No cotten wool here . . . !!!

[CJSF]

. . . 8) I came home early from work today, car trouble, looks like I'm gonna have to buy a new car!!! 203,000 miles is a lot, the repair is going to be more than the car is worth . . . Ho-hum, I needed a bit of cheering up . . . On my desk, a couple of parcels, one was a new Jamie Oliver 30 minute cook book I ordered for Hazel . . . the other, my patiently awaited 'HRT DAC Streamer' :bigsmile:

Plug in, self install . . . first Pink Floyd, 'Dark side of the Moon' . . . ?? a bit flat :~ . . . have I made a mistake? I had turned the Rotel on to warm up, it needs 20 minutes of music, but flat it was . . . Let the music play, slowly I started to hear a change, the DCA was running in! Went back to track 4; 'Time' . . . wow!!! those clocks, they came at me individually, with the bell harmonics ringing like never before, very HiFi I know, but I like a bit of electronic fun sometimes. Twenty-five years ago 'Dark Side' was a mind blowing experience . . . and still living up to my memories with knobs on!!! Leading edges across the sound spectrum were defined, razor sharp, but not glassy, 3.30mins in to the track, the guitar rift is just amazing, tight, steely and loud! then the waling female voice, underpinned by layers of instruments I had never before been aware, very powerful, but at no time was the system distressed, despite a 2 o'clock volume knob!

I moved on to Jimmy Nail, listen to Jimmy a couple of days ago, distortion, hard, I could not listen long then. This time, the distortion was redefined as a nasally sound to his voice with a distinct Norther twang. And so to something a little more delicate, Jennifer Warnes followed by a Linn down load of Carol Kidd, one can only say sublime, musical, articulate, with Carol standing directly in front of the speakers singing just for me . . .

Finally, The Tallis Scholars, Allgri Miserere, and Peter Hurfords organ; JS Bach, Toccata and Fugue in D minor. Miserere I have listened to hundreds of times in my previous life on top quality equipment. Imaging was not as good, down to the scratch system! . . . but the layers, articulation, echo decay and tonal stability were outstanding. By this time I had goos bumps, the Toccata was just mind blowing, I have said before, it takes a good system to hold on to it . . . My scratch system with HRT DAC simply got on with the music, to the point where I had to turn the volume down out for consideration to the neighbours!!!o Good bumps had now turned into mountains J)

I have read the various descriptions and reviews on £100-£200 DAC's, there seems to be a sort of 'cotton wool' theme running through them . . . almost to much control, over smooth? No cotton wool here, to me, it allowed the various styles, colours and musicality to shine, not to much of anything, but certainly enough to make me feel like I have the right combination for the time being . . . The Rotel will be my amp for a while . . . new car comes first; my means of making a living these days . . .

CJSF

 

[Anonymous]

Glad you like it. Quite simply the HRT is the nuts and great value for money. I have had mine for quite some time now and it still impresses me daily. I am just playing the Black album by Metallica and Kirk Hammetts guitar is ripping. What a sound!

 

[Anonymous]

oh yes , and definitely no cotton wool. Just very clear and precise music.

 

[BenLaw]

Congratulations! I love it when a new piece of kit lives up to expectations

 

[Sizzers]

Great synopsis! Came across this elsewhere and was mightily impressed from all I've read. Sad it's only USB.

 

[Anonymous]

I think its simplicty is its why it works so well. They have concentrated on doing one thing really well.

 

[Sizzers]

I think its simplicty is its why it works so well. They have concentrated on doing one thing really well.

Couldn't agree more.

I'd been toying with the idea of getting a DAC to try out with my BDP but nothing within that price range seemed worth it. No probs; that's life so got another CDP on the way instead.

 

[Mr Morph]

. . . 8) I have read the various descriptions and reviews on £100-£200 DAC's, there seems to be a sort of 'cotton wool' theme running through them . . . almost to much control, over smooth? No cotton wool here, to me, it allowed the various styles, colours and musicality to shine, not to much of anything, but certainly enough to make me feel like I have the right combination for the time being . . . The Rotel will be my amp for a while . . .

