Stereo - Ceiling Speakers?

[madwiser]

I have a 5 meter x 6 meter room, hardwood (oak) floors. The room is three sided, meaning that it's an open design, so there's no door but rather the room connects direclty to the rest of the house. The celings are 3 meter.

This is a new home. The ceiling was wired for surround speakers, one speaker in each corner.

I am not installing a TV. This will be a sitting room - couches, etc.

I want killer stereo sound that seems to come from everywhere. My thought is to put four celing mounted speakers (not flush mounted but rather hanging down from the ceiling) plus a subwoofer.

I don't need lots of volume. This is an acoustically live room. The volume will be relatively low, but it should sound like a million dollars (or pounds or euros.)

I'd prefer not to have two speakers that create a fixed stereo image. I'd like the sound (and stereo image) to be naturally spread through the room.

I'd appreciate thoughts and suggestions. I'd be glad to provide more info if needed.

Thanks!

 

[andyjm]

I My thought is to put four celing mounted speakers (not flush mounted but rather hanging down from the ceiling) plus a subwoofer.

I don't need lots of volume. This is an acoustically live room. The volume will be relatively low, but it should sound like a million dollars (or pounds or euros.)

Others may have had a better experience, but in a live room with speakers at ceiling level, it is more likely to sound like an airport PA than a million dollars. I have tried and tried something similar in a bathroom and it remains a disaster.

If you get it to work, please post the answer - it may solve my problem.

 

[proffski]

I have to agree with Madwiser, and add that "stereo" is not intended as if it is coing from everywhere but precise points between the speakers. There are good ceiling speakers out there but not great ones...

 

[DocG]

Hi madwiser, and welcome to the forum!

A couple of thoughts...

In our new house we'll have ceiling speakers too: in the kitchen, the bedroom, the bathroom, probably in my home office. It's a very convenient solution, but I agree with lindsayt and Proffski: it won't make for a high quality system. Which is why in the living room, I want a 'proper' stereo system. Moreover, if you use four speakers (in the corners, at ceiling level), they cannot produce stereo; it would be quadrophonia (I think Pink Floyd made some albums in that format*blum3*). How would you drive these four speakers with a stereo signal? If you proceed with this set-up, I would advise you to go mono, but it couldn't be much more than background listening...

As you describe the situation, I think your solution would be in omnidirectional speakers. These give a good stereo image, that is not limited to a sweet spot. Phase coherence is key here. If you have a million dollar budget, build something around the MBL Radialstrahlers. If your budget is not limitless, you have more realistic options too, like Ohm Walsh or Duevel.

Or B&O's Lab5 or Lab9 speakers use an acoustic lense, to evenly spread mid and trebble (the former) or only treble (the latter) over the room (and they're active speakers, so you won't need to worry about matching amplification -- nor about subwoofers btw).

 

[Xanderzdad]

I would think that you need a good AV receiver. This then tunes your speakers to the 'live' acoustics of your room. This will also allow the system to generate psuedo surround for you. This essentially generates a sound field from all the speakers, even from a stereo source.

It can sound fantastic and I find myself listenig to a 7.1 'up-mix' of my CD's on more frequent occasions as the effect, if done well, is subtle and engaging.

The quality of a good, modern AV receivers is astonishing for the price IMHO.

 

[madwiser]

Excellent feedback everyone. You've confirmed my hesitance for ceiling mounted speakers.

I've got a line on a used pair of Magnepan MMG speakers. They've received mostly good reviews and seem like they could work in my environment.

 

[CnoEvil]

As the guys have said, ceiling speakers are Ok for ambient music around the house........Maggies are a great suggestion for "proper" stereo listening, but will need a decent amp and a good source.

 

[DocG]

Maggies are a great suggestion for "proper" stereo listening, but will need a decent amp and a good source.

Absolutely! And you have the room to get them far enough from the walls to work properly. I once heard they sound best when placed along the long wall, but experiment to see what works best for you.

