How far away from the rear wall did you have them when demoing?
Cheers,
Phil
Im looking at the D1 with Cyrus kit as well and have a demo later in the week. Did they sound to forward with the cyrus amp or were they quite smooth and releaxed?
Anymore information on them would be great. How far away from the rear wall did you have them when demoing?
Cheers,
Phil
The ATC SCM 7 is apparently excellent for the money. There's also the Harbeth P3ESR if you can find a place to demo them. Apparently they're a bit more forward then the SA1s so they might not suit you tastes on the end of a Cyrus.
Dali Menuets?
Naim nSat? - possibly not a great match
Dali Menuets?
Naim nSat? - possibly not a great match
Thanks for that Iggle. Ill have a look into the Minuets. Not too keen on the ATC just for asthetic reasons but i should probably take a listen to them also.
The D1s were excellent with the Cyrus kit. To my ears they were more forward with their presentation than the spendors but thats not to say they were bright (i hate bright music). I absolutely enjoyed there performance and if i had to take spendor or the Proac i think i would be happy either way. I look forward to the side by side demo as this will help clarify things further.
The D1s were excellent with the Cyrus kit. To my ears they were more forward with their presentation than the spendors but thats not to say they were bright (i hate bright music). I absolutely enjoyed there performance and if i had to take spendor or the Proac i think i would be happy either way. I look forward to the side by side demo as this will help clarify things further.
How small? Budget? Quadral Pico, Mission 751, Audiosmile Kensai, Genelec 8030A, or 8040A (I'd be all over a demo of those before spending a penny on anything else - stunning for the money).
Gerrardasnails
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the record spot:How small? Budget? Quadral Pico, Mission 751, Audiosmile Kensai, Genelec 8030A, or 8040A (I'd be all over a demo of those before spending a penny on anything else - stunning for the money).
RS, I think he's looking above the £1k range so the Mission 751s and co might be a bit out of their league.
RS, I think he's looking above the £1k range so the Mission 751s and co might be a bit out of their league.
Quadral Pico - £750
Mission 751 - revealing as hell at £300 20 years ago, a mint example now £100 and new would be around £600 or so
Audiosmile Kensais - £2000
Genelec 8030 - £800/£1200 and the best performance out of the lot of them. Stunning speakers for the money.
IMO, none of the above are out the question - depends what the OP's after, how much they want to spend, how small they want to go when they talk about downsizing and without sacrificing quality. None of the above will disgrace a shortlist and they're a change from the usual ATC/PMC selection that seems to be prevalent for any box over £500.
Mission 751 - revealing as hell at £300 20 years ago, a mint example now £100 and new would be around £600 or so
Audiosmile Kensais - £2000
Genelec 8030 - £800/£1200 and the best performance out of the lot of them. Stunning speakers for the money.
IMO, none of the above are out the question - depends what the OP's after, how much they want to spend, how small they want to go when they talk about downsizing and without sacrificing quality. None of the above will disgrace a shortlist and they're a change from the usual ATC/PMC selection that seems to be prevalent for any box over £500.
To Be fair, the speakers he is looking at or tried are a big step up from the ones you have added above. The missions were budget ones then and would be way down the list now.
Im looking forward to trying the proac and spendors hopefully the end of this week or beginning of next week.
Keep us informed if you try the spendors side by side soon.
Phil
Im looking forward to trying the proac and spendors hopefully the end of this week or beginning of next week.
Keep us informed if you try the spendors side by side soon.
Phil
plastic penguin
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Ordinarily, I would suggest Dynos with Cyrus but the price on the Focus 110s have shot through the ceiling. As an alternative, maybe B&W 805s might be worth a listen...
Both are very good speakers, but the 805's need quite a bit of grunt to get them going. Cant remember if the OP has had them before or not...
The 805's are quite deep so need a good bit of room behing them. Gorgeous speakers though.
The 805's are quite deep so need a good bit of room behing them. Gorgeous speakers though.
plastic penguin
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potboyslim:Both are very good speakers, but the 805's need quite a bit of grunt to get them going. Cant remember if the OP has had them before or not... The 805's are quite deep so need a good bit of room behing them. Gorgeous speakers though.
Understandable - the reason I mentioned them is the B&Ws front firing ports which would make them easiler to place. Also, I think the Cyrus id either 70 or 80 watts per channel so shouldn't have too much trouble in controlling the B&Ws.
Edit - just checked the B&Ws sensitivity and it's 88dbs, so unless you're looking to entertain the neighbourhood, they should be fine.
Understandable - the reason I mentioned them is the B&Ws front firing ports which would make them easiler to place. Also, I think the Cyrus id either 70 or 80 watts per channel so shouldn't have too much trouble in controlling the B&Ws.
Edit - just checked the B&Ws sensitivity and it's 88dbs, so unless you're looking to entertain the neighbourhood, they should be fine.
Gerrardasnails
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the record spot:Quadral Pico - £750
Mission 751 - revealing as hell at £300 20 years ago, a mint example now £100 and new would be around £600 or so
Audiosmile Kensais - £2000
Genelec 8030 - £800/£1200 and the best performance out of the lot of them. Stunning speakers for the money.
IMO, none of the above are out the question - depends what the OP's after, how much they want to spend, how small they want to go when they talk about downsizing and without sacrificing quality. None of the above will disgrace a shortlist and they're a change from the usual ATC/PMC selection that seems to be prevalent for any box over £500.
RS, do you rate any new equipment? Everything you suggest has some miles on the clock.
