It's official, the TT is vastly inferior to my CD player in every way, shape and form. Chalk and cheese. It lacks detail, soundstage, warmth, bass, musicality, involvement, everything really.
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When should you upgrade your hi-fi? How to control ‘upgradeitis’
TT vs CD update
- Thread starter JoelSim
- Start date
Problem is, you probably need to spend a wodge more cash to see what vinyl can do. Having said that, use the cash on the rest of the system instead
If you like analogue sound then get a valve amp...
igglebert:Problem is, you probably need to spend a wodge more cash to see what vinyl can do. Having said that, use the cash on the rest of the system instead
If you like analogue sound then get a valve amp...
I think you're right, updating cartridge etc would cost a chunk and I think it would be better spent on music, or amp upgrades or suchlike. I don't think the Debut is up to it and I would need to spend a grand or so, which I'm not prepared to do. But I do enjoy the whole palava of records, and the artwork and I have about 100 new albums so it will be used.
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I think you're right, updating cartridge etc would cost a chunk and I think it would be better spent on music, or amp upgrades or suchlike. I don't think the Debut is up to it and I would need to spend a grand or so, which I'm not prepared to do. But I do enjoy the whole palava of records, and the artwork and I have about 100 new albums so it will be used.
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matengawhat
Well-known member
to be honest when i bought my pro-ject it killed my kandy cdp in everyway but to be honest i now prefer the sound of my mf v8 cdp and dac and if i need a little warmth i just turn on the tubes within the dac
It's a million miles away to be honest and I've set it up as per instructions (and research). Gary at Analogue Seduction has offered me an Ortofon 2M Blue on 7 day trial, or a full refund.
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Joel,
If it's truly awful then I suspect set-up is the issue.
Although the Debut is only a modest deck it should still allow you to enjoy some of the characteristics of vinyl replay.
The CD192 is hardly the pinnacle of CD players but you might need to get a better TT and cartridge to equal it. The RPM5 with whichever red cartridge it now comes with might be okay.
However, it all seems like throwing money at an experiment; money that could buy you a lot of music, or one of the best DACs around.
If it's truly awful then I suspect set-up is the issue.
Although the Debut is only a modest deck it should still allow you to enjoy some of the characteristics of vinyl replay.
The CD192 is hardly the pinnacle of CD players but you might need to get a better TT and cartridge to equal it. The RPM5 with whichever red cartridge it now comes with might be okay.
However, it all seems like throwing money at an experiment; money that could buy you a lot of music, or one of the best DACs around.
Eddie Pound:
Joel,
If it's truly awful then I suspect set-up is the issue.
Although the Debut is only a modest deck it should still allow you to enjoy some of the characteristics of vinyl replay.
The CD192 is hardly the pinnacle of CD players but you might need to get a better TT and cartridge to equal it. The RPM5 with whichever red cartridge it now comes with might be okay.
However, it all seems like throwing money at an experiment; money that could buy you a lot of music, or one of the best DACs around.
The CD192 is Premier League and the Debut is League 2. It's not even close. Don't underestimate the 192 either, it's very very good.
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Joel,
If it's truly awful then I suspect set-up is the issue.
Although the Debut is only a modest deck it should still allow you to enjoy some of the characteristics of vinyl replay.
The CD192 is hardly the pinnacle of CD players but you might need to get a better TT and cartridge to equal it. The RPM5 with whichever red cartridge it now comes with might be okay.
However, it all seems like throwing money at an experiment; money that could buy you a lot of music, or one of the best DACs around.
The CD192 is Premier League and the Debut is League 2. It's not even close. Don't underestimate the 192 either, it's very very good.
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I don't know much about English Soccer but isn't Premier the top one?
Does that mean there is nothing above a CD192?
Does that mean there is nothing above a CD192?
John Duncan
Well-known member
JoelSim:Eddie Pound:
Joel,
If it's truly awful then I suspect set-up is the issue.
Although the Debut is only a modest deck it should still allow you to enjoy some of the characteristics of vinyl replay.
