Should I sell my Arcam A85 and CD72?

[admin_exported]

Might sounds odd, but I hanker after a change and have wondered about

Denon DM38DAB

Marantz PM6003

Yamaha A-S500

Rotel RA04 SE

Pioneer A-A6

Will be going with MA BX2 speakers and maybe I will not bother with a CD player any more, am yet to decide on that aspect, just want a decent starting point.

My question is will I be pleasantly surprised at a change or totally gutted? I am thinking that 10 years old Arcam amp may be matched by todays 'entry level' amps.

Any suggestions ideas?

I listen to Alternative, Trip Hop, Hip Hop, classical but mainly stuff like Depeche Mode, Muse, Massive Attack, Chemicals et al and lots of 80s types.

Thanks.

 

[scene]

I love my A85 - I've had it since new, and have not yet heard anything that wants to make me replace it. I know a number of posters here who have had A85 and have replaced them - some are happy, some seem to regret their decision. I would consider, before replacing your amp, trying it with some better speakers, as I thing the A85 could drive them. Maybe some MA RX6 or MA Rs6 (as these would be almost as good, and considerably cheaper).

To answer your original question, I think you will be surprised as to how well the A85 stands up to a lot of amps today, I think it's better than entry level, easily.

 

[Anonymous]

Way to throw a spanner in the works lol of my idea!

I thank you for your opinion though and am now considering it. So any other speakers you might recommend to partner this admittedly beautiful amp?

Thanks scene.

 

[plastic penguin]

Way to throw a spanner in the works lol of my idea!

I thank you for your opinion though and am now considering it. So any other speakers you might recommend to partner this admittedly beautiful amp?

Thanks scene.

MAs are a great match with Arcam. If you want to up the ante a little (price-wise) you could also consider Totem Arro. Fabulous speakers and should be a dream match for the A85.

 

[Anonymous]

plastic penguin is spot on.

 

[CnoEvil]

I love my A85 - I've had it since new, and have not yet heard anything that wants to make me replace it. I know a number of posters here who have had A85 and have replaced them - some are happy, some seem to regret their decision. I would consider, before replacing your amp, trying it with some better speakers, as I thing the A85 could drive them. Maybe some MA RX6 or MA Rs6 (as these would be almost as good, and considerably cheaper).

To answer your original question, I think you will be surprised as to how well the A85 stands up to a lot of amps today, I think it's better than entry level, easily.

+1

Change the speakers not the Arcam kit if you need a change, but I would say that as I like Arcam more than your short list.

If you like "the Arcam sound", you have to be careful with what you replace it with. That exciting sound in the demo can become tiring on longer sessions.

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

My question is will I be pleasantly surprised at a change

I doubt it. if you want pleasant change you should aim at 1500 - 2000 GBP price point and not 500 GBP.

I am thinking that 10 years old Arcam amp may be matched by todays 'entry level' amps

don't be silly. for 30 years solid state amps' construction is USUALLY a variation over the same theme: MOSFET + current negative feedback. only packaging is constantly changing and they are propably using cheaper and cheaper components to meet more aggressive price points. if you really want progres look at brands like Lavardin, Pathos, Pass Labs or Dart Zeel for instance. but amps of those manufacturers may be beyond your budget. if you want to get more natural and organic sounding amp for more acceptable amount of cash get yourself some tubes.

 

[CnoEvil]

if you really want progres look at brands like Lavardin, Pathos, Pass Labs or Dart Zeel for instance. but amps of those manufacturers may be beyond your budget. if you want to get more natural and organic sounding amp for more acceptable amount of cash get yourself some tubes.

Some wonderful makes mentioned here. All would make great upgrades for Arcam. Sometimes it's worth saving and getting it right first time; it can end up cheaper as well (speaking from experience.)

The Lavardin is a very interesting choice if performance is more important than extras (like a remote).
Dart Zeel might just be a smidgon over budget.

Tube amps are great but often need sensitive speakers.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the suggestions so far. I am looking at speakers now, with a focus on some RS6s.

I am intrigued by the amp recommendations oldric_naubhoff, not familiar with those and would be a nice idea for the future, didn't mean to be silly, sorry, lol.

