I noticed in this months WHF that there are at least ten articles, some of them full reviews on ipod or mp3 player reviews. Isn't this a little concerning, seeing as surely most people that subscribe to the magazine buy it for Hi fi news/revews etc and agree that ipods are in no way hi fir, nor are small mp3 players. surely other magazine types such as stuff, t3 etc are better placed to carry such articles, would it not be nice to have more actual Hi-Fi reviews instead?
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When should you upgrade your hi-fi? How to control ‘upgradeitis’
Worrying plethora of ipod type reviews
- Thread starter Terryff
- Start date
It's a much bigger issue than normal - so plenty of room for lots of juicy hi-fi (including our annual one-make systems test - all 12+ pages of it...) plus seasonal items such as DAB radio, MP3 players etc.
If you compare us to the competition, we're still running more hi-fi tests, plus are including TVs, home cinema and many other kinds of home entertainment product our incredibly diverse audience might want to buy for themselves or other family members at this time of year.
Lots of lovely hi-fi coming up in new year - including (by popular demand) tests of phono stages, cartridges, headphone amps and more. Plus a packed Ultimate Guide to Hi-fi due out early Feb....
If you compare us to the competition, we're still running more hi-fi tests, plus are including TVs, home cinema and many other kinds of home entertainment product our incredibly diverse audience might want to buy for themselves or other family members at this time of year.
Lots of lovely hi-fi coming up in new year - including (by popular demand) tests of phono stages, cartridges, headphone amps and more. Plus a packed Ultimate Guide to Hi-fi due out early Feb....
Hi terryff, I do feel for your apprehensions. But I also think that the ipod generation can eventually be turned into "true believers" through exposure to WHF that leads them to dabble a bit with hi-fi and information equipment. Have faith, a few years back everyone thought that vinyl will wither away, but I guess nothing can kill a truly good idea 
Great news re: the cartridge and phono stage tests, are these group tests and/or will you be looking at new stuff or existing ranges too (e.g. the excellent Goldring 1000-series, or AT-440/150 carts, etc.)?
Phono stages (Feb issue, out Jan 8th) is a four-way Group Test of £200-£350 models, if I remember rightly. Mix of old favourites and new models.
Still calling in headphone amps and cartridges - both in March issue, out first week in Feb. Without the contents list to hand, I can't tell you more at this point!
Still calling in headphone amps and cartridges - both in March issue, out first week in Feb. Without the contents list to hand, I can't tell you more at this point!
Thanks for the quick reply Clare; have a good Christmas whatever you're doing (you can probably start enjoying it now...!!).
matthewpiano
Well-known member
An ipod or good personal music player loaded with lossless files through good headphones or a decent dock connected to good hi-fi can sound excellent. No apologies should be made for them appearing in the magazine.
I would like to see some more coverage of hard drive/computer based sources over the next year, using lossless music files. With a huge CD collection I now need to consider lossless file downloads for some of my future purchases to avoid the appartment being taking over completely by software. I am a huge supporter of physical formats and the great feeling of having the little booklet or record sleeve, but I'm also quite open to future developments.
I would like to see some more coverage of hard drive/computer based sources over the next year, using lossless music files. With a huge CD collection I now need to consider lossless file downloads for some of my future purchases to avoid the appartment being taking over completely by software. I am a huge supporter of physical formats and the great feeling of having the little booklet or record sleeve, but I'm also quite open to future developments.
Thanks for the reply Clare and you guys. No danger of me not subscribing, was merely concerened....but there does seem to be lots of juicy content coming so i am reassured. As for them being part of Hi-fi, no, can't equate that, i know formats change ever increasingly, am an IT manager, seen so many chages, but i think that Hi Fi and computers are a little way off blending, one is specialised, the other is a multi use device that has to wear so many hats it wont be for a long time yet that it can approach the quality of pure HiFi components (imho).ÿ
As i said, there are many magazines devoted to just that cross over amongst other things, i guess in my old age i am in danger of becoming a bit of a snob (it happens) and I buy WHF purely on the qualityof its reviews and articles on those lovely shiny bits of pure hifi heavan (or sometimes not). Happy Xmas to all at WHF and you guys on the forum, you most assuredly have heklped wake up in me over the last six months the desire to keep reaching for that audio nadir we all seek.....