The CD192 is hardly the pinnacle of CD players but you might need to get a better TT and cartridge to equal it. The RPM5 with whichever red cartridge it now comes with might be okay.
However, it all seems like throwing money at an experiment; money that could buy you a lot of music, or one of the best DACs around.
The CD192 is Premier League and the Debut is League 2. It's not even close. Don't underestimate the 192 either, it's very very good.
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Did I tell you not to bother? Did I?
Joel,
If it's truly awful then I suspect set-up is the issue.
Although the Debut is only a modest deck it should still allow you to enjoy some of the characteristics of vinyl replay.
The CD192 is hardly the pinnacle of CD players but you might need to get a better TT and cartridge to equal it. The RPM5 with whichever red cartridge it now comes with might be okay.
However, it all seems like throwing money at an experiment; money that could buy you a lot of music, or one of the best DACs around.
The CD192 is Premier League and the Debut is League 2. It's not even close. Don't underestimate the 192 either, it's very very good.
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Did I tell you not to bother? Did I?
junk the debut pronto......look out for an expression mk1 on flea bay....
the arm is on another planet compared to the debut, add an after market mat, or when funds are available swap the platter for the pro -ject acrylic.
last, again when you can afford it add a speed box, worth while improvement.
mine came from flea bay, after i sold off what it came with about £95, one ortofon tango m/c, mint ex dem £37 ( bargain ) mk2 speed
box £40....
the new expression has hit £400 + the tango and speed box about £600 ish.....
there are bargains to be had and it sounds very good....
the arm is on another planet compared to the debut, add an after market mat, or when funds are available swap the platter for the pro -ject acrylic.
last, again when you can afford it add a speed box, worth while improvement.
mine came from flea bay, after i sold off what it came with about £95, one ortofon tango m/c, mint ex dem £37 ( bargain ) mk2 speed
box £40....
the new expression has hit £400 + the tango and speed box about £600 ish.....
there are bargains to be had and it sounds very good....
Eddie Pound:
I don't know much about English Soccer but isn't Premier the top one?
Does that mean there is nothing above a CD192?
Not at all. It means it is a decent player.
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I don't know much about English Soccer but isn't Premier the top one?
Does that mean there is nothing above a CD192?
Not at all. It means it is a decent player.
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seasiders rock:
junk the debut pronto......look out for an expression mk1 on flea bay....
the arm is on another planet compared to the debut, add an after market mat, or when funds are available swap the platter forÿthe pro -ject ÿacrylic.
last, again when you can afford it add a speed box,ÿworth while improvement.
mine came from flea bay, after i sold off what it came with about £95, one ortofon tango m/c, mint ex demÿ£37 ( bargain ) mk2 speedÿ
box £40....ÿ
the new expression has hit £400 + the tango and speed boxÿabout £600 ish.....
there are bargains to be had and it sounds very good....
It would need to be 30% better to match the CDP, would the Expression be that much better than the Debut?
ÿ
junk the debut pronto......look out for an expression mk1 on flea bay....
the arm is on another planet compared to the debut, add an after market mat, or when funds are available swap the platter forÿthe pro -ject ÿacrylic.
last, again when you can afford it add a speed box,ÿworth while improvement.
mine came from flea bay, after i sold off what it came with about £95, one ortofon tango m/c, mint ex demÿ£37 ( bargain ) mk2 speedÿ
box £40....ÿ
the new expression has hit £400 + the tango and speed boxÿabout £600 ish.....
there are bargains to be had and it sounds very good....
It would need to be 30% better to match the CDP, would the Expression be that much better than the Debut?
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Joel,
What do you want from your system? It seems you are going in circles?
How about replacing the sources and the pre with a DAC/pre like Cyrus' DAC XP. It will give you a huge lift and be the first step in getting rid of the clutter. You can digitise your vinyls, rip your CDs, and use a Freeview box as a tuner. All of which will benefit through the Cyrus.
What do you want from your system? It seems you are going in circles?
