Naim Streamers

[Shanka]

Happy New Year to all

I am still unsure on a choice of Dac and have been looking at streamers, I have heard the M1 Clic which used as a dac is for me the best I have heard so far.

My other considerations at this point would be Linn Majik DS /M and from Naim the ND5XS or NAC172XS which brings me to my question.

The 172XS seems to offer a lot more functions, inputs, higher sampling rates than the 5XS but the 5XS is nearly £500 more, am I missing something out here, I may be starting the new year by displaying more than my usual stupidity if so my apologies, but why would I go for the 5xs over the 172 XS.

Also out of curiosity has anyone heard any of the three streamers together, (Naim, Linn, MF) any thoughts, comparisons, I think it will probably come down to personal taste and I will be on tour soon to find out for myself but any views hugely appreciated.

Thanks again for reading and any input is welcome.

 

[jjbomber]

Or for similar money you can use the Naim UnitiLite to stream and act as a DAC. That then gives you a CD player and integrated amp.

 

[Ketan Bharadia]

I've heard both Naim ND5 and 172XS and prefer the way the ND5 sounds. To my ears it is more expressive and detailed. The 172XS is cheaper, of course and has more in the way of features. The basic sonic character is similar, though.

Linn makes terrific streamers. The ones I've heard have a more analytical sound than the Naims. The choice does come down to taste.

 

[acalex]

I've heard both Naim ND5 and 172XS and prefer the way the ND5 sounds. To my ears it is more expressive and detailed. The 172XS is cheaper, of course and has more in the way of features. The basic sonic character is similar, though.

Linn makes terrific streamers. The ones I've heard have a more analytical sound than the Naims. The choice does come down to taste.

I have a Linn Akurate DS and can say that the Linn Majik is the best value for money...especially knowing it can be had for less than 15oo euro second hand. I personally don't think it sounds analytical but I haven't compared to Naim to be honest. For me is the most analog sounding piece of kit I have experienced so far

But all the Linn DS streamers left me a bit cold whenever I heard them within a full Linn system (not active).

 

[BigColz]

The ND5 XS is a stunning bit of kit IMO.. The most analogue sounding bit of kit i've heard, couldn't believe digital files could sound so natural.. I like to keep my source and amplifier sections seperate.. I believe the Linn DS's don't have any digital inputs so you couldn't add a CD transport/TV/Mac/Xbox etc. They seem a pain to set up with different software etc whereas the Naim just works out the box and sounds amazing. They both get rave reviews in magazines, on websites and by people on here... Go and audition both as it will come down to taste :cheers:

 

[Ambrose]

Or for similar money you can use the Naim UnitiLite to stream and act as a DAC. That then gives you a CD player and integrated amp.

Just something my dealer commented when discussing Uniti 2 and Unitilite was "Is Uniti 2 better"? Has more power and go but the lite is more agile sounding. Andrew also raved about the Lite I believe.

A chap when I was a dealer was apparently agonising over which uniti to go for!

However was suggested that seperates still give a bit more than the uniti's and power supplies were mentioned as a factor.

I have never really heard the Uniti's myself however.

Ambrose

 

[acalex]

The ND5 XS is a stunning bit of kit IMO.. The most analogue sounding bit of kit i've heard, couldn't believe digital files could sound so natural.. I like to keep my source and amplifier sections seperate.. I believe the Linn DS's don't have any digital inputs so you couldn't add a CD transport/TV/Mac/Xbox etc. They seem a pain to set up with different software etc whereas the Naim just works out the box and sounds amazing. They both get rave reviews in magazines, on websites and by people on here... Go and audition both as it will come down to taste :cheers:

I confirm there are not digital inputs on the DS which I don't think is too bad as I will only use this kind of streamer to stream my lossless files to my reference system. I won't use any of the 2 channels equipment for home theater so not a big deal for me.

The set-up of Linn was flawless, up and running in no time.

 

[BigColz]

The ND5 XS is a stunning bit of kit IMO.. The most analogue sounding bit of kit i've heard, couldn't believe digital files could sound so natural.. I like to keep my source and amplifier sections seperate.. I believe the Linn DS's don't have any digital inputs so you couldn't add a CD transport/TV/Mac/Xbox etc. They seem a pain to set up with different software etc whereas the Naim just works out the box and sounds amazing. They both get rave reviews in magazines, on websites and by people on here... Go and audition both as it will come down to taste :cheers:

I confirm there are not digital inputs on the DS which I don't think is too bad as I will only use this kind of streamer to stream my lossless files to my reference system. I won't use any of the 2 channels equipment for home theater so not a big deal for me.

The set-up of Linn was flawless, up and running in no time.

