stereo vs avr amp

[admin_exported]

just wondering. which of the following makes more sense if I'm prioritize music but would like my system to be extendable to home theater system?

1) start with stereo amp and add on an AVR later - cons: expensive in the short term because I will need the AVR very soon

2) start with an AVR and add a stereo amp later - not sure if this is possible? does the stereo amp stand alone or connect to the AVR? also, would it have any bearing on the speakers i choose?

 

[Gusboll]

If music is your priority then you have the answer already. I had an Arcam AVR which went kapput so decided to start from scratch; got the amp and then added the AV later. Best hi-fi decision I ever made.

 

[Anonymous]

if I felt I needed to have both HT and HIfi without burning a hole in my pocket - anything I should look out for in an AVR?

or does it mean that even if I add a stereo amp in future, both my aVR and stereo amps will have to drive totally different sets of spoeakers?

 

[Anonymous]

hi upsidesunny.

Good questions. I assume you are looking for a home cinema system that is not separate to your music system?

You can buy AV amps that are good with music (like the arcam avr600 or its cheaper sibling the AVR500) but by and large stereo amps are much better with music than av amps. And if you have the space it is usually cheaper and you get better results having dedicated amps.

Not sure why option 1 would be a more expensive option. The AVR amp wont neccasarily replace the stereo amp, but will be an addition to your "system".

What some people do (and this is something I may do once funds permit) is add a stereo amp to drive the front two speakers and have the AV amp just driving the centre speaker, the surround speakers and the sub (once you get them).

And yes this will have a bearing on the speakers you choose. You will need good musical front speakers that are a good match for your stereo amp, and you will need to ensure you can get a matching centre speaker (and matching rear speakers for that matter) for your home cinema system.

Oh and yes if you want to use the same front speakers for both yor hi-fi and your home cinema then you would connect the stereo amp to the av amp

Its all a minefield isnt it?

 

[Messiah]

Do you have a budget in mind?? This will determine a lot.

You can combine a HT Receiver and stereo amp and they will drive the same speakers. (Or rather the stereo amp would drive them for both duties.) You would just output the fronts signal from the HT Receiver into the Stereo amp. More can be explained on this in a mo...

 

[Anonymous]

barnsleydave - yes, a minefield it is especially since i'm starting with 0 know-how. and separate AV and stereo amps may be expensive because right now, a Denon AVR 2310 (suggested by my dealer) would set me back SGD$1.2K. I'm not sure I could get separates for the same price as a bundle.

music is more a priority because i listen to music more than I do watch movies on my very small 32" tv, but I recognize I could improve my movie experience with a HT set-up. the full HT set-up should come in when I upgrade to a 50" or more in a year or so.

I'm hoping to go with floor standers, and eliminate the need for a sub since I haven't much wall length to really place a sub.

I have SGD$3-4K to spend on the set-up now and I hope to not have to spend a lot upgrading the system a year or 2 in the future (i'm in Singapore btw)

it's frustrating, to say the least 😀 I want it all, but I obviously can't quite have it so at some point in time, I'm going to have to make compromises - it's just a question of what goes!

 

[Anonymous]

Start with stereo pre/power combination. All players have necessary audio decoders built in and can output stereo to line out. I am sure that for most off movies stereo will be enough. If you will see that you are coming to be a big big movies fan then you can add a AV processor and additional power amps (which will also helps for music). Or take a one good five/seven chanel power amp, biamp your stereo today and will think about processor tomorrow.

 

[Anonymous]

so how does the configuration work? pre-amp drives power-amp which drives av-amp which drives the speakers?

how's the pre-amp different from the stereo-amp?

and if it's stereo-amp + av-amp, does the stereo-amp drive the av-amp which drives the speakers?

could i get away with just the stereo-amp being turned on when I only want to listen to music?

 

[ear]

Stereo amps and speakers dont need to be upgraded in the future.

 

[Anonymous]

Here is example using NAD equipment:
Start with T587 player, C165BEE preamp and C275BEE power amp. Connect your player to preamp using 2ch analog out. You still will enjoy your movies, stereo not killing good movies.
When you will be ready for additional speakers add C245BEE four channel amp (two channels for rear and biamp your centre speaker) and add T175 processor (or replace your c165bee with it).