Apart from choosing the right electronics, the only issue I see, is the fact that Maggies 'beam' (like most panel speakers), which means they have a smaller 'sweet spot' than conventional dynamic speakers (the opposite of omnis)...

Of course, if the perfect speakers existed, we would all have them... *scratch_one-s_head*

 

[madwiser]

I want a larger sweet spot, so maybe the Maggies aren't the best choice. Can you give me a couple examples of omnis? I think of omni when I buy mics, not so much with speakers, though I have only bought near-field monitors in the past decade. It's been a long while since I shopped for stereo speakers (two speakers plus possibly a subwoofer) instead of a surround system or near-field monitors.

Thanks.

 

[DocG]

I want a larger sweet spot, so maybe the Maggies aren't the best choice. Can you give me a couple examples of omnis? I think of omni when I buy mics, not so much with speakers, though I have only bought near-field monitors in the past decade. It's been a long while since I shopped for stereo speakers (two speakers plus possibly a subwoofer) instead of a surround system or near-field monitors.

See post #4. Where do you live? When you're in the US, you can try the Ohms with a 120 day money back guarantee. Not sure about the Duevels, but I think they're available there too. What (maximum) budget did you have in mind?

To be perfectly clear: I haven't heard these speakers myself yet! I haven't tracked them down yet (I live in Belgium), but as a concept they seem to fit. For you, and for me too btw.

So please, don't buy blind!

 

[matt49]

I think DocG's suggestion of omnidirectional speakers fits the bill exactly. They should fill the room nicely. Like the good Doc though, I can't personally vouch for any of these suggestions.

Duevel is a German brand, nicht wahr? Also worth looking for German Physiks. And there's always Shahinian.

Matt

EDIT If you happen to own a bank and don't mind your speakers looking like a food blender, then I reckon these may be among the best speakers ever made. The brand is Muraudio, based in Canada.

 

[DocG]

Duevel is a German brand, nicht wahr?

Genau! Those Germans seem to be into this niche, with the aforementioned Duevels, German Physiks, MBL, or the Visaton-kits, like this Fontana:

Or if you're looking for omnis to hang from the ceiling, try these Italian beauties from Nacsound. They will undoubtedly need a subwoofer to fill in the bottom octaves, but don't they look svelte!

 

[chebby]

KEF Ci Series

PMC wafer and wafer-iw (on-wall and in-wall)

Monitor Audio Ci Series

B&W FPM (Flat Panel Monitors)

B&W CI speakers

 

[madwiser]

Thanks again to everyone for comments, opinions and suggestions.

I'm considering a new pair of MicroWall Talls for $1,200. Two other options are available used: a pair of Vandersteen Audio 2C speakers for $400 or a pair of Walsh 2 Ohm Vintage Speakers for $350.

I understand that speakers (like guitars, video cameras, etc.) are personal preference, I'm just wondering if the the 2C or 2 Ohm (both older models) would get me close to the same experience as the Talls.

Thoughts?

 

[DocG]

I'm considering a new pair of MicroWall Talls for $1,200. Two other options are available used: a pair of Vandersteen Audio 2C speakers for $400 or a pair of Walsh 2 Ohm Vintage Speakers for $350.

I understand that speakers (like guitars, video cameras, etc.) are personal preference, I'm just wondering if the the 2C or 2 Ohm (both older models) would get me close to the same experience as the Talls.

Sorry, I can't find anything about MicroWall speakers. Do you mean the Ohm MicroWalsh Tall? If so, I might have an interesting thread on another forum here. As both Ohm and Vandersteen are American speakers, you probably won't find much first hand experience on this forum. But if you need to choose between the Micro and the Walsh2, it might be best to contact Ohm with your question. Going on what I read on the thread I mentioned, they are really helpful, and they support their older models really well too. So you might be better off with the 2s... but ask them yourself!

PS: I take it you live in the USA?

 

[madwiser]

Yes, USA. Yes, I meant MicroWalsh Talls.

Thanks.