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As i said, there are many magazines devoted to just that cross over amongst other things, i guess in my old age i am in danger of becoming a bit of a snob (it happens) and I buy WHF purely on the qualityof its reviews and articles on those lovely shiny bits of pure hifi heavan (or sometimes not). Happy Xmas to all at WHF and you guys on the forum, you most assuredly have heklped wake up in me over the last six months the desire to keep reaching for that audio nadir we all seek.....
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chebby
Well-known member
Terryff, have you heard losslessly ripped files played via a good DAC? It really is a revelation and with the right DAC can sound better than many stand-alone hi-fi CD players.
I was doubtful until a couple of months ago when I tried it for myself.
Believe me, Chord's £3000 QBD76 and Benchmark's £1300 DAC1 Pre are not 'teen toys' when fed with Apple Lossless/FLAC/WMA lossless files.
Done right this gives a perfect bitstream source which is something few (any?) traditional CD players can boast (and is entirely unaffected by any environmental factors like airborne/support vibrations etc.).
Even my 'humble' USB only DAC is giving the built-in Arcam CD player in my Solo-Mini (which itself uses a Wolfson WM8740) a very close run. So close I don't even bother using the Solo-MIni to play CDs any more.
The same principle applies to iPods if playing not too compressed (or lossless) files through a good quality dock. (What about that Wadia iTransport?)
I was doubtful until a couple of months ago when I tried it for myself.
Believe me, Chord's £3000 QBD76 and Benchmark's £1300 DAC1 Pre are not 'teen toys' when fed with Apple Lossless/FLAC/WMA lossless files.
Done right this gives a perfect bitstream source which is something few (any?) traditional CD players can boast (and is entirely unaffected by any environmental factors like airborne/support vibrations etc.).
Even my 'humble' USB only DAC is giving the built-in Arcam CD player in my Solo-Mini (which itself uses a Wolfson WM8740) a very close run. So close I don't even bother using the Solo-MIni to play CDs any more.
The same principle applies to iPods if playing not too compressed (or lossless) files through a good quality dock. (What about that Wadia iTransport?)
raygun:Hi terryff, I do feel for your apprehensions. But I also think that the ipod generation can eventually be turned into "true believers" through exposure to WHF that leads them to dabble a bit with hi-fi and information equipment. Have faith, a few years back everyone thought that vinyl will wither away, but I guess nothing can kill a truly good idea
Interesting you say this, it is excatly how I got into hi-fi. Bought an iPod last March, realised I could get much much more than my lowly PC speakers, picked up a copy of WHF and hatched my plans.
In response to the OP, "Isn't this a little concerning, seeing as surely most people that subscribe to the magazine buy it for Hi fi news/revews etc" I'd ask what about the people who also buy the mag for the home entertainment side of things - TV's aren't "hi-fi" afaik. Don't forget it's "WHF Sound and Vision" and therefore covers a whole plethora of systems. Why not portable?
*dons flame shield*
Interesting you say this, it is excatly how I got into hi-fi. Bought an iPod last March, realised I could get much much more than my lowly PC speakers, picked up a copy of WHF and hatched my plans.
In response to the OP, "Isn't this a little concerning, seeing as surely most people that subscribe to the magazine buy it for Hi fi news/revews etc" I'd ask what about the people who also buy the mag for the home entertainment side of things - TV's aren't "hi-fi" afaik. Don't forget it's "WHF Sound and Vision" and therefore covers a whole plethora of systems. Why not portable?