 

[Anonymous]

upsidesunny: how's the pre-amp different from the stereo-amp?
Preamp is for commutation and volume control only and it does not have power section to drive your speakers. So you can use any other power amp or amps on your choice. And using Y cables you can add to preamp two/three stereo amps or five/seven channel amp for biamp/triamp your stereo speakers. Later you can just change your preamp to a/v processor and keep your existing power amps.

 

[Anonymous]

When I see how people respond to this question, I get the impression when you need a car, you have to buy a Porsche first, prior to buy an excellent mid-class sedan for your family. Ofcourse, this is pure nonsense - and I was in the same mode a few months ago, after looking on this forum. I had to replace my old Denon - back in those days high-end amp - by preferably another amp or AVR.

AVR's have a bad reputation from the early days. But times have changed very significantly. After months of trying out, comparing, I bought a (I admit not so cheap) AVR from a mainstream brand, and it overclasses my old Denon in any respect. There's a lot of exaggeration in this stuff, and people tend to hear and discuss things you cannot even measure or proof.

What I advise, don't listen too much to al this chatter, go out and listen with your favorite music, with people/vendors that want to spend time with you to make the choice, and I'm sure, you will be surprised that there are amazing AVR's on the market!

 

[matthewpiano]

LCN:
When I see how people respond to this question, I get the impression when you need a car, you have to buy a Porsche first, prior to buy an excellent mid-class sedan for your family. Ofcourse, this is pure nonsense - and I was in the same mode a few months ago, after looking on this forum. I had to replace my old Denon - back in those days high-end amp - by preferably another amp or AVR.

AVR's have a bad reputation from the early days. But times have changed very significantly. After months of trying out, comparing, I bought a (I admit not so cheap) AVR from a mainstream brand, and it overclasses my old Denon in any respect. There's a lot of exaggeration in this stuff, and people tend to hear and discuss things you cannot even measure or proof.

What I advise, don't listen too much to al this chatter, go out and listen with your favorite music, with people/vendors that want to spend time with you to make the choice, and I'm sure, you will be surprised that there are amazing AVR's on the market!

Excellent post and I'd have to say I'm inclined to agree after hearing what can be achieved with a relatively affordable Sony STR-DA2400ES and some B&W 685s.

 

[Gusboll]

LCN:

When I see how people respond to this question, I get the impression when you need a car, you have to buy a Porsche first, prior to buy an excellent mid-class sedan for your family. Ofcourse, this is pure nonsense - and I was in the same mode a few months ago, after looking on this forum. I had to replace my old Denon - back in those days high-end amp - by preferably another amp or AVR.

AVR's have a bad reputation from the early days. But times have changed very significantly. After months of trying out, comparing, I bought a (I admit not so cheap) AVR from a mainstream brand, and it overclasses my old Denon in any respect. There's a lot of exaggeration in this stuff, and people tend to hear and discuss things you cannot even measure or proof.

What I advise, don't listen too much to al this chatter, go out and listen with your favorite music, with people/vendors that want to spend time with you to make the choice, and I'm sure, you will be surprised that there are amazing AVR's on the market!

So even though the OP asked for opinions, what you're saying is, don't listen to anyone else's point of view except yours?

 

[Anonymous]

LCN: AVR's have a bad reputation from the early days. But times have changed very significantly. After months of trying out, comparing, I bought a (I admit not so cheap) AVR from a mainstream brand, and it overclasses my old Denon in any respect.

You see, it wasn't so easy. And all this AVR thing is only a half of problem (budget). To rephrase you, do we need a five seat car if we want to race? Five average speakers or only two better ones? I still watching movies in stereo and I do not feel that I lost anything at all. That is my bottom line to author.

 

[Anonymous]

Ofcourse, the same applies to you. Each one can have his opinion, but the advise to go out and decide for yourself what's the best, can never be wrong, I think?

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks all, for the advice! I think in summary, I have just got to just go listen to the AVR+speaker set up, vs the stereo amp+speaker setup and see if I can really tell a difference. Not sure about adding a pre-amp - what does it do for either set-up?

Haven't any idea what a stereo amp + speakers will sound like while watching movies. I wonder if my dealer will balk if I asked him to hook both up!!

At the end of the day, it still boils down to how much I can afford now. If you had to compromise, which would you? the speakers? or the amp?