I am enjoying following your return to hi-fi CJ! I have also had the impression (from people’s comments on here, and my experience with the Denon’s internal DAC) that some of the DACs and CDPs are far too controlled for their own good. However I guess one mans ‘not exciting’ is another mans ‘peaceful and relaxed’. So I’m glad you’ve found something that suits your taste, and would expect it to get even better as it runs in, and it’s great to see old amps and new kit blending so well. I remember you saying elsewhere that your speakers weren’t set up optimally, so I think once you get that sorted, you’ll get a lot of the imaging back again. Out of curiosity, did you listen to anything else before you purchased the HRT, and if so, what did the competition sound like in comparison?

I was listening to Allegri’s Miserere playing on Classic FM (DAB) a while back (probably not the same version). I have the tuner patched into a dedicated dual mono D/A converter, via its electrical digital coax. Couldn’t believe the resolution of the soundstage (1:1 scale), which made the rear wall of my room disappear, and the complete acoustic of a cathedral with full height and depth materialise in its place. What really shocked me was that I was sitting outside of the sound field at the time (to the right of it, completely off axis). And I just sat there again, with my jaw open, thinking ‘this is why I don’t upgrade!’ Great piece of music!

 

[CJSF]

. . . 8) I have read the various descriptions and reviews on £100-£200 DAC's, there seems to be a sort of 'cotton wool' theme running through them . . . almost to much control, over smooth? No cotton wool here, to me, it allowed the various styles, colours and musicality to shine, not to much of anything, but certainly enough to make me feel like I have the right combination for the time being . . . The Rotel will be my amp for a while . . .

I am enjoying following your return to hi-fi CJ! I have also had the impression (from people’s comments on here, and my experience with the Denon’s internal DAC) that some of the DACs and CDPs are far too controlled for their own good. However I guess one mans ‘not exciting’ is another mans ‘peaceful and relaxed’. So I’m glad you’ve found something that suits your taste, and would expect it to get even better as it runs in, and it’s great to see old amps and new kit blending so well. I remember you saying elsewhere that your speakers weren’t set up optimally, so I think once you get that sorted, you’ll get a lot of the imaging back again. Out of curiosity, did you listen to anything else before you purchased the HRT, and if so, what did the competition sound like in comparison?

I was listening to Allegri’s Miserere playing on Classic FM (DAB) a while back (probably not the same version). I have the tuner patched into a dedicated dual mono D/A converter, via its electrical digital coax. Couldn’t believe the resolution of the soundstage (1:1 scale), which made the rear wall of my room disappear, and the complete acoustic of a cathedral with full height and depth materialise in its place. What really shocked me was that I was sitting outside of the sound field at the time (to the right of it, completely off axis). And I just sat there again, with my jaw open, thinking ‘this is why I don’t upgrade!’ Great piece of music!

With that sort of Imaging I'll put a pound to a penny it was the 'Tallis Scholars' version, its a classic . . . it was originally released on the 'Hallmark' budget label, my viynal copy is/was a Hallmark pressing? not sure if I kept it when I 'dropped out' :~ in 95, and dumped my 2000+ record collection. I forgot, I'd keep a few 'quality'? LP's that I found the other day, grubbing around in the loft for the speakers and Rotel amp . . . begs the question, do I get a turntable at some point . . . depends on if I can source a digital remaster/download of the better ones, food for thought in the future?? A few were also kept for possible value?? I know I have an original double disc copy of 'War of the Worlds' complete with the picture folder that went with it, I value it anyway . . .

DCA comparisons? no, I read the various on line guff a couple of times, put 2+2 together =5! . . . 'over control, cotton wool', seemed to be indicated, taking the life out of the music. There are recordings that have colour, deliberate distortions . . . If one likes them or not is beside the point, thats what there, let it be! I went through this in my previous life, over damping was so common, producing lifeless performances. I want reality in my listening sessions. I choose the style of music engineered on the recording to my mood at the time, all one way, for instance 'laid back' is as boring as continuous destorted heavy metal!!!

Dark Side of the Moon, is a classic of mood, style, highs, lows and colour, all in the space of 40 minutes!!!

Ah well, I can relax now, the very sick, old car, has been retired, bought a top of the range 'Balingo Multi Space' this afternoon, and not a DAC or CD in sight, nice and laid back, boring dark grey . . . Put the brakes any more major new HiFi pucheses for a while . . . but . . .!!! the Croft hybrid amp is still at the back of my mind. I will still be going to audition it in July, renewing an old friendship with a guy I have not seen for 20 years . . . he wants me to get back in harness . . . ?
CJSF

 

[CJSF]

Just a thought Morph . . . If you want a copy of 'Tallis Scholars Miserere' its available as a high quality down load from the Linn site . . .