Yeah all depends on what the OP is after and which sound he prefers.. Eventually i'll have a Listening/gaming/movie room 2.1 so I wanted the inputs.. Good to hear it was setup quickly :cheers:

 

[acalex]

The ND5 XS is a stunning bit of kit IMO.. The most analogue sounding bit of kit i've heard, couldn't believe digital files could sound so natural.. I like to keep my source and amplifier sections seperate.. I believe the Linn DS's don't have any digital inputs so you couldn't add a CD transport/TV/Mac/Xbox etc. They seem a pain to set up with different software etc whereas the Naim just works out the box and sounds amazing. They both get rave reviews in magazines, on websites and by people on here... Go and audition both as it will come down to taste :cheers:

I confirm there are not digital inputs on the DS which I don't think is too bad as I will only use this kind of streamer to stream my lossless files to my reference system. I won't use any of the 2 channels equipment for home theater so not a big deal for me.

The set-up of Linn was flawless, up and running in no time.

Yeah all depends on what the OP is after and which sound he prefers.. Eventually i'll have a Listening/gaming/movie room 2.1 so I wanted the inputs.. Good to hear it was setup quickly :cheers:

Makes sense indeed.

I think I might just use the speakers probably with home theater and buy an AV amplifier where I will connect also iphone/ipad docks for casual listening/parties (as SQ wouldn't matter so much in these cases 😀)

 

[BigColz]

The ND5 XS is a stunning bit of kit IMO.. The most analogue sounding bit of kit i've heard, couldn't believe digital files could sound so natural.. I like to keep my source and amplifier sections seperate.. I believe the Linn DS's don't have any digital inputs so you couldn't add a CD transport/TV/Mac/Xbox etc. They seem a pain to set up with different software etc whereas the Naim just works out the box and sounds amazing. They both get rave reviews in magazines, on websites and by people on here... Go and audition both as it will come down to taste :cheers:

I confirm there are not digital inputs on the DS which I don't think is too bad as I will only use this kind of streamer to stream my lossless files to my reference system. I won't use any of the 2 channels equipment for home theater so not a big deal for me.

The set-up of Linn was flawless, up and running in no time.

Yeah all depends on what the OP is after and which sound he prefers.. Eventually i'll have a Listening/gaming/movie room 2.1 so I wanted the inputs.. Good to hear it was setup quickly :cheers:

Makes sense indeed.

I think I might just use the speakers probably with home theater and buy an AV amplifier where I will connect also iphone/ipad docks for casual listening/parties (as SQ wouldn't matter so much in these cases 😀)

I have a 10 year old Cambridge Audio 540a + 540c in my living room.. You could prob pick up a 540a for under £100 and it has a great sound entertaining sound for partys etc.. I'm thinkin of gettin a sonos connect eventually.. Need a NAS first! For now I just use CD player or iPod cable :rockout:

 

[CnoEvil]

Linn makes terrific streamers. The ones I've heard have a more analytical sound than the Naims. The choice does come down to taste.

I have a Linn Akurate DS and can say that the Linn Majik is the best value for money...especially knowing it can be had for less than 15oo euro second hand. I personally don't think it sounds analytical but I haven't compared to Naim to be honest. For me is the most analog sounding piece of kit I have experienced so far

But all the Linn DS streamers left me a bit cold whenever I heard them within a full Linn system (not active).

This would coincide with my findings.

In a Linn System, or probably any more analytical sounding system it can come across that way (nb. analytical in the way of clean and detailed, rather than forward). Certainly, in a Class A or Valve set up, imo it sounds far from this.

 

[acalex]

The ND5 XS is a stunning bit of kit IMO.. The most analogue sounding bit of kit i've heard, couldn't believe digital files could sound so natural.. I like to keep my source and amplifier sections seperate.. I believe the Linn DS's don't have any digital inputs so you couldn't add a CD transport/TV/Mac/Xbox etc. They seem a pain to set up with different software etc whereas the Naim just works out the box and sounds amazing. They both get rave reviews in magazines, on websites and by people on here... Go and audition both as it will come down to taste :cheers:

I confirm there are not digital inputs on the DS which I don't think is too bad as I will only use this kind of streamer to stream my lossless files to my reference system. I won't use any of the 2 channels equipment for home theater so not a big deal for me.

The set-up of Linn was flawless, up and running in no time.

Yeah all depends on what the OP is after and which sound he prefers.. Eventually i'll have a Listening/gaming/movie room 2.1 so I wanted the inputs.. Good to hear it was setup quickly :cheers:

Makes sense indeed.

