That's a good point. I have put it in mains sockets after allGray said:
Too careful when it comes to previous hifi.
newlash09
Well-known member
insider9 said:
All going well, I plan replicate same in my system too, and see what power I really need too...
Really, you need to get out more. Fot a start there's never going to be one volume setting on the amp that equates to one Watt of output, it's always going to vary depending on the volume level of the source material. If you're curious as to how loud one Watt sounds on your speakers, you could try buying one of the cheaper Japanese amps from the 80s which had fluorescent volume meters on them and hit it with a 1kHz sine wave. If your speakers' sensitivity is over say 88db it will actually be so loud it will surprise you, and like me you will wonder why some people insist you need 100WRMS+ amps in a 15'x12' living room because anything less is not powerful enough.
Diamond Joe
Well-known member
At the last Bristol show Wilson Benesch had some power amps which displayed the power output in watts, I'd never seen that before and I have to say I was a bit surprised how low the output was at times even at sufficient levels! If I can find a picture I might be able to work out the make, give me a while...
Diamond Joe
Well-known member
Found 'em! *biggrin*Diamond Joe said:
I was a lttle bit wrong, it was only one power amp but it was a CH Precision A1 (slightly north of £20k mind you, ouch!)
Gray
Well-known member
As one myself I say why not play about? But bear in mind what others have said about meaningless results / conclusions.
Allowing for all test limitations though, I wouldn't expect insider's sensitivity result to be a million miles from the the manufacturers specifications. (He may prove me wrong)
Use only AC voltage range and don't switch through other multimeter ranges with it connected to your terminals.
Allowing for all test limitations though, I wouldn't expect insider's sensitivity result to be a million miles from the the manufacturers specifications. (He may prove me wrong)
Use only AC voltage range and don't switch through other multimeter ranges with it connected to your terminals.
Once again people are conflating average power, peak power and percieved volume.
The first thing that you need to understand is that percieved volume is a function of the average spl (power). Ie average power/spl determins how loud something is.
VU and similar meters found on amplifiers usually measure average power.
So, let us take a speaker with a fairly low real world sensitivity, I watt will produce around 82-84dB spl, pretty loud but probably not deafening.
Then take a good recording where on music the peak power is 20dB above the average (mean) power, in this case 1 watt average power wll include 100 watt peaks, ok so far?
Then add some 'headroom', let's say a relatively modest 6dB (many commentators suggest 10dB), 6dB up on 100 watts is 400 watts peak which will require an amplifier capable of a shade over 300 watts rms.
This is pretty rough and ready, but gives an idea of the issues.
Note for party animals, getting a few people in the room, chatting and soaking up power will raise power requirements even more rapidly, be aware.
The first thing that you need to understand is that percieved volume is a function of the average spl (power). Ie average power/spl determins how loud something is.
VU and similar meters found on amplifiers usually measure average power.
So, let us take a speaker with a fairly low real world sensitivity, I watt will produce around 82-84dB spl, pretty loud but probably not deafening.
Then take a good recording where on music the peak power is 20dB above the average (mean) power, in this case 1 watt average power wll include 100 watt peaks, ok so far?
Then add some 'headroom', let's say a relatively modest 6dB (many commentators suggest 10dB), 6dB up on 100 watts is 400 watts peak which will require an amplifier capable of a shade over 300 watts rms.
This is pretty rough and ready, but gives an idea of the issues.
Note for party animals, getting a few people in the room, chatting and soaking up power will raise power requirements even more rapidly, be aware.
steve_1979
Well-known member
Shall give it a go tomorrow. Will post results.[/quote]
I'm going to give it a go as well. If I never post here again I've probably been electrocuted.
It been a pleasure knowing you guys.
insider9 said:
I'm going to give it a go as well. If I never post here again I've probably been electrocuted.
It been a pleasure knowing you guys.
TonyL on pfm recently did some measurements with a sound meter. He accepted the manufacturers sensitivity specification. He found that most of his listening the troughs were at about 55dbs, the average 65 to 70 dbs and the dynamic peaks 80 to 85 dbs. And that was listening at levels that he thought were loud. This equated to one ten thousandth of a watt up to below 1 watt for his listening.
If he were to add a crazily generous 10 to 12db headroom for parties and just in case, he'd need a 10 watt amplifier at most.
If he were to add a crazily generous 10 to 12db headroom for parties and just in case, he'd need a 10 watt amplifier at most.
I would find 82 db average listening levels with 102 db peaks the sort of volume that would leave my ears ringing after one track. I don't like having ringing ears.
After I put acoustic treatment that lowered reverberation and eliminated early reflections I had to increase the volume by 6dB to get to same levels as before treatment.
insider9 said:
I prefer a lively room. Only the damn 70Hz boom ruins it for me and nothing else.
I'm quite used to low reverberation. Cleaner, more detailed sound, more dynamic as you can actually listen louder and not be deafened by the sound. It sounds more expressive. Enjoy it a lot but the most important was to even out decay throughout frequency spectrum which worked out really well.Vladimir said:
BigH
Well-known member
insider9 said:A number of points actually - how do these correspond to specs? - how loud is it actually at 1W of power? - what amp setting (volume) corresponds to 1W? - what minimum amp required to run the speakers?nick8858 said:
All of the above and trying to estimate at what continuous power I'm listening to. And whether if I come across a cheap low powered Class A amp I should try it, or not
But it will vary depending on the music or are you playing a contineous sound. Even so it could vary bewteen different sourcs, I don't see how you can get an accurate reading to compare with the manufacturers specs. Then there is the room this will have a large effect also.
Al ears
Well-known member
BigH said:insider9 said:A number of points actually - how do these correspond to specs? - how loud is it actually at 1W of power? - what amp setting (volume) corresponds to 1W? - what minimum amp required to run the speakers?nick8858 said:
All of the above and trying to estimate at what continuous power I'm listening to. And whether if I come across a cheap low powered Class A amp I should try it, or not
But it will vary depending on the music or are you playing a contineous sound. Even so it could vary bewteen different sourcs, I don't see how you can get an accurate reading to compare with the manufacturers specs. Then there is the room this will have a large effect also.
Agreed, a pointless exercise. Are you going to dispute manufacturers figures ....or just get on with listening to music.?
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