Mission 751 - revealing as hell at £300 20 years ago, a mint example now £100 and new would be around £600 or so
Audiosmile Kensais - £2000
Genelec 8030 - £800/£1200 and the best performance out of the lot of them. Stunning speakers for the money.
IMO, none of the above are out the question - depends what the OP's after, how much they want to spend, how small they want to go when they talk about downsizing and without sacrificing quality. None of the above will disgrace a shortlist and they're a change from the usual ATC/PMC selection that seems to be prevalent for any box over £500.
RS, do you rate any new equipment? Everything you suggest has some miles on the clock.
Ive owned 805S is the past fantastic speakers but i KNOW my amp will not get the best out of them. Also they are certainly too large for my needs.
Does any one know the WB square ones stack up in a small room? Ive heard them in medium sized rooms and was impressed.
Does any one know the WB square ones stack up in a small room? Ive heard them in medium sized rooms and was impressed.
Frank Harvey
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The Square Ones didn't come close to the Square Twos in the way that a standmount version of a floorstander should. If you like the Ones, you'll love the Twos, which can be used in the same size rooms. The only drawback of the WB's is that they sound bad with indie type music - they're not all rounders.
potboyslim:To Be fair, the speakers he is looking at or tried are a big step up from the ones you have added above. The missions were budget ones then and would be way down the list now.
Phil
Er, the Missions at the time were a step up from the budget variants of the day (which were typically £100-150) and at £300 were nearer the midrange. You want budget? Go for Gale Mini Monitors, JPW and their like for budget of the day. The 751s outperformed for their price, but let's put them to one side as they are likely not to be up there (supposedly).
The list targets speakers in the £1k bracket, depending on where you buy from £950-£1500 at the highest retailer. I guess that means the Audiosmile Kensai is out as it's now a £2k speaker (and a "big step up" from the ones listed originally IMO), and I guess actives are out as they're, ah, actives so the amp would need to go. The Pico's out because it's been discounted on price alone and no matter how good it is (once described as one of the best mini-monitors for under £1k a couple of years back). Where does that leave us and, indeed, the OP?
Ah, the usual suspects...it's getting tired guys...the shortlists have some nice boxes on them, but wow...the opportunity to consider some others gets shouted down.
Phil
Er, the Missions at the time were a step up from the budget variants of the day (which were typically £100-150) and at £300 were nearer the midrange. You want budget? Go for Gale Mini Monitors, JPW and their like for budget of the day. The 751s outperformed for their price, but let's put them to one side as they are likely not to be up there (supposedly).
The list targets speakers in the £1k bracket, depending on where you buy from £950-£1500 at the highest retailer. I guess that means the Audiosmile Kensai is out as it's now a £2k speaker (and a "big step up" from the ones listed originally IMO), and I guess actives are out as they're, ah, actives so the amp would need to go. The Pico's out because it's been discounted on price alone and no matter how good it is (once described as one of the best mini-monitors for under £1k a couple of years back). Where does that leave us and, indeed, the OP?
Ah, the usual suspects...it's getting tired guys...the shortlists have some nice boxes on them, but wow...the opportunity to consider some others gets shouted down.
I think the problem is, RS, that it gets very difficult to audition speakers of the more esoteric brands. As you point out, many are over a k too.
Fair comment mate - apologies for the temperamental post guys. Posting at lunchtime on the back of a bunch of work issues that land on the desk when they ought to be sitting on someone else's WAY further up the food chain probably don't mix too well...
You know what they say, the guys at the top of the tree pass it down the tree until it lands on our desks. Thats the way management works, they get paid to dump on us ;-)
potboyslim:You know what they say, the guys at the top of the tree pass it down the tree until it lands on our desks. Thats the way management works, they get paid to dump on us ;-)
Actually, I don't work for the company I'm with just now - kind of a hired hand as it were, being self-employed. However, you'd be surprised if you knew, or were involved in the industry. Not to put too fine a point on it either...and I'll leave it at that I think!
Actually, I don't work for the company I'm with just now - kind of a hired hand as it were, being self-employed. However, you'd be surprised if you knew, or were involved in the industry. Not to put too fine a point on it either...and I'll leave it at that I think!
If your not employed by them then no worries, keep smiling at them and take it all with a pinch of salt.
Anyway back on track, so whaen do you do the direct comparison with the SA1's and the Proac?
Heard the proac and they worked better than expected near a rear wall as there were no side wall reflections to contend with as well. This made for no need with the bass port bungs!
Let me know how you went with the SA1's, but Im leaning towards the Proac. The Gf still wants the spendors as they do and always will look better. I told her my woodworking skills were not that good so making stands was a bit to much for me, as I couldnt form the metals and buy zebrano finish over the counter. Once again she responded with "dont B&Q sell it......" priceless me thinks. Lucky she is an absolutely lovely lady and one hell of a looker ;-)
Anyway back on track, so whaen do you do the direct comparison with the SA1's and the Proac?
Heard the proac and they worked better than expected near a rear wall as there were no side wall reflections to contend with as well. This made for no need with the bass port bungs!
Let me know how you went with the SA1's, but Im leaning towards the Proac. The Gf still wants the spendors as they do and always will look better. I told her my woodworking skills were not that good so making stands was a bit to much for me, as I couldnt form the metals and buy zebrano finish over the counter. Once again she responded with "dont B&Q sell it......" priceless me thinks. Lucky she is an absolutely lovely lady and one hell of a looker ;-)
Waiting for my local dealer to get back to me. He had to get in the SA1s from another store. Once he does ill do a side by side demo and let you know what i think...
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