 

[Sizzers]

If music is your priority then as was said earlier, you've answered your own question.

I have no interest whatsoever in AV so I guess that makes me a little biased. However, movies sound great played through a hi-fi, and I'm also of an age when a MAJOR selling point of a cinema was that it could show movies played in Dolby stereo. Yes, plain old boring stereo! So, if you love your music with the occasional movie, buy an amp, speakers, stands. Worry about a HT set-up as and when you may buy a 50" TV, as a 32" is not going to give you a cinematic experience in any case.

 

[Anonymous]

Not all stereo amps (integrated amps) have dedicated input for power section. And if it doesn't have - you can't use it to expand your a/v setup later. That's all. Yes, there is not use for stereo preamp in a/v setup.
If I will have to compromise, I will choose to put money in speakers. Five speakers or two speakers - I think that is a first choice what you must make with tight budget. After that, you will have automatic answer to next question.

 

[Anonymous]

upsidesunny: Haven't any idea what a stereo amp + speakers will sound like while watching movies. I wonder if my dealer will balk if I asked him to hook both up!!
Why not? At the end of the day dealer will get the same money, it does not matter if it is for a/v setup or for stereo setup. Or it does?

 

[Anonymous]

no he'll get the same money

but i've come to realize, one man's meat is another man's poison. was at another shop on Friday, and I told him I was intending to listen to music off an AV amp and he gave me a look that said "what on earth are you thinking of?!"...and to add fuel to the fire, I had to tell him I'd be playing off my iPod too since I've got half my music stored there as well....

 

[Anonymous]

just came from auditioning KEF and Heco speakers

1) yes, unfortunately for my pocket, there is a difference between the AVR amp and the stereo amp. tried this comparison out on the KEFIQ speakers - the speakers sounded very airy on the AVR, but has more body and is more distinct on the stereo amp. Is it a psychological conclusion, I don't know, because I'm listening to the difference after everyone tells me that the stereo amp's better

2) tried the speakers on lower volumes because I live in a small development and the neighbours will probably not tolerate high volumes. are the sounds supposed to still be well-defined and distinct while on lower volumes? I find I have to crank them both up to higher levels for the different sounds to start appearing. Or is it usual across the board that more detail is lost at lower levels because the volume is just too low?

3) one of the Heco speaker models, the Aleva, does not sound loud even at higher volume levels. it's nice and mellow, but unfortunately, the sounds are not as distinct and well-defined

so the hunt continues tonight....with Dali Ikon, Elac and hopefully Monitor Audio and the Missions.....

 

[Sizzers]

upsidesunny:

2) tried the speakers on lower volumes because I live in a small development and the neighbours will probably not tolerate high volumes. are the sounds supposed to still be well-defined and distinct while on lower volumes? I find I have to crank them both up to higher levels for the different sounds to start appearing. Or is it usual across the board that more detail is lost at lower levels because the volume is just too low?

As a generalisation, yes - music is meant to be
set free, not constrained.

My view is that the music should come to you, not the other way round. I'm sure there are set-up's
which perform particularly well at low listening levels but I would guess at a premium.

I'm not in a dissimilar living situation which is why I'm looking at purchasing a seperate CDP for a headphone set-up. Was looking to do this within the next 2-weeks but a financial hiccup now means it's on hold for (hopefully!) a short while.

 

[leadears]

That's interesting, which model amps did you audition?

I was faced with a similer conumdrum 3 years ago (wanted a system that I could play files directly on via ipod or USB). At that time it seemed the only options for USB in were AVR amps. I ended up buying an end of line discounted Denon AVR 4306 which to my ears sounds great in pure direct stereo mode. So far no hifi shop has yet claimed to offer better sounding stereo amplification for under 1000 UK pounds - I'm always checking in the ongoing quest for improvement.

 

[Gerrardasnails]

upsidesunny:
so how does the configuration work? pre-amp drives power-amp which drives av-amp which drives the speakers?

how's the pre-amp different from the stereo-amp?

and if it's stereo-amp + av-amp, does the stereo-amp drive the av-amp which drives the speakers?

could i get away with just the stereo-amp being turned on when I only want to listen to music?

if for whatever reason you are not going to use a sub, keep it 2 channel, for now at least.