Interesting you say 'off axis', while I have been playing about with the scratch system, my Hazel, who did not know me in my previous life and she is far from any sort of audiophile. She could, on the better recordings, especially 'Miserere' hear the imaging whilst she was in the kitchen which is the room at the back of my study with a normal adjoining door, the speakers backing on to the dividing wall . . . 8)

CJSF

 

[Mr Morph]

Cool, subterranean imaging! I like that...

Well, I have a Minidisc recorder and have been known to take music by force... !!! From wherever I find it, you might say... It's amazing what quality I can actually acheive from my somewhat outdated system, as long as I press the record button at the right point! In fairness, my musical taste sounds similar to yours. Indeed, Floyds Dark Side, Wish You Were Here, The Wall, Final Cut, etc... are all in my CD collection. Presumably you've heard Roger Waters 'Amused To Death' by now?

My taste is firmly, but not always, stuck somewhere between 1975 and 1995, which means I had to make my hi-fi backwards compatible, lol. However, you've probably noticed by now that I come from the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it' school of thought, if only because I've heard too many people lament in tears about the component they sold, and desperately regret it.

But the real question on my lips appears to be, what made you leave the scene in the first place and trash 2000 albums? I mean, you can tell by my signature that I only returned to get a tuner a couple of years back, and then started to get into classical! Up until then, I had forgotten how worked up over hi-fi some people can get. So this forum often puts a smile on my face at some of the more hyped aspects of this ludicrous and obsessive hobby.

And that Miserere was incredible, I mean just how often can you claim to have a Cathedral at the end of your living room!

 

[CJSF]

And that Miserere was incredible, I mean just how often can you claim to have a Cathedral at the end of your living room!

I used to have that 'Cathedral' in my garden at least a coupe of times a week, (yeah, the walls disappeared) usually lights out, perhaps a night cap, two fingers up the glass :~ just the orange glow of my EAR valve monos dimly lighting the speakers.

. . . 'Part of an experience' that sends tingles running up my spine even now, 20 years on . . .

Trashing a whole load of records, and equipment, I had two G36 reel to reels, put a hammer through them both! 20 years of collecting obliterated in one day! . . . I had to take 'it' out on something ( been painful ever since! Putting my life back together again at last?? Getting my values in order from the mess that I called a life . . . loads of mistakes???

Cant say I can recall 'Amused to Death' I will Google it?

Classical music, I love the well known 'classics', but find the rest a bit hard going on occasions. However, not only do I have my late Fathers amplifier, but a couple of box fulls of classical CDs that constituted his 'music collection'. Off work now until Thursday when I pick up the new car . . . so, plenty of time to set to, rearrange my study and dig out mine and his CD collection . . .

Basics have not changed so much, people still dont trust their ears, just cos its expensive dont mean its better :| . . . . my cynical hat, left that back in the 80's J) . . . Thats my story any way . . .

New life, approaching 'gods waiting room', just one more year, enjoy the simple things in life, Gardening, photography, music and a spot of trout fishing . . . there is a piece of classical music call 'the Trout', I will have to find it, see if dads got it in his collection?

Whats all that got to do with HiFi . . . not a lot? accept it all goes to make part of a pleasant, relaxed and in the end, fulfilled life? for me and the one I love

The hardest thing of all is getting to grips with the new digital world? Great when I understand something but, so, so frustrating, getting there?

Sorry Morph, a bit melancholy ain't I . . . looking forward to tomorrow, making a start on transforming the room CJSF

 

[CJSF]

Roger Waters; 'Amused to Death' . . . Tracked it down live on Y-Tube . . . I dont think it was very HiFi, but that did not seem to matter, I enjoyed the visual experience, very 'Floid' like as one would expect. The over whelming thing was the 'performance', no one artist was trying to out perform the other, the drummer was using his hand . . . atmosphere oozed . . . another one of those tingles up the spine moments. I will definitely search it out on iTunes or Spotify for a HiFi quality performance.

Thanks for the heads up Morph . . . CJSF

 

[Mr Morph]

Trashing a whole load of records, and equipment, I had two G36 reel to reels, put a hammer through them both! 20 years of collecting obliterated in one day! . . . I had to take 'it' out on something ( been painful ever since! Putting my life back together again at last??

