speakers for an A class amp

acalex

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Hello to everyone,

since I decided to upgrade my ampli, I am thinking about going down the road of a pure class A amp. What I have noticed is that all the ones I am looking at share a theoretically low power output (from 10W from Pathos Inpol to I think 35W of the AMS35i from musical fidelity)...which kind of speakers do you match with those ampli?

I have a pair of Monitor Audio RX6 which are teoretically 90dB and require a 40-125W amplification...does this mean I should look at other speakers if I want an A class amplifier? Or this range is purelly theoretically?

Again...my living room is around 16sqm and heavily furnished (carpet, desk, table, bookshelf, sofa, wooden floor etc...) and I do not listen to loud music (9 o'clock has been my max so far...but still can't keep for long because of the neighbours)

Any thoughts on this?

Thanksssssss
 

CnoEvil

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Hi there again.

The Pathos Inpol has 45W and lots of current behind it, so will drive speakers of average sensitivity to reasonable volumes (I don't have a figure into 4 Ohms).

I know the MF AMS 35i very well, as I own one; and it is the best sounding amp I've heard under £10k. It may only have 35W on paper, but this doubles into 4 ohms and again into 2 Ohms. It drives my Kef Ref 205/2 with ease in a large room, and they can drop to 3.2 Ohms.

If you can slot one into your demo, it's a must hear, at the prices you are looking at. Compared to the Pathos Inpol, it (imo) has a deeper more controlled bass and is maybe a touch less "rich"...somehow it just sounds right.

35W can be enough if the amp has plenty of current (ie, doubling as impedance halves), and the speakers are not very insensitive. Class A is usually great for lower volume listening, as it still remains dynamic.....but be warned, they get very hot and use a lot of power (everything has its price!)
 

tino

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If you have money to burn, then a couple of weird suggestions from me ... Beauhorn B2, Ferguson Hill FH001

I'll let people who know about these things make more sensible suggestions for you :silenced:
 
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I run my amp in class A mode (it has a switch allowing you to choose between class AB and class A). Class A is about 15W per channel and works absolutely fine with the RX6, no distortion at any volume you would actually want to listen at.
 

CnoEvil

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Oh, one more thing to bear in mind....your own speakers are likely to sound so much better - they are probably capable of much more than you realize.

So wait till you see how they sound on the end of these amps.
 

acalex

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CnoEvil said:
Hi there again. The Pathos Inpol has 45W and lots of current behind it, so will drive speakers of average sensitivity to reasonable volumes (I don't have a figure into 4 Ohms). I know the MF AMS 35i very well, as I own one; and it is the best sounding amp I've heard under £10k. It may only have 35W on paper, but this doubles into 4 ohms and again into 2 Ohms. It drives my Kef Ref 205/2 with ease in a large room, and they can drop to 3.2 Ohms. If you can slot one into your demo, it's a must hear, at the prices you are looking at. Compared to the Pathos Inpol, it (imo) has a deeper more controlled bass and is maybe a touch less "rich"...somehow it just sounds right. 35W can be enough if the amp has plenty of current (ie, doubling as impedance halves), and the speakers are not very insensitive. Class A is usually great for lower volume listening, as it still remains dynamic.....but be warned, they get very hot and use a lot of power (everything has its price!)

Cno, was waiting for your answer! :)
You are talking about the Inpol2 which has 45W, right? I definitely want to hear an AMS35i and this is by far much easier to find here in Brussels as well. So my speakers should be quite ok at 90db, right? How would you see the match AMS35i + RX6?

Pathos products are very appealing but unfortunately not easy to find around here. First contact with a dealer "around" (meaning another country, 200km drive) wasn't very positive...he wanted to know if I was interested to buy even before auditioning...which I didn't find very serious to be honest. Still the AN Soro SE in the list as well (dealer said RX6 should be fine and they match the soro with a wide range o speakers)...but with "only" 18W class A output. Again a long drive to audition that...need to take a day off from work and drive a bit...cz the dealer of AN won't keep the Soro SE ex-demo for longer...

Volume is not a problem...is indeed the best for me because don't go too loud..
 

acalex

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tino said:
If you have money to burn, then a couple of weird suggestions from me ... Beauhorn B2, Ferguson Hill FH001

I'll let people who know about these things make more sensible suggestions for you :silenced:

Weird? Never heard of those indeed... :)
 

acalex

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daskeg said:
I run my amp in class A mode (it has a switch allowing you to choose between class AB and class A). Class A is about 15W per channel and works absolutely fine with the RX6, no distortion at any volume you would actually want to listen at.