I think I might just use the speakers probably with home theater and buy an AV amplifier where I will connect also iphone/ipad docks for casual listening/parties (as SQ wouldn't matter so much in these cases 😀)

I have a 10 year old Cambridge Audio 540a + 540c in my living room.. You could prob pick up a 540a for under £100 and it has a great sound entertaining sound for partys etc.. I'm thinkin of gettin a sonos connect eventually.. Need a NAS first! For now I just use CD player or iPod cable :rockout:

Yes but with a good AV amplifier I could also connect my TV through HDMI, get a center and create a surround system for home cinema. The only problem I need to solve is the cable switching to speakers. I still haven't found a good solution for that...

 

[Shanka]

Hi,

Thanks for all the replies.

Have been trying to get demos organised today which has flagged up a few points and to ask a few more based on responses.

I have been advised that the Naim products won't give their best performance as I am not using other Naim equipment and not using the best path by not using their din plugs, is this a fair point ?

The 172xs gives me the better options regarding overall connectivity so I may be missing out a little bit from the 5xs but it would integrate all the components I wish to connect ( NAS,Virgin, SBT, dvd/bluray),the MF Clic also has the connectivity I need.

For me to get this with the Linn DSM it will be out of my budget.

I have booked a demo with the Naim and MF for later this week and have been offered a very good price for a Clic so again I am leaning this way.

Unfortunately I can not demo the Naim products with my equipment but am currently working on that.

Thanks again for all your help.

 

[jerry klinger]

I've had some experience of Naim streamers (but by no means exhaustive!).

The ND5XS and NDX are a serious level above the 'all in one' streamers I've heard - the Uniti and the Qute, and I would expect the 172 to be on that lower level too. The stand alone streamers can be upgraded in various ways which is where owning Naim becomes very expensive. I found the XP5XS added to the ND5XS sounded better than the NDX on its own. I also didn't like the DAC in comparison.

One little known fact is that Naim are the only streamer to provide Radio Paradise at 320kbps. Sounds great.

I tried the NAD C446 and would rate it about 75% as good as the ND5XS on most sources. But of course that 25% could be worth paying 3-4 times the price for you! Law of diminishing watsits.

Bear in mind that Naim DACs and streamers don't provide USB-B inputs for laptops etc. Also you have a Caspian M2, a great amp - getting a 172 will take you down the Naim amp route, also very expensive!

 

[BigColz]

Hi, Thanks for all the replies. Have been trying to get demos organised today which has flagged up a few points and to ask a few more based on responses. I have been advised that the Naim products won't give their best performance as I am not using other Naim equipment and not using the best path by not using their din plugs, is this a fair point ? The 172xs gives me the better options regarding overall connectivity so I may be missing out a little bit from the 5xs but it would integrate all the components I wish to connect ( NAS,Virgin, SBT, dvd/bluray),the MF Clic also has the connectivity I need. For me to get this with the Linn DSM it will be out of my budget. I have booked a demo with the Naim and MF for later this week and have been offered a very good price for a Clic so again I am leaning this way. Unfortunately I can not demo the Naim products with my equipment but am currently working on that. Thanks again for all your help.

Naim fan boys will tell you Naim works better with Naim and the DIN sockets are superior, which they may be with other Naim components but you have to ask yourself if you want other Naim components.. It works extremely well through the phono outputs to other amps. I've heard it with several. If you were to get the 172xs would you be using it as just a streamer/DAC? Or using the Pre amp section too? Personally I'd connect the NAS through the Network and SBT and TV digitally..

 

[BigColz]

I've had some experience of Naim streamers (but by no means exhaustive!).

The ND5XS and NDX are a serious level above the 'all in one' streamers I've heard - the Uniti and the Qute, and I would expect the 172 to be on that lower level too. The stand alone streamers can be upgraded in various ways which is where owning Naim becomes very expensive. I found the XP5XS added to the ND5XS sounded better than the NDX on its own. I also didn't like the DAC in comparison.

I agree 100% on everything you've said here..

 

[Shanka]

Thanks for the info, as you are using Naim with your Roksan do you think you are losing some of the component performance by not matching it with a Naim amp ?

I am very aware of getting sucked into the world of Naim, did you try other streamers/dac's with your amp before you settled on Naim (apart from the NAD)

I have heard the Clic on two demo's with the Roksan and thought it sounded great on both occasions, easily out performing the dacs I was listening to.

Thanks again for the reply.

 

[Shanka]

Big C,

I would be using just as a dac/streamer connecting the components mentioned and feeding into the Caspian for all amp duties.