Will attempt to listen to some other speakers but the MAs sound a safe bet without listening to from what I have read. I am sure I won't be disappointed.

With a plan to go from the hard drive now so to speak and leave the CD player behind (after some good testing of course) I suppose an external DAC is a no brainer??? Is the DACMagic still the one at the 250 pound mark?

 

[plastic penguin]

Thanks for the suggestions so far. I am looking at speakers now, with a focus on some RS6s.

I am intrigued by the amp recommendations oldric_naubhoff, not familiar with those and would be a nice idea for the future, didn't mean to be silly, sorry, lol.

Will attempt to listen to some other speakers but the MAs sound a safe bet without listening to from what I have read. I am sure I won't be disappointed.

With a plan to go from the hard drive now so to speak and leave the CD player behind (after some good testing of course) I suppose an external DAC is a no brainer??? Is the DACMagic still the one at the 250 pound mark?

The RS6 are a fabulous choice for the DIVA range. Had my A65+ and RS6s for years and loved it.

If you're looking at upgrading the source and budget DACs are of interest, I would look at Arcam CD192 or Exposure 2010S. Both are absolutely stonking for the money. I doubt a budget DAC will be as good as the CDPs I've suggested.

 

[CnoEvil]

Thanks for the suggestions so far. I am looking at speakers now, with a focus on some RS6s.

I am intrigued by the amp recommendations oldric_naubhoff, not familiar with those and would be a nice idea for the future, didn't mean to be silly, sorry, lol.

Will attempt to listen to some other speakers but the MAs sound a safe bet without listening to from what I have read. I am sure I won't be disappointed.

With a plan to go from the hard drive now so to speak and leave the CD player behind (after some good testing of course) I suppose an external DAC is a no brainer??? Is the DACMagic still the one at the 250 pound mark?

It's only "silly" if you jump in blind and spend money.

Advice is free, but who do you listen to?.....now that's a whole new can of worms.

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

didn't mean to be silly, sorry, lol.

no, I'm sorry. I shouldn't have written it but I didn't mean anything wrong. just an expression . hope I didn't offended anybody.

 

[Anonymous]

As mentioned above, think carefully before changing the a85. I sold mine and have had cyrus 8vs2 and nait 5i amps since. Both were great to audition and both were an improvement on the arcam in some respects but not in others. I found that i could listen all night to the arcam and didn't want to stop listening. This was something i havent experienced to the same extent since and both have been sold.

I would seriously consider looking for a p85 to bi-amp your speakers before changing them if you like the arcam sound.

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

hot thread.

I would look at Arcam CD192 or Exposure 2010S. Both are absolutely stonking for the money. I doubt a budget DAC will be as good as the CDPs I've suggested.

I heard Exposure 2010s for a brief while with a matching CDP. great soundstage...

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Might sounds odd, but I hanker after a change and have wondered about

Denon DM38DAB

Marantz PM6003

Yamaha A-S500

Rotel RA04 SE

Pioneer A-A6

Will be going with MA BX2 speakers and maybe I will not bother with a CD player any more, am yet to decide on that aspect, just want a decent starting point.

My question is will I be pleasantly surprised at a change or totally gutted? I am thinking that 10 years old Arcam amp may be matched by todays 'entry level' amps.

Any suggestions ideas?

I listen to Alternative, Trip Hop, Hip Hop, classical but mainly stuff like Depeche Mode, Muse, Massive Attack, Chemicals et al and lots of 80s types.

Thanks.

Hi max normal

If you are happy to consider used/discontinued amplification then you can have a significant improvement over the A85. An amplifier such as Rotel's superb RA-1062 is one to look at The RA-1062 was also in production at the same time as the A85. A RA-1062 will simply energize speakers such as the excellent Monitor Audio BX2's, RS6's etc. and happily bounce them around the room :bigsmile:

Depending on condition and finish RA-1062's can be had for £300 - £400.

As for DAC's the DacMagic is an excellent product. For a worthwhile improvement look at Rega's DAC.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for the response.

I really like that Rotel, but I think I had better just stick to speakers for my own sanity.

