Want a bigger bass response - look in here.

[davedotco]

Although a real newcomer to this forum I am struck with the nunber of threads from posters who find the bass response of their systems to be lightweight or lacking in depth.

With that in mind I am going to recomend a relatively low cost option that will, in virtually all situations, satisfy the need for a powerful bass response.

Those of a nervous disposition should look away now...... :hand:

http://www.mackie.com/products/hrmk2series/

Read the review.....

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep07/articles/mackie_hr824mk2.htm

The smaller HR624 model should be sufficient for most users and with a street price of around £700 it is very affordable considering it includes 100 + 40 watts of onboard amplification.

For larger rooms (or serious 'bassheads') the HR824 offers a bigger 8 inch bass driver and a monstrous 150 + 100 watts of amp power, more expensive but they can still be found under £1000.

You will need a source and some kind of volume control but that's it, properly mounted and set up these speakers are in a different world from the usual hi-fi components regularly featured on this forum.

 

[RobinKidderminster]

Reads like an advert. Do u have these? Suggest u declare yr experience/setup please

 

[davedotco]

Reads like an advert. Do u have these? Suggest u declare yr experience/setup please

It is a personal recomendation not an advert, though I guess they can sound pretty similar on occasions.

I have spent more than 30 years in the music/pro-audio/hifi business though I am no longer involved in the industry. The Mackie speakers mentioned are commonplace in studios and production facilities of all kinds and although I have used them on many occasions I have never owned a pair, simply because their bass output is too much for my needs and taste.

The Sound on Sound review that I link too is a reputable pro audio magazine and offers an unbiased view. The speakers themselves deliver prodigious yet controlled bass (when positioned correctly) and are incredibly dynamic, they play very loud with a sense of ease that few hifi systems can match, in fact their power and control is such that inexperienced users tend to turn them way up, the usual clues that tells you that a conventional systen is too loud are largely missing from speakers of this type.

 

[RobinKidderminster]

Thanks. Para 1&2 are appreciated. Para 3 seems like another ad! However, others may wish to investigate these options. I also would hope with yr experience other options might follow yr personal studio experience. Cheers

 

[BigH]

Although a real newcomer to this forum I am struck with the nunber of threads from posters who find the bass response of their systems to be lightweight or lacking in depth.

With that in mind I am going to recomend a relatively low cost option that will, in virtually all situations, satisfy the need for a powerful bass response.

Those of a nervous disposition should look away now...... :hand:

http://www.mackie.com/products/hrmk2series/

Read the review.....

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep07/articles/mackie_hr824mk2.htm

The smaller HR624 model should be sufficient for most users and with a street price of around £700 it is very affordable considering it includes 100 + 40 watts of onboard amplification.

For larger rooms (or serious 'bassheads') the HR824 offers a bigger 8 inch bass driver and a monstrous 150 + 100 watts of amp power, more expensive but they can still be found under £1000.

You will need a source and some kind of volume control but that's it, properly mounted and set up these speakers are in a different world from the usual hi-fi components regularly featured on this forum.

Is that because they are actives?

 

[davedotco]

Thanks. Para 1&2 are appreciated. Para 3 seems like another ad! However, others may wish to investigate these options. I also would hope with yr experience other options might follow yr personal studio experience. Cheers

Sorry, after leaving 'the business' i spent few years in marketing, I guess it shows......

I consider myself something of an audio schizophrenic, my last 'serious' system was bought, at some expense (though not too bad, I was a hifi dealer at the time), to get the best from Martin Logan CLS11z full range electrostatics and involved ARC amplification and a SME/Koetsu front end. At the same time I had a pair of vintage JBL recording monitors (15 inch bass, 3 way system) bi amplified with Crown amplification as a 'party system'

My work in other areas have shown me that people have many different requirements when it comes to getting what they want in a music playing system, my suggestions above are for those people (and there seem to be a fair number on this forum) for whom the coventional hi-fi approach of integrated amplifier and stand mount or small(ish) floor standing speakers does not cut the mustard.

 

[Overdose]

Although a real newcomer to this forum I am struck with the nunber of threads from posters who find the bass response of their systems to be lightweight or lacking in depth.

With that in mind I am going to recomend a relatively low cost option that will, in virtually all situations, satisfy the need for a powerful bass response.