*dons flame shield*
Hi Chebby, I value your opinion BUT, any hifi relies upon it's source for quality, yes? Therefore, how can a lossless file, which is a copy of a CD master, sound better? After all, you cannot add extra sound into the mix this way....
like mpeg compression, something, albeit a tiny amount, is actually lost in that compression process. No matter how good the decoding equipment is, it is still working to attempt to extract data that has been "squeezed" (apologies for the non technical language, i am only a part time geek) therefore there is no way that lossless can sound better than an actual cd.
(retains that good old tin hat). ÿ
like mpeg compression, something, albeit a tiny amount, is actually lost in that compression process. No matter how good the decoding equipment is, it is still working to attempt to extract data that has been "squeezed" (apologies for the non technical language, i am only a part time geek) therefore there is no way that lossless can sound better than an actual cd.
(retains that good old tin hat). ÿ
chebby
Well-known member
Terryff:
Hi Chebby, I value your opinion BUT, any hifi relies upon it's source for quality, yes? Therefore, how can a lossless file, which is a copy of a CD master, sound better? After all, you cannot add extra sound into the mix this way....
Guess you will have to listen for yourself. I will leave the technical stuff (regarding error correction and timing/jitter, perfect bit-streams etc.) for the more expert among us.
As I said. I went and tried it rather than worry about the theory.
I am convinced enough of the principle - with what I am using right now - to plan to get a Benchmark DAC1 USB (or Pre) costing some £900 - £1300 next year and eliminate CD players from any future upgrade plans when I get around to replacing my Arcam Solo Mini.
Hi Chebby, I value your opinion BUT, any hifi relies upon it's source for quality, yes? Therefore, how can a lossless file, which is a copy of a CD master, sound better? After all, you cannot add extra sound into the mix this way....
Guess you will have to listen for yourself. I will leave the technical stuff (regarding error correction and timing/jitter, perfect bit-streams etc.) for the more expert among us.
As I said. I went and tried it rather than worry about the theory.
I am convinced enough of the principle - with what I am using right now - to plan to get a Benchmark DAC1 USB (or Pre) costing some £900 - £1300 next year and eliminate CD players from any future upgrade plans when I get around to replacing my Arcam Solo Mini.
I think your answer is excellent "i went and tried it myself". If beauty is in the eye of the beholder, i guess sonic beauty must be in the ear of the beholder. You have the better of me, i have not tried them yet, therefore practice rules over theory every time.ÿ
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Thanks mate.ÿ
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Thanks mate.ÿ
chebby
Well-known member
Terryff:....but this post was about ipods and mp3 players.
OK how about an iPhone via Bluetooth/A2DP with a £3000 Chord QBD76 DAC?....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALhO3_3Xg4I
The video does not tell us how good it sounds (obviously) but it demonstrates that some people who are prepared to spend really serious money prefer their music this way.
OK how about an iPhone via Bluetooth/A2DP with a £3000 Chord QBD76 DAC?....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALhO3_3Xg4I
The video does not tell us how good it sounds (obviously) but it demonstrates that some people who are prepared to spend really serious money prefer their music this way.
Ok, another valid pont, but you are talking how many thousands? Surely a 3k cd player would sound better....it's all about balance really, if i have to soend 3-4k on getting my computer losless files to sound superb, i bet i can get a system of pure HIFI that can sound better. It's quite an interesting debate and one which could only be solved by putting them side by side...WHF, i lay down the gauntlet on the side of hifi
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chebby
Well-known member
Terryff:Ok, another valid pont, but you are talking how many thousands?
The same thing works with the £399 Chordette Gem and (presumably) iPod Touch/iPhones with lossless files via Airport Express/Airplay wirelessly using any DAC (with an optical connection for the AE).
That example just happened to be a £3K DAC.
The same thing works with the £399 Chordette Gem and (presumably) iPod Touch/iPhones with lossless files via Airport Express/Airplay wirelessly using any DAC (with an optical connection for the AE).
That example just happened to be a £3K DAC.
lol, you must admit a good debate is fun. That's what makes Hifi great, it divides opinion like little else.