No biggy oldric_naubhoff I was only joking myself hence the lol.

I would love to upgrade amp but I think I will plump for some nice speakers more than likely the RS6s and at a later stage look to the amp and THEN more speakers no doubt.

But a P85, now that I could go for!

I am unsure why I question a good thing, even with my stereo.

Just cos it's getting older (like me!) doesn't mean it has lost anything I suppose...(like me?)

 

[plastic penguin]

Might sounds odd, but I hanker after a change and have wondered about

Denon DM38DAB

Marantz PM6003

Yamaha A-S500

Rotel RA04 SE

Pioneer A-A6

Will be going with MA BX2 speakers and maybe I will not bother with a CD player any more, am yet to decide on that aspect, just want a decent starting point.

My question is will I be pleasantly surprised at a change or totally gutted? I am thinking that 10 years old Arcam amp may be matched by todays 'entry level' amps.

Any suggestions ideas?

I listen to Alternative, Trip Hop, Hip Hop, classical but mainly stuff like Depeche Mode, Muse, Massive Attack, Chemicals et al and lots of 80s types.

Thanks.

Hi max normal

If you are happy to consider used/discontinued amplification then you can have a significant improvement over the A85. An amplifier such as Rotel's superb RA-1062 is one to look at The RA-1062 was also in production at the same time as the A85. A RA-1062 will simply energize speakers such as the excellent Monitor Audio BX2's, RS6's etc. and happily bounce them around the room :bigsmile:

Depending on condition and finish RA-1062's can be had for £300 - £400.

As for DAC's the DacMagic is an excellent product. For a worthwhile improvement look at Rega's DAC.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

Wondered how long it would take to dish out that old chestnut. The A85, not the most dynamic of amps, will have talents that others will not reach. Yes Rotel RA-1062 is a fab amp but two points I'd like to mention: Firstly, the 1062 is very rarely on auction sites so the likelihood of picking one up in very good condition will be difficult at best. Secondly, Rotel, all Rotels I've heard, is not a good match with MA RS range.

Surprised you didn't mention your other play thing: Nads... . Certainly a better match than Rotel.

 

[oldric_naubhoff]

Tube amps are great but often need sensitive speakers.

it's true but not necessarily has to be so. if you're looking at SETs (single ended triode) you definitely have to get some speakers specially designed for such amps, i.e. very high efficiency and very easy impedance plot is a must if you want to get convincing dynamics. however, more powerfull ultralinear designs should work ok with normal speakers. for instance MA RX1. manufacturer says they're 89db @ 1W. this is very decent result and an amp with 40 - 45 Wpc shouldn't have any problems driving them to loud volume levels. I red a review of 35 Wpc Prima Luna amp driving some Cabasse Iroise 3 florstanders (3 way, 92db sensitivity, with 3,5 Ohm impedance dip) and the autor was impressed how mighty this combo sounded.

I unfortunately never had a chance to hear a good tube amp so far. but I own a hybrid with tubes in pre stage. it's 70 Wpc driving 85db sensitive monitors and I never had a feeling that I'm lacking power. in fact i rarely reach 50 (on 100 digital scale) because it's loud enough in my 4m*4m room.

 

[CnoEvil]

Tube amps are great but often need sensitive speakers.

it's true but not necessarily has to be so. if you're looking at SETs (single ended triode) you definitely have to get some speakers specially designed for such amps, i.e. very high efficiency and very easy impedance plot is a must if you want to get convincing dynamics. however, more powerfull ultralinear designs should work ok with normal speakers. for instance MA RX1. manufacturer says they're 89db @ 1W. this is very decent result and an amp with 40 - 45 Wpc shouldn't have any problems driving them to loud volume levels. I red a review of 35 Wpc Prima Luna amp driving some Cabasse Iroise 3 florstanders (3 way, 92db sensitivity, with 3,5 Ohm impedance dip) and the autor was impressed how mighty this combo sounded.

I unfortunately never had a chance to hear a good tube amp so far. but I own a hybrid with tubes in pre stage. it's 70 Wpc driving 85db sensitive monitors and I never had a feeling that I'm lacking power. in fact i rarely reach 50 (on 100 digital scale) because it's loud enough in my 4m*4m room.