Those of a nervous disposition should look away now...... :hand:

http://www.mackie.com/products/hrmk2series/

Read the review.....

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep07/articles/mackie_hr824mk2.htm

The smaller HR624 model should be sufficient for most users and with a street price of around £700 it is very affordable considering it includes 100 + 40 watts of onboard amplification.

For larger rooms (or serious 'bassheads') the HR824 offers a bigger 8 inch bass driver and a monstrous 150 + 100 watts of amp power, more expensive but they can still be found under £1000.

You will need a source and some kind of volume control but that's it, properly mounted and set up these speakers are in a different world from the usual hi-fi components regularly featured on this forum.

There are quite a few good actives around at this price point., the Dynaudio BM6As are also an attractive proposition. I've heard a lot of good tings about the 624s, so the 824s would be great for the application you suggest.

 

[MajorFubar]

I've heard Mackie monitors, they are good, but I always dismissed them for HiFi use because (a) they're a bit agricultural and not wife-friendly in a living-room environment, and (b) I always saw them as near-field monitors, and as such they're designed to be listened to at close range by one person slap bang in the sweet-spot, which is a totally different requirement to what most people want from HiFi speakers. Though I do think it would be beneficial if more people knew these options existed. The paths trod by Pro-audio products and HiFi audio products are closer than a lot of people think.

 

[davedotco]

Although a real newcomer to this forum I am struck with the nunber of threads from posters who find the bass response of their systems to be lightweight or lacking in depth.

With that in mind I am going to recomend a relatively low cost option that will, in virtually all situations, satisfy the need for a powerful bass response.

Those of a nervous disposition should look away now...... :hand:

http://www.mackie.com/products/hrmk2series/

Read the review.....

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/sep07/articles/mackie_hr824mk2.htm

The smaller HR624 model should be sufficient for most users and with a street price of around £700 it is very affordable considering it includes 100 + 40 watts of onboard amplification.

For larger rooms (or serious 'bassheads') the HR824 offers a bigger 8 inch bass driver and a monstrous 150 + 100 watts of amp power, more expensive but they can still be found under £1000.

You will need a source and some kind of volume control but that's it, properly mounted and set up these speakers are in a different world from the usual hi-fi components regularly featured on this forum.

There are quite a few good actives around at this price point., the Dynaudio BM6As are also an attractive proposition. I've heard a lot of good tings about the 624s, so the 824s would be great for the application you suggest.

I picked the Mackies for this specific application on account of their prodigeous bass output, no other reason. Most of the people I am addressing, those who consistently complain of a lack of bass from their (conventianal) system, would probanly want more apparent bass than you would get from Dynaudios or ADMs for that matter.

 

[davedotco]

I've heard Mackie monitors, they are good, but I always dismissed them for HiFi use because (a) they're a bit agricultural and not wife-friendly in a living-room environment, and (b) I always saw them as near-field monitors, and as such they're designed to be listened to at close range by one person slap bang in the sweet-spot, which is a totally different requirement to what most people want from HiFi speakers. Though I do think it would be beneficial if more people knew these options existed. The paths trod by Pro-audio products and HiFi audio products are closer than a lot of people think.

The Mackie HDR models are rather nicely finished in piano black though they have no grills and are rather 'techie' looking. I love the looks, swmbo would not!

The term 'near field monitor' really doesn't mean anything, any properly designed small 2 ways will work up close simply because of the proximity of the drive units, in the pro world it is code for not being big enough or loud enough to use as main (midfield) monitors. I don't really think that they are balanced differently for use in near field, not at this price level anyway.

 

[MajorFubar]

I don't really think that they are balanced differently for use in near field, not at this price level anyway.

Yeah it's not the balance...for me it was the soundstage and projection. My experience is limited to my Alesis M1 monitors which I resorted to using as 'hifi' speakers for a while, and I found that beyond more than about 5 feet away the stereo image collapsed, even worse if I was off-centre. But in my little home studio they're brilliant for the price, even though I don't know why there's a difference, and obviously the difference will vary from model to model.