CJSF

Conjures up all kinds of images, like the wife getting involved with a 'sound engineer' (apologies in advance if I'm close to the truth on this one, lol)

Basics have not changed so much, people still dont trust their ears, just cos its expensive dont mean its better :| . . . . my cynical hat, left that back in the 80's J) . . . Thats my story any way . . .

CJSF

Ah, a real audiophile, and not someone who thinks they can spend their way out of trouble... A rare breed indeed!

there is a piece of classical music call 'the Trout', I will have to find it, see if dads got it in his collection? Whats all that got to do with HiFi . . .

CJSF

Shubert?

And 'Amused to Death', you'll need to have your speakers a couple of metres apart, it's recorded in something called Q-Sound, and beyond that I'm saying nothing. Of course you'll have to put up with Mr Waters depressingly honest and sometimes bitter lyrics, but what else is new?

 

[CJSF]

Yep, I got to listen to Mr Waters at his most depressing this morning . . . But came to the same conclusion, for 'Amused to Death' the system has to be working better . . . but worth going back at that time!

Sorry Morph, women were not the problem, although I did loose my dear wife Kathy to cancer around the time which did not go down so well ( . . . 26 very happy years, nearly 30 if you include the time courting, yeah very old fashioned, we used to court in those days . . . Water under the bridge . . . gone but definitely not forgotten . . . as Kathy said; "life goes on, enjoy" . . . that hurts to remember that statement, even now . . .

Way laid this morning, was going too start the 'music room' transformation . . . a phone call and red tape put pay to that, needed to attend to urgent 'jobs worth' paperwork in respect of the new car

So, I got to listening whilst pushing the pen. Job finished, I had wandered into some very old music. Back in time to the 40's, 50's and early 60's. :~

I started to listen and think, as a system it was sounding great, engaging, musical. Certainly not HiFi as we know it? whats going on??? Flanagan and Allen, Tennessee Ernie Ford, Jim Reeves, Patsy Cline, George Beverly Shea . . .

Come to the conclusion, no electronics (alar modern digital etc) to get in the way. Lots of the tunes I had heard on the old Danset and later on my earliest Bush stereo player. Its a bit like vinyl recordings, get the system working properly and the inevitable frying bacon can be almost ignored . . . it will certainly remain confined to the speakers not encroaching on the sound stage.

I have wasted the whole afternoon, simply listening to a purity of sound, articulation and natural colours rarely heard in 'modern' recordings because they are to busy and so often interfeared with? The other side of the coin, is listening to the 'HiFi system', leading edges, razor sharp, proper base lines as clean as you like (plucked base fiddle) rolling around the room.

The biggest problem has been keeping away from 'digitally remastered tracks' ugh! Ernie Ford was the best, so clean and some early stereo recordings. Flanagan and Allen was surprising for the quality of such old originals, Patsy Cline has been a problem, very poor quality but I found a few OK.

So refreshing, listening to the system showing the unspoiled tracks then switching the mind to automatic, listening to the music for its own sake. I remember an old HiFi dealer friend showed me this trick many years ago. We had tea at his house, listened to his then, state of the art, all mission system. He dug out a few old mono vinyls, no image obviously, it was like the musicians (he was into jazz) lined up one behind the other, yes there was a perceived depth. As they played their solos, it was as though they popped a few feet out of line . . . as I say, part of my education that I still remember clearly to this day.

I recon there is a wealth of good music locked up in these old recordings. Its a bit like old films, a story you can follow, beginning, middle and end . . . modern films, all bang and crash and a week story at best . . . that cynic is coming out again.

Listen to and enjoy the music . . . CJSF

 

[Mr Morph]

I was very sorry to hear about Kathy, and having lost too many people in my life I sadly know how that feels. But life does go on mate, and I know they wouldn’t want us dwell on it. Cherish her memory, and what you had, because regardless of whether these things happen for a reason, we have to deal with them all the same.

Well then, it seems we’ll have to find you some better equipment capable of reproducing Mr Waters in all his depressing glory! So where does the problem lay, I wonder? Is it speaker imaging, or that amp not layering the soundstage correctly? What’s your best guess? But then this is the fun of hi-fi, isn’t it? In many ways I envy you, because although my journey ended some time ago, there is still part of me that wants to play ‘the game’ again. And deep down you must be itching to get back into the swing of things.