After all, we would all buy the same thing if it were not subjective.ÿ
After all, we would all buy the same thing if it were not subjective.ÿ
chebby
Well-known member
Andrew Everard:'Tis the season to be squabbly...
So no opinions to contribute on this sort of technology Andrew?
Good job I picked up your recent edition of "WHF? S&V Ultimate Guide to New Technology 2009" for some great ideas about how to incorporate high quality replay from iPods.
Luckily it did not mention the word squabbly (whatever that is) to belittle the whole 'debate' that is going on in the hifi industry right now.
So no opinions to contribute on this sort of technology Andrew?
Good job I picked up your recent edition of "WHF? S&V Ultimate Guide to New Technology 2009" for some great ideas about how to incorporate high quality replay from iPods.
Luckily it did not mention the word squabbly (whatever that is) to belittle the whole 'debate' that is going on in the hifi industry right now.
Charlie Jefferson
Well-known member
I've just spent two hours listening to NIna Simone and Black Mountain at healthy volume (the females of the house are out shopping), and was once more astounded by the level of detail and warmth Lossless/AE/DAC playback can muster.
I'd just browsed this post and decided once again to do an A/B test between the CD/DAC and Lossless/DAC sources. A simple tweak of the filter switch around the back of the DAC allows a quick flick between the two source set-ups. There's no contest, it's the Lossless files all the way.
Chebby is right, it's your own ears that do the listening, and regardless of the technical reasons why, tell me which sound I enjoy more. Factor in the convenience of x number of songs at one's almost instant disposal and there seems to be scant reason to go any further with "old skool" CD playback.
Btw, has anyone else rejoiced in the welter of wonder that is Black Mountain? Read about them occasionally during the last couple of years but only just bought anything by them. Thumping, mesmeric stuff. Like a mutant-My Morning Jacket, prog-thud thing. (!)
I'd just browsed this post and decided once again to do an A/B test between the CD/DAC and Lossless/DAC sources. A simple tweak of the filter switch around the back of the DAC allows a quick flick between the two source set-ups. There's no contest, it's the Lossless files all the way.
Chebby is right, it's your own ears that do the listening, and regardless of the technical reasons why, tell me which sound I enjoy more. Factor in the convenience of x number of songs at one's almost instant disposal and there seems to be scant reason to go any further with "old skool" CD playback.
Btw, has anyone else rejoiced in the welter of wonder that is Black Mountain? Read about them occasionally during the last couple of years but only just bought anything by them. Thumping, mesmeric stuff. Like a mutant-My Morning Jacket, prog-thud thing. (!)
chebby:Andrew Everard:'Tis the season to be squabbly...
So no opinions to contribute on this sort of technology Andrew?
Good job I picked up your recent edition of "WHF? S&V Ultimate Guide to New Technology 2009" for some great ideas about how to incorporate high quality replay from iPods.
Luckily it did not mention the word squabbly (whatever that is) to belittle the whole 'debate' that is going on in the hifi industry right now.
Adverbial version of 'squabble'. And no, no opinions today - it's Boxing Day, and I'm just keeping an eye open for unpleasantness.
But in no way belittling what is very obviously a very serious debate, and could change our lives forever - just the entrenched, snappy views to which it gives rise.
So no opinions to contribute on this sort of technology Andrew?
Good job I picked up your recent edition of "WHF? S&V Ultimate Guide to New Technology 2009" for some great ideas about how to incorporate high quality replay from iPods.
Luckily it did not mention the word squabbly (whatever that is) to belittle the whole 'debate' that is going on in the hifi industry right now.
Adverbial version of 'squabble'. And no, no opinions today - it's Boxing Day, and I'm just keeping an eye open for unpleasantness.
But in no way belittling what is very obviously a very serious debate, and could change our lives forever - just the entrenched, snappy views to which it gives rise.
chebby
Well-known member
Andrew Everard:Adverbial version of 'squabble'
Ah OK. Thought it might have been a favourite board game being described by Jonathan Ross.
Ah OK. Thought it might have been a favourite board game being described by Jonathan Ross.
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