Add Origin Live arm to LP12 or replace with OL deck?

steve4232

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Hello, I have a slight dilemma and wondered if anyone could help me by throwing any light on my current situation. I have an existing LP12 turntable that has been upgraded with an Origin Live Advanced DC motor / power supply / high-end transformer. This was carried out in late 2010 at a cost of over £500. The original Valhalla board blew up so it was time to replace / upgrade. I have not turned back since. I love the look of the OL product line and the DC motor is quite an upgrade to the LP12.

However my deck (originally of 1985 origins) only has a MkI Akito tone-arm and K9 cartridge. I have recently bought an Ortofon Blue cartridge to replace the old K9, which in itself is over 20 years old - the deck has been effectively moth-balled from 1995 through 2010 though. The stylus is probably ok as it hasn't had much use but I still wanted to renew and upgrade and the Ortofon was recommended. As this won't fit easily onto the old Akito AND I do realise now that the Akito was only a budget arm I have been considering replacing the arm in order to fit the Blue and to give the deck an upgrade. Obviously I am thinking about OL arms and getting a new arm board.

My question is: would I be better to simply sell off the lordly old LP12 and start again with a brand new OL deck and arm? Advances in t/table engineering appear to have been significant since the Lp12 was designed over 40 years ago. OL make an Aurora deck for £999 which has had great reviews including from this magazine. Would it outperform my current LP12? OL arms start at £300 and then proceed to £450 and £675 and then skyrocket in prices. Would the Silver II arm at £675 fitted to my LP12 be better than a new Aurora deck with £300 OL arm. Allowing for arm boards, tweaks and everything the first option would cost me about £845. The second option about £1200 not including the re-sale value of a complete working LP12 to offset against that. Which way should I tackle this? Any ideas?

Ultimately I don't want to make a gross outlay more than about £2000. The next best OL deck could probably be permitted within budget but only with the cheapest arm option.

What are the other alternatives? Should I stick doggedly to retention of the LP12 with new arm and attach my Blue to it?
 

nima

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Keep the Sondek. Get Roksan Nima (GBP500). If your LP12 doesn't have the Cirkus kit, consider one. Cikus bearing was big improvement decades ago, the new Cikrus kit also comes with the new and much improved standard subchassis form last year (the price of new standard, sometimes called Majik subchsiss alone is GBP300). Curent price of Cirkus kit is GBP800 (with the new subchassis). Find a respected Linn dealer and book a demo.
 

steve4232

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Thanks for the comment. I have no idea if I already have the Cirkus upgrade. I doubt it on a 1985 deck somehow. How would I know? I'm a bit puzzled though by the implication that the sub-chassis and bearing should be replaced / upgraded. If I'm already changing the arm / arm-board, what will be left of my "original" LP12 apart from the ash plinth, platter and a perspex lid? Am I not all but starting again? It seems like a lot of money to still have the same deck albeit modified?
 
Steve

Upgrading a Linn is a bit like the story about the broom that lasted 40 years, and has had 7 handles and 12 heads! I sold my Linn of similar provenance just over a year ago, and the seller got well over a grand on eBay with the original arm and cartridge. He sells decent hifi for a living and reckons complete decks sell better than separate tt, arm and cartridge sales.

A basic Linn is now well over two grand with a Pro-ject arm, and they hold their value like almost nothing else in hifi, IMO. I'd already got my Michell so I wasn't changing it for that reason. You'd have more headroom to improve with a Linn, and it will always be easy to sell on as long as you don't do anything weird to it, but your OL would maybe be easier to live with and you'd not always be wondering what to tweak, so I think it is more about your outlook than outright SQ! I don't sense that OL is widely appreciated beyond the cognoscenti and hence hard to sell and likely to drop in price. Just my observations looking at used ads and eBay.
 

davedotco

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I feel it boils down to whether you can get any money for your LP12 setup.

If you can get a reasonable return then a new player would be really nice, if not an arm upgrade would be my choice.

You have a nice mm cartridge, decide if you want better and try and have a few words with OL, try and get a recomendation from Mark (Baker) if you can.

Have not spoken to him in nearly 20 years but he was always affable and tremendously helpful, then if you can, logistics wise, get them to fit the arm and check out the player overall. Any (LP12 based) player sounds better after a bit of TLC from someone who knows what he is doing..... 8)
 

nima

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steve4232 said:
Thanks for the comment. I have no idea if I already have the Cirkus upgrade. I doubt it on a 1985 deck somehow. How would I know?

You probably don't (it was introduced in 1993).

steve4232 said:
I'm a bit puzzled though by the implication that the sub-chassis and bearing should be replaced / upgraded. If I'm already changing the arm / arm-board, what will be left of my "original" LP12 apart from the ash plinth, platter and a perspex lid?

Not much: things you name + baseboard + steel top plate (new suplatter is also included in Cirkus kit)

steve4232 said:
It seems like a lot of money to still have the same deck albeit modified?

Only you can find an answer to that: find a good Linn dealer and run your LP12 against a modern one fitted with new standard subchassis, preferably also fitted with Roksan Nima.
 

steve4232

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Thanks, guys, for all the helpful reponses! :)

I did actually speak to Mark Baker yesterday. I agree that he is a really helpful and friendly voice over the phone. The thought I had was to go down to Southampton to see him, get a demo and either come away with a new deck altogether or simply a new tone-arm on my LP12 with Blue attached. Mark suggested that a demo could be set-up for me to hear the improvments his decks have made over earlier designs.

It's a pity that there aren't any local dealers to me for either Linn or Origin Live. I agree that OL especially seems to be a word of mouth reputation and one of the Uk's best kept hi-fi secrets.

I will investigate the Nima tone-arm as well although I'm doubtful of being able to hear one given the scarcity of dealers in my locale.

I agree "nopiano" that I have a choice between selling a working deck of some repute and buying a complete alternative that won't be giving me the upgrade blues all the time versus retaining the Linn with upgraded arm that might also be more saleable in future than a less well known OL piece.
 

steve4232

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By some coincidence I've just found an IDENTICAL spec LP12 in a YouTube video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoR82IHPhbc

Same OL PSU (Advanced), Akito I, K9, even same black ash smooth plinth!
 

davedotco

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I think the most important thing here is the dealer.

Players of this type and quality do need to be looked after properly, OL are pretty good at what they do, whether dealing with modded LP12s or their own product.

Concentrate on what they suggest and what they can offer. They will do it right and that is important, more important than fretting about other arms etc.

Think of it as an holistic approach, good product, good advice, good service, adds up to more than the sum of the parts.
 

steve4232

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"I think the most important thing here is the dealer.

Players of this type and quality do need to be looked after properly, OL are pretty good at what they do, whether dealing with modded LP12s or their own product.

Concentrate on what they suggest and what they can offer. They will do it right and that is important, more important than fretting about other arms etc.

Think of it as an holistic approach, good product, good advice, good service, adds up to more than the sum of the parts."

Very well said, Dave. I totally agree.
 

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