And I agree with you about the modern media thing, if they can mess up a classic like ‘The Day the Earth Stood Still’, and fail to convey the original meaning of what it was about, what else are they capable of? Didn’t think they could mess a simple story like that up, but sure enough everyone who saw the remake couldn’t understand why it ended before it even began. My brother still hasn’t recovered from it! Ooops… Now who’s rambling?

 

[CJSF]

I was very sorry to hear about Kathy, and having lost too many people in my life I sadly know how that feels. But life does go on mate, and I know they wouldn’t want us dwell on it. Cherish her memory, and what you had, because regardless of whether these things happen for a reason, we have to deal with them all the same.

Well then, it seems we’ll have to find you some better equipment capable of reproducing Mr Waters in all his depressing glory! So where does the problem lay, I wonder? Is it speaker imaging, or that amp not layering the soundstage correctly? What’s your best guess? But then this is the fun of hi-fi, isn’t it? In many ways I envy you, because although my journey ended some time ago, there is still part of me that wants to play ‘the game’ again. And deep down you must be itching to get back into the swing of things.

And I agree with you about the modern media thing, if they can mess up a classic like ‘The Day the Earth Stood Still’, and fail to convey the original meaning of what it was about, what else are they capable of? Didn’t think they could mess a simple story like that up, but sure enough everyone who saw the remake couldn’t understand why it ended before it even began. My brother still hasn’t recovered from it! Ooops… Now who’s rambling?

The equipment is in a heap at the moment, perched on top of a shelf stack, speakers are 4ft off the floor with 18" between them, its a wonder they work a all! Imaging is not so good but the musical layers and tonal colour are OK, the sense of speed and musical edge is just fine. I have to re do the study, which will be this coming week, off work utill Thursday. Proper stands, I have a pair of the original Foundation Designer stands, to go with my folded horn speakers, get rid of all the detritus and all will be well???

The Rotel has an amazing feel about it, despit its budget origins, which I am prepared to exploit for a while along with the HRT DAC and some very special phono cables I have kept over from my previous life. The fly in the ointment may be the A-B USB cable conecting computer to the DCA . . . no point in playing with any of this fine tuning untill I have got the basic room sounding musical in its new guise.

Soon going to see a friend who does Croft amps along with various others. Glenn Croft does an integrated hybrid valve/mosfet amp., that is the dogs swingers, so I'm told? . . . punching way above its £850 price tag? I like the idea of pairing it up with the HRT DAC's 'crisp control' . . . the valve pre's precision 'signal in section' floating like a butterfly, and the power of the mosfets, stinging like a bee!! That could be one hell of a combination?? I'm getting to sound like a '...phile' again!!!

My speakers are one off's, designed to do what an LS35a does with the folded horn giving a base response to die for. The folded horn is housed in the double height 35a size cabinet, they were designed to make use of the solid 'Designer stands'.

All how it used to be, unfortunately the Rotel 820, good though it is, does not match the original EAR valve mono blocks, valve pre and Townsend Rock, with trough, Excaliber arm and de-nuded Ortofon P2 cartridge. I used 'all' this to produce that final in home sound with imaging that could melt walls, a musicality that was capable of beguiling the listener at any volume as well as shake your teeth out if one felt like being a bit generous with the volume. Not even going into the the room acustics . . . "mad, Ive always been mad . . . ".

Its all coming back :~ I'd forgotten about the madness we indulged in . . . can I, do I want to reproduce that sound??? . . . I'll do my best, but I have a cut off this time, both financially and me personally as an individual . . . I want to enjoy music of all types for its own sake, simple as that. I'm an audiophile who has learned a lesson.

CJSF

 

[Shanka]

Hi CJ,

Glad you are happy with your hrt musicstreamer II, getting one myself, can't wait !

Did you try it with Spotify yet, would be interested in what you thought.

Sounds like your still having fun tho'

 

[CJSF]

Hi CJ, Glad you are happy with your hrt musicstreamer II, getting one myself, can't wait ! Did you try it with Spotify yet, would be interested in what you thought. Sounds like your still having fun tho'

Seems to work with Spotify OK . . . I had a grate session Friday on Spotify, went back to the 40's, 50's and 60's . . . find the original recordings not digitally remastered!!! no,no,no . . . the musicality, involvement and tactile nature from some of those original tracks is superb . . . IMHO No imaging of course, but a sense of depth . . . some are really poor, Patsy Cline tracks were espcialy bad! on the other hand, Tennessee Ernie Ford was particularly satisfying.

CJSF