Conversely before I bought them I was using some active Diamonds in my home studio and they were useless: sit too close and there was no bass and an obvious hole in the middle, dispite the fact they were positioned correctly. The kids use them now attached to a Mac Mini in their bedroom, and sitting 10/12 feet away from them they're great(ish).

But you're right: people do need to give pro-audio products like these a go. It's like there's an uncrossable line separating HiFi and pro-audio products, it would be beneficial for many people to blur it a bit.

 

[BigH]

If you want more bass you could try these: http://www.whathifi.com/review/epoz-aktimate-maxi

They are not true actives but at £350 they were great value but too much bass for me.

 

[davedotco]

I don't really think that they are balanced differently for use in near field, not at this price level anyway.

Yeah it's not the balance...for me it was the soundstage and projection. My experience is limited to my Alesis M1 monitors which I resorted to using as 'hifi' speakers for a while, and I found that beyond more than about 5 feet away the stereo image collapsed, even worse if I was off-centre. But in my little home studio they're brilliant for the price, even though I don't know why there's a difference, and obviously the difference will vary from model to model. Conversely before I bought them I was using some active Diamonds in my home studio and they were useless: sit too close and there was no bass and an obvious hole in the middle, dispite the fact they were positioned correctly. The kids use them now attached to a Mac Mini in their bedroom, and sitting 10/12 feet away from them they're great(ish). But you're right: people do need to give pro-audio products like these a go. It's like there's an uncrossable line separating HiFi and pro-audio products, it would be beneficial for many people to blur it a bit.

I have to admit that imaging is not high on my scale of priorities, I rarely bother to sit in the 'sweet spot' so a good separation of the musicians and instruments is important but locating them in a soundstage doesn't really matter to me.

This may have something to do with a system I once heard in Wimbledon. The speakers were Martin Logan Monolyths, massive 7ft electrostatic panels and separate woofer arrays in a room big enough to play a game of snooker and ping pong at the same time.

The soundstage was so tangible and three dimensional that you could get up and walk into it, phenomenal. Nothing I have heard since has come remotely close to replicating this, so I guess I have been spoilt.

 

[davedotco]

If you want more bass you could try these: http://www.whathifi.com/review/epoz-aktimate-maxi

They are not true actives but at £350 they were great value but too much bass for me.

These are like big versions of the Audio Engine, decent well built products that are deliberately voiced to sound big, with plenty of bass. Sadly the mid bass boost that is used to achieve that effect can quickly become tiresome, particularly for anyone used to a flat, more accurate sound.

Overall they lack dynamics and clarity to be serious contenders but they are quite fun for non critical use. The Mackie HR speakers have real bass extension (to about 50hz) but maintain a flat mid bass and are very dynamic, the bass 'kick' can leave you reeling.

 

[lindsayt]

Yes I like electrostatics too for their soundstaging and midrange claritity and lack of inertia and their ability to make the speakers disappear and the music appear.

How would you say the bass of the 8.75" driver Mackie's compares to your old 15" JBL set-up, davedotco?

 

[Ajani]

Another option for big bass from a monitor is the Event 20/20BAS. Not sure about UK prices, but in the US it's even cheaper than the Mackie HR624 and goes lower than the 824 (based on specs - I haven't had the pleasure of trying either model yet).

 

[Ajani]

But you're right: people do need to give pro-audio products like these a go. It's like there's an uncrossable line separating HiFi and pro-audio products, it would be beneficial for many people to blur it a bit.

I think part of the problem is that HiFi mags rarely review pro gear. So many persons don't even know the options that are available.

I would love to see WHF do a shootout of studio monitors used in a HiFi setting. Round up the popular brands - Mackie, Genelec, Dynaudio, Focal, KRK, Event etc and compare their sound at more traditional HiFi listening distances.

 

[steve_1979]

I think part of the problem is that HiFi mags rarely review pro gear. So many persons don't even know the options that are available.

I would love to see WHF do a shootout of studio monitors used in a HiFi setting. Round up the popular brands - Mackie, Genelec, Dynaudio, Focal, KRK, Event etc and compare their sound at more traditional HiFi listening distances.

+1

It would make an interesting article.

 

[davedotco]

Yes I like electrostatics too for their soundstaging and midrange claritity and lack of inertia and their ability to make the speakers disappear and the music appear.

How would you say the bass of the 8.75" driver Mackie's compares to your old 15" JBL set-up, davedotco?