Ahhh, very nice!! You gave my hope... :cheers:
 

acalex

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CnoEvil said:
Oh, one more thing to bear in mind....your own speakers are likely to sound so much better - they are probably capable of much more than you realize. So wait till you see how they sound on the end of these amps.

I think (and hope) so as well. I mean...I already like the sound they make with Vincent...really would like to see the outcome with those amp...can't wait to find out!
 

WishTree

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Hi. I used to have Pathos Inpol2 but for convenience, I have a different set up. As I am based out of Germany, I can hook you up to the Pathos dealer that I dealt with , if you are interested.
 

CnoEvil

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acalex said:
Cno, was waiting for your answer! :)
You are talking about the Inpol2 which has 45W, right? I definitely want to hear an AMS35i and this is by far much easier to find here in Brussels as well. So my speakers should be quite ok at 90db, right? How would you see the match AMS35i + RX6?

You'll have to excuse me if I start waxing lyrical about this amp as I rate it so highly.

Before I got it, I was using an Arcam AVR600, bi-amped into the Kefs. I then borrowed a series of respected amps to try at home. These included Moon i7, Coda CS and MF M6i, as well as the 35i. It was only the 35i that left a lasting impression. At the time I thought it was too expensive so I brought it back.

The trouble was, I missed it every time I put on a bit of music, and eventually I gave in, and when offered one as a good deal, went for it...and have never regretted the decision.

So in what way does it sound so good. It is like amalgamating the best of tubes and solid state. It has lightening transient response, is incredibly clear but still sweet and musical...it's like a vail of "grunge" has been removed revealing the music underneath.

The other thing that struck me was the bass. I kept having to check that the sub wasn't on.

Well recorded music is stunning, yet less good recordings are still very tolerable. It seems to just get out of the way, so you are listening to the music and not the amp. Pianos sound like they should, violins are full of emotion without any hard edge and voices sound natural.....
but all this you will have to discover for yourself.

If you like your speakers with the Vincent, I suspect you are in for a treat with the MF....either that, or I will have some serious "eating of words" to do. Though saying that, it was HiFi World's best integrated amp, in their awards.

If you bargain hard, you should be able to get 10% off the list price. If you have trouble with this, Indra is the person to contact at MF.

Anyway I have been effusive enough for one evening.

Cno
 

CnoEvil

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WishTree said:
Hi. I used to have Pathos Inpol2 but for convenience, I have a different set up. As I am based out of Germany, I can hook you up to the Pathos dealer that I dealt with , if you are interested.

....you did that on the quiet. :O

How are you getting on with your new system? Are you missing the Inpol?

Cno
 
acalex said:
Hello to everyone,

since I decided to upgrade my ampli, I am thinking about going down the road of a pure class A amp. What I have noticed is that all the ones I am looking at share a theoretically low power output (from 10W from Pathos Inpol to I think 35W of the AMS35i from musical fidelity)...which kind of speakers do you match with those ampli?

I have a pair of Monitor Audio RX6 which are teoretically 90dB and require a 40-125W amplification...does this mean I should look at other speakers if I want an A class amplifier? Or this range is purelly theoretically?

Again...my living room is around 16sqm and heavily furnished (carpet, desk, table, bookshelf, sofa, wooden floor etc...) and I do not listen to loud music (9 o'clock has been my max so far...but still can't keep for long because of the neighbours)

Any thoughts on this?

Thanksssssss

Hi acalex

I'll recommend that you also consider the Plinius Hiato amplifier :twisted: The Hiato's ability to energize the Silver RX6's and the synergy between the Hiato and the Silver RX6's is superb :)

The rDAC and Silver RX6's are perfectly capable of being partnered with these amplifiers however you'll also have to look at even higher quality source component and speakers (such as Chord Electronics QBD76 DAC, Monitor Audio Platinum Series speakers etc.) to really match the quality of these amplifiers. I'll also recommend that with you use your new amplification for some time to come and so as to gain experience of the new amp/your system before making other changes.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft
 

Macspur

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Hi Acalex,

As you see from my sig I have a class A amp and use ATC SCM 40's and I highly recommend this combo... very similar to Cno's amp, but perhaps not quite so weighty in the base. With ATC they are so transparrent you will only hear what's on the recording, base is real base, no over bloated boom! The Suggy adds a real texture to the music, almost physical.
 

acalex

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daskeg said:
I run my amp in class A mode (it has a switch allowing you to choose between class AB and class A). Class A is about 15W per channel and works absolutely fine with the RX6, no distortion at any volume you would actually want to listen at.