How about replacing the sources and the pre with a DAC/pre like Cyrus' DAC XP. It will give you a huge lift and be the first step in getting rid of the clutter. You can digitise your vinyls, rip your CDs, and use a Freeview box as a tuner. All of which will benefit through the Cyrus.
Eddie Pound:
Joel,
What do you want from your system? It seems you are going in circles?
How about replacing the sources and the pre with a DAC/pre like Cyrus' DAC XP. It will give you a huge lift and be the first step in getting rid of the clutter. You can digitise your vinyls, rip your CDs, and use a Freeview box as a tuner. All of which will benefit through the Cyrus.
You couldn't be more wrong Eddie. I'm extremely happy with the CD and my amps and my speakers. Extremely. I was just hoping that my dad's TT which he didn't want was going to be better. I have no problem with clutter as it's all housed in a bespoke rack. The sound is superb. I have no inclination to digitise vinyl or buy an outboard DAC (The CDP has 4 already). I also have a tuner and Freeview, and I'm also very happy with my DVD player so won't be upgrading to Blu-Ray as don't really see the benefit.
In addition, I heard a Cyrus XTse/DAC/amps/PSUs and MA Platinums in Harrods a few months ago and was very very underwhelmed.ÿ
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Joel,
What do you want from your system? It seems you are going in circles?
How about replacing the sources and the pre with a DAC/pre like Cyrus' DAC XP. It will give you a huge lift and be the first step in getting rid of the clutter. You can digitise your vinyls, rip your CDs, and use a Freeview box as a tuner. All of which will benefit through the Cyrus.
You couldn't be more wrong Eddie. I'm extremely happy with the CD and my amps and my speakers. Extremely. I was just hoping that my dad's TT which he didn't want was going to be better. I have no problem with clutter as it's all housed in a bespoke rack. The sound is superb. I have no inclination to digitise vinyl or buy an outboard DAC (The CDP has 4 already). I also have a tuner and Freeview, and I'm also very happy with my DVD player so won't be upgrading to Blu-Ray as don't really see the benefit.
In addition, I heard a Cyrus XTse/DAC/amps/PSUs and MA Platinums in Harrods a few months ago and was very very underwhelmed.ÿ
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Joel i don't feel you should do anything more than enjoy your music through whatever source you listen to, the Project compared to your cd player is a bit out of it's class so it's false economy to throw money at it and only a cartridge upgrade is all you can really add to improve upon it but nothing more than a ortofon 2m red or even a stylus upgrade to an om 20 but their not so cheap now. Why not just get used to having vinyl around for a while and if the bug hits you then an upgrade to a better TT which will bring huge rewards but that's for the future. The problem with the project decks is in stock form they really cant be upgraded which is why they have a pecking order of entry level to higher spec ed TT's but something like a Rega 2 or better still the 3 will show a clean pair of heels to most cd players. I'm sorry you feel underwhelmed by the sound of your deck but it is entry level after all, now a Gyro se is a different kettle of fish all together.
chebby
Well-known member
You have pointed out the disparity between the levels of source you are comparing. (£150 TT with a £20 'included in price' basic cartridge vs a CDP that was £900 when new.)
Frankly I am amazed you think it (the Project) is only 30 percent less in quality.
A more capable TT and cartridge would level the playing field significantly.
As Gregory said (and as I would agree unsuprisingly
) the Rega P2 (most recent model) with something like an Ortofon 2M or Denon DL110 or AT440MLa would be another story! (Especially with the Graham Slee you own)
A Rega P3-24 with something like a Goldring 1012 GX/1022 GX or 1042 would make you doubt your CD player in the same way you now doubt the Project for just over half what the CD192 cost when new.
Frankly I am amazed you think it (the Project) is only 30 percent less in quality.
A more capable TT and cartridge would level the playing field significantly.
As Gregory said (and as I would agree unsuprisingly
A Rega P3-24 with something like a Goldring 1012 GX/1022 GX or 1042 would make you doubt your CD player in the same way you now doubt the Project for just over half what the CD192 cost when new.
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