Thanks

 

[BigColz]

Big C, I would be using just as a dac/streamer connecting the components mentioned and feeding into the Caspian for all amp duties. Thanks

Ok cool.. I know it wasn't in this reply but you seriously don't need to worry about 'loosing performance' as it's not matched with other Naim components thats total BS.. Source and Amplifier sections are completley seperate and you may not get the 'synergy' you want but thats for your ears to tell.. The phono connection is more than good enough. The only time i'd say that is a valid point would be if you used a Naim pre Amp with a different power amp which could def compromise performance (it may not even be possible as they use weird connectors between them) and this is why I asked how you would use the 172xs.. I found the ND5 a no brainer once I heard it and compared with others but as said you may be happy with one considerably cheaper.. :cheers:

 

[Shanka]

Thanks for that, will see how the demo goes.

The guy who said this didn't stock Roksan but he could still try and sell me the Naim for £500 more than the Clic.
Unless I head to the midlands again is going to be difficult for me to demo the Naim/MF with the Caspian but I want to check how it all works and sounds.

Not many dealers seem to stock Roksan and Naim in London,the other point as stated earlier is a fear of getting Naim'd could be expensive.

 

[BigColz]

Thanks for that, will see how the demo goes. The guy who said this didn't stock Roksan but he could still try and sell me the Naim for £500 more than the Clic. Unless I head to the midlands again is going to be difficult for me to demo the Naim/MF with the Caspian but I want to check how it all works and sounds. Not many dealers seem to stock Roksan and Naim in London,the other point as stated earlier is a fear of getting Naim'd could be expensive.

Sevenoaks stock all three and have a few stores around London.. Again don't believe all this get 'naim'd' nonsense like it's some crazy addiction.. You're buying a source.. A streamer.. Naim and Linn IMO are the only two choices at this price point.. If you like the Naim streamer, you buy it, you install it, you enjoy it.. There are upgradable options yes.. The power supply can bring good upgrades but that doesn't mean you have to rush out and buy one.. I may buy one in a few years if I upgrade the rest of my kit if I feel the performance justifys the cost. The DAC IMO is pointless because it defeats the object of the all-in-one box that works so well and the digital output only goes to 96khz.. Either way it sounds amazing as it is and there's no NEED to upgrade at all.. So don't let that even be a facor.. I didn't get along with the Naim amp sound at all and I almost didn't try the streamer as I wasn't so keen, but boy am I glad I did! Same with Linn a lot of people don't like their amps but love there DS's.. Your spending a lot of cash you should do a side by side if you can.. I'm sure there's at least a few shops in london that stock those items.. :cheers:

 

[Shanka]

Hi,

Well am planning to listen to MF alongside the Naim this week and see if the Naim justifys the extra outlay, have also heard from someone who may be able to bring a Naim to my house to work with my set up which would be fantastic.
Will find out if he can get his hands on one tomorrow.

I was very underwhelmed with the xs amp when I heard it, esp. as I thought the 5i was a cracker but the xs was not a big enough improvement but I do like the Naim sound so I shall find out by the end of the week.

It is a shame the Linn will not work out for me as am very keen to hear the ds and there is a dealer near me who does Linn and Naim but don't want to get tempted into silly money.

Sevenoaks don't do the naim streamers just mainly the uniti range as was onto them earlier.

Thanks again for all the feedback, much appreciated.

 

[acalex]

Hi, Well am planning to listen to MF alongside the Naim this week and see if the Naim justifys the extra outlay, have also heard from someone who may be able to bring a Naim to my house to work with my set up which would be fantastic. Will find out if he can get his hands on one tomorrow. I was very underwhelmed with the xs amp when I heard it, esp. as I thought the 5i was a cracker but the xs was not a big enough improvement but I do like the Naim sound so I shall find out by the end of the week. It is a shame the Linn will not work out for me as am very keen to hear the ds and there is a dealer near me who does Linn and Naim but don't want to get tempted into silly money. Sevenoaks don't do the naim streamers just mainly the uniti range as was onto them earlier. Thanks again for all the feedback, much appreciated.

Are you ready to buy second hand? I have a good friend of mine who is selling his Majik in perfect conditions for 1300 euro. The second hand market for Linn DS streamer is very active and you can get a great deal if you know where to look and have patience. I might ask my friend if his Majik is still available. I was getting that before I was offered a even sweeter deal on the Akurate DS...

 

[BigColz]

If you like the Naim sound you should hear the superuniti.. I was really impressed with it.. Big step up from there other integrateds IMO and I think the streamer DAC section isn't far off the ND5.. If you could find one second hand/ ex dem you'd have an all-in-one solution that you can add your digital inputs too.. Just a thought to throw a spanner in the works :rofl:

 

[CnoEvil]

Usually one is drawn to either the Linn Sound or the Naim sound...so it's worth hearing both through a system as close to what you are going to use as possible.

Though saying that, there are people who have Linn Streamers on Naim systems, and vica versa.