Does it sound very different when you switch from AB to pure A class?
 

acalex

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WishTree said:
Hi. I used to have Pathos Inpol2 but for convenience, I have a different set up. As I am based out of Germany, I can hook you up to the Pathos dealer that I dealt with , if you are interested.

How did you find it? Why you decided to change?

It would be great if you could hook me up with the dealer indeed, thanks a lot!
 

acalex

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CnoEvil said:
acalex said:
Cno, was waiting for your answer! :)
You are talking about the Inpol2 which has 45W, right? I definitely want to hear an AMS35i and this is by far much easier to find here in Brussels as well. So my speakers should be quite ok at 90db, right? How would you see the match AMS35i + RX6?

You'll have to excuse me if I start waxing lyrical about this amp as I rate it so highly. Before I got it, I was using an Arcam AVR600, bi-amped into the Kefs. I then borrowed a series of respected amps to try at home. These included Moon i7, Coda CS and MF M6i, as well as the 35i. It was only the 35i that left a lasting impression. At the time I thought it was too expensive so I brought it back. The trouble was, I missed it every time I put on a bit of music, and eventually I gave in, and when offered one as a good deal, went for it...and have never regretted the decision. So in what way does it sound so good. It is like amalgamating the best of tubes and solid state. It has lightening transient response, is incredibly clear but still sweet and musical...it's like a vail of "grunge" has been removed revealing the music underneath. The other thing that struck me was the bass. I kept having to check that the sub wasn't on. Well recorded music is stunning, yet less good recordings are still very tolerable. It seems to just get out of the way, so you are listening to the music and not the amp. Pianos sound like they should, violins are full of emotion without any hard edge and voices sound natural..... but all this you will have to discover for yourself. If you like your speakers with the Vincent, I suspect you are in for a treat with the MF....either that, or I will have some serious "eating of words" to do. Though saying that, it was HiFi World's best integrated amp, in their awards. If you bargain hard, you should be able to get 10% off the list price. If you have trouble with this, Indra is the person to contact at MF. Anyway I have been effusive enough for one evening. Cno

This is music for my hears! :dance:

I want to exaustivley try all the mentioned amps with my speakers and the rDAC (for now) and see how the sound evolves. I believe what you say about the MF, it has to be amazing sound. I will try to get a good deal or to look at some ex-demos if I find it attracting as you said it will be :)

Fortunately the MF has different dealers around...two shops in Brussels itself! for that is very convenient...
 

acalex

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MUSICRAFT said:
acalex said:
Hello to everyone,

since I decided to upgrade my ampli, I am thinking about going down the road of a pure class A amp. What I have noticed is that all the ones I am looking at share a theoretically low power output (from 10W from Pathos Inpol to I think 35W of the AMS35i from musical fidelity)...which kind of speakers do you match with those ampli?

I have a pair of Monitor Audio RX6 which are teoretically 90dB and require a 40-125W amplification...does this mean I should look at other speakers if I want an A class amplifier? Or this range is purelly theoretically?

Again...my living room is around 16sqm and heavily furnished (carpet, desk, table, bookshelf, sofa, wooden floor etc...) and I do not listen to loud music (9 o'clock has been my max so far...but still can't keep for long because of the neighbours)

Any thoughts on this?

Thanksssssss

Hi acalex

I'll recommend that you also consider the Plinius Hiato amplifier :twisted: The Hiato's ability to energize the Silver RX6's and the synergy between the Hiato and the Silver RX6's is superb :)

The rDAC and Silver RX6's are perfectly capable of being partnered with these amplifiers however you'll also have to look at even higher quality source component and speakers (such as Chord Electronics QBD76 DAC, Monitor Audio Platinum Series speakers etc.) to really match the quality of these amplifiers. I'll also recommend that with you use your new amplification for some time to come and so as to gain experience of the new amp/your system before making other changes.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

Rick, thanks for your advise, I will certainly look up at this amp as well, thanks for the suggestion.

That's my idea indeed. I "played" a little bit with the Vincent, now I will buy a great amp and learn what I am looking fore before making any other change (source, DAC, cables...etc)

Thanks for the advise, very much appreciated
 

acalex

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Macspur said:
Hi Acalex,

As you see from my sig I have a class A amp and use ATC SCM 40's and I highly recommend this combo... very similar to Cno's amp, but perhaps not quite so weighty in the base. With ATC they are so transparrent you will only hear what's on the recording, base is real base, no over bloated boom! The Suggy adds a real texture to the music, almost physical.