Not remotely comparable. The JBL's were seriously 'old school', 15 inch driver, 4 inch voice coil and massive 'potted' magnet. Nominally 150 watt, sensitivity was around 91 - 93 dB in a 9 cubic foot enclosure, overall dimensions roughly 3ft x 3ft x 2ft deep.

These crossed over actively at 800hz to a compression driven horn midrange and a ring radiator, horn loaded tweeter. They certainly had 'character', a fantastic dynamic sound that projected like little else, it made the current JBL horn loaded systems (studio 530/580) sound quite polite and refined.

The Mackies are quite different, much more neutral and uncoloured with a deep but slightly forced bass. Overall the system is very powerful and dynamic with a marked lack of compression, hi fi users coming to these speakers for the first time tend to play them far too loud, leading to accusations that they are upfront and 'in your face', they are not, just turn them down!

 

[busb]

I think part of the problem is that HiFi mags rarely review pro gear. So many persons don't even know the options that are available.

I would love to see WHF do a shootout of studio monitors used in a HiFi setting. Round up the popular brands - Mackie, Genelec, Dynaudio, Focal, KRK, Event etc and compare their sound at more traditional HiFi listening distances.

+1

It would make an interesting article.

It's unlikely to happen - their advertisers wouldn't be too happy if punters discovered that professional gear was often better & cheaper much of, if not all the time! Not all pro speakers are near-field studio monitors. PA speakers are often used outside in free space where their bass won't sound too over-blown.

As for bass response in domestic situations, it's often down to both speaker positioning & seating. My room has both a suspended floor & alcoves that make the room difficultt to draw the balance between good bass weight & acceptable overhang . I also have neighbours below so fulsome bass for me would mean hell for them. Another major factor regarding bass is recording quality!

 

[lindsayt]

So which speaker do you prefer the sound of overall, davedotco, your old JBL's or the Mackies? And which speaker do you prefer the bass from?

 

[davedotco]

So which speaker do you prefer the sound of overall, davedotco, your old JBL's or the Mackies? And which speaker do you prefer the bass from?

The JBLs were as I said, pretty old school, they didn't 'do' accurate or neutral, they did do presence and dynamics and they went very loud.

Despite their size there was no deep bass, studios were not much interested in anything below about 50 - 60 hz in those days, so the bass was punchy and had a slightly 'slappy' quality to it. Loved them in the day, we are talking 1980's here, but I doubt they would come close to any modern monitor in terms of accuracy.

Mine looked rather like this..... http://www.productwiki.com/upload/images/jbl_4333a_in_gray_painted_finish.jpg

 

[relocated]

I think part of the problem is that HiFi mags rarely review pro gear. So many persons don't even know the options that are available.

I would love to see WHF do a shootout of studio monitors used in a HiFi setting. Round up the popular brands - Mackie, Genelec, Dynaudio, Focal, KRK, Event etc and compare their sound at more traditional HiFi listening distances.

+1

It would make an interesting article.

Yes it would but as Busb has said, it aint gonna happen. Particularly not with any traditional passive product up against them.

 

[MajorFubar]

I think part of the problem is that HiFi mags rarely review pro gear. So many persons don't even know the options that are available.

I would love to see WHF do a shootout of studio monitors used in a HiFi setting. Round up the popular brands - Mackie, Genelec, Dynaudio, Focal, KRK, Event etc and compare their sound at more traditional HiFi listening distances.

+1

It would make an interesting article.

It would be a pointless article, if we're all being honest, and withouit saying anything too incriminating. I can already tell you what the outcome would be, and that outcome is, "you don't bite the hand that feeds you".

 

[Native_bon]

I think part of the problem is that HiFi mags rarely review pro gear. So many persons don't even know the options that are available.

I would love to see WHF do a shootout of studio monitors used in a HiFi setting. Round up the popular brands - Mackie, Genelec, Dynaudio, Focal, KRK, Event etc and compare their sound at more traditional HiFi listening distances.

+1

It would make an interesting article.

It would be a pointless article, if we're all being honest, and withouit saying anything too incriminating. I can already tell you what the outcome would be, and that outcome is, "you don't bite the hand that feeds you".

Cannot agree more...