We have very similar views on what sounds good.

You are correct about tube amps, which is why I used the word "often", just to warn the OP of the possible dangers of going this route - which is probably academic at the moment.

Tube pre into SS power is a very nice compromise. 8)

It's nice to know of others that share my opinion.

 

[jiggyjoe]

If Arcam was still making the A85 I bet they would be charging around £1200 for it comparing it to there latest range.

+1 here for getting the p85 and biampling either rs6 or rx6. It really wakes this amp up dynamically, and can reach hi volume's with ease,but still lovely and smooth, with great bass punch.

sounds superb at wisper quite levels too something not many Hi-Fi's manage.

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Thanks for the response.

I really like that Rotel, but I think I had better just stick to speakers for my own sanity.

No biggy oldric_naubhoff I was only joking myself hence the lol.

I would love to upgrade amp but I think I will plump for some nice speakers more than likely the RS6s and at a later stage look to the amp and THEN more speakers no doubt.

But a P85, now that I could go for!

I am unsure why I question a good thing, even with my stereo.

Just cos it's getting older (like me!) doesn't mean it has lost anything I suppose...(like me?)

Hi max normal

Your welcome.

If you have speakers such as the RS6's in mind then i will still recommend looking at an alternative amplification rather then adding to the A85.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[jiggyjoe]

God Rick your recommended combo of dacmagic, rotel + rs6 could probably cause tinitus in the local bat population. lol.

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Might sounds odd, but I hanker after a change and have wondered about

Denon DM38DAB

Marantz PM6003

Yamaha A-S500

Rotel RA04 SE

Pioneer A-A6

Will be going with MA BX2 speakers and maybe I will not bother with a CD player any more, am yet to decide on that aspect, just want a decent starting point.

My question is will I be pleasantly surprised at a change or totally gutted? I am thinking that 10 years old Arcam amp may be matched by todays 'entry level' amps.

Any suggestions ideas?

I listen to Alternative, Trip Hop, Hip Hop, classical but mainly stuff like Depeche Mode, Muse, Massive Attack, Chemicals et al and lots of 80s types.

Thanks.

Hi max normal

If you are happy to consider used/discontinued amplification then you can have a significant improvement over the A85. An amplifier such as Rotel's superb RA-1062 is one to look at The RA-1062 was also in production at the same time as the A85. A RA-1062 will simply energize speakers such as the excellent Monitor Audio BX2's, RS6's etc. and happily bounce them around the room :bigsmile:

Depending on condition and finish RA-1062's can be had for £300 - £400.

As for DAC's the DacMagic is an excellent product. For a worthwhile improvement look at Rega's DAC.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

Wondered how long it would take to dish out that old chestnut. The A85, not the most dynamic of amps, will have talents that others will not reach. Yes Rotel RA-1062 is a fab amp but two points I'd like to mention: Firstly, the 1062 is very rarely on auction sites so the likelihood of picking one up in very good condition will be difficult at best. Secondly, Rotel, all Rotels I've heard, is not a good match with MA RS range. Surprised you didn't mention your other play thing: Nads... . Certainly a better match than Rotel.

Hi plastic penguin

Yes, the RA-1062 is a fabulous amp The main reason RA-1062's are rare could be down to owners wanting to hold on to them :bigsmile: Since the last time i asked you have you now heard a RA-1062? If so, have you heard the RA-1062 with any of the RS range?

Btw, over a five year period i demonstrated the A85 on 147 occasions. Not one A85 was sold regardless of source components and speakers used. So, i am intrigued to know as what talents you feel the A85 has which 'others will not reach'?

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[plastic penguin]

Might sounds odd, but I hanker after a change and have wondered about

Denon DM38DAB

Marantz PM6003

Yamaha A-S500

Rotel RA04 SE

Pioneer A-A6

Will be going with MA BX2 speakers and maybe I will not bother with a CD player any more, am yet to decide on that aspect, just want a decent starting point.

My question is will I be pleasantly surprised at a change or totally gutted? I am thinking that 10 years