This indeed one of the amps in my list! And yes I read the thread where you described the purchase of your ATC...for sure they willl be on my list when I will decide to upgrade speakers. :rockout:
 

WishTree

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CnoEvil said:
....you did that on the quiet. :O How are you getting on with your new system? Are you missing the Inpol? Cno

:) Yeah.. I was feeling that the amp deserves a better home and I could not possibly integrate the Inpol2 with a center speaker (Thanks to Mrs. WishTree, 80:20 music to movies has become 50:50!)

I have tried few power amps, the multi channel ones. Like the Rotel 1075, Audiolab 8000X7 and few others.. Also it was tough to compare the sound especially given Inpol2.. but the Arcam is wonderful.. It is brutally powerful but has a great control.. The warmth of the amp matches with the sweetness of Proacs. Though time to time, I think a floorstanding version of Proac might add to the scale..

Overall.. very happy with the change and new owner of Inpol2 is just like all of us.. very passionate and exctied.. I am glad the Pathos went to the home it truly deserved!
 

Zax89swe

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Id got class a rega brio r, would dali zensor 7 be a nice speaker for it? Had bx2 before but it was a little to bright and bass lacking.
 

acalex

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WishTree said:
CnoEvil said:
....you did that on the quiet. :O How are you getting on with your new system? Are you missing the Inpol? Cno

:) Yeah.. I was feeling that the amp deserves a better home and I could not possibly integrate the Inpol2 with a center speaker (Thanks to Mrs. WishTree, 80:20 music to movies has become 50:50!)

.....

How was the sound of the Inpol2? Which traits did you like the most? And which kind of music do you usually listen?

Thanks again
 

acalex

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CnoEvil said:
WishTree said:
Hi. I used to have Pathos Inpol2 but for convenience, I have a different set up. As I am based out of Germany, I can hook you up to the Pathos dealer that I dealt with , if you are interested.

....you did that on the quiet. :O How are you getting on with your new system? Are you missing the Inpol? Cno

Cno, difficult question...how do you think the Audio Note Soro SE would compare with the MF AMS35i and the Inpol2? In ideal conditions (meaning matching with right speakers which I might upgrade next year around Xmas already). As I am doing an investment for the future I would like to assess all different options!

Thanks again
 

WishTree

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acalex said:
How did you find it? Why you decided to change?

It would be great if you could hook me up with the dealer indeed, thanks a lot!

As I was writing in my previous posts.. Inpol2 is intoxicating.. There is no way any one can describe in words.. having said that it does (very slight tad) over do.. but in a good way.. That is where the partnering comes.. I mean if I had floor standing speakers, may be the Inpol2 would have added much larger grandness but nevertheless it is still awesome..

Unfortuantely HiFi is not the only hobby and with Mrs WishTree there is a considerable change in the listening times.. A decent Home Theatre system took priority as the center speaker was missed alot.. and my own learning about overhyped DACs etc, put me towards the practical direction of what I have now..

I want to share my thoughts about upgrade path.. since I have done a lot of upgrade (by any standards) during last few years

In my experience.. it is the synergy of all the components that makes the difference.. I once had a Parasound C2, A21 with my Proac and it sounded very best on the first instance, great combination.. where as on longer listening sessions I realized the width is missing.. but it is only a minor.. This is just an example.. there are various things that could tilt the scales..

So.. my suggestion is decide on the speakers first.. First reason is that they effect the sound more than any other component, imho, and second reason is since they are the bulkiest, it is better to have them narrowed down first.. This is like 50% done..

Then of course the amplifier.. Class A / Valves / Monoblocks etc are exotic which offer more amount of personality but there are flip sides too.. like large power consumption, excessive heat generation, valves may need replacement, too bulky and occupy a lot of space.. but it is easier to experiment with.. which is like 45%. If I have to chose Integrated vs pre/power, I would go for the later route. Ideally, in my world, all pres should have a DAC builtin!

then the rest is the source / dac.. this is one hyped product area as per me.. of course a matching CD player to the amp makes a great sense as they are really tuned together (like the Marantz Pearl) but otherwise it only boils down to fine tuning.. no matter how great a DAC is perceived, with out the true match between the amp & speakers , the whole system will end up sounding bad proably..

The dealer that I work with is called Projekt Akustik. (http://www.projekt-akustik.de/) I interact with Tobias.. he speaks English too and is very knowledgable. You can take their number from the website, give a call and ask for Tobias.. It should be that easy, I guess! ( I hope I am not breaking any house rules here, by giving a dealer's name. If so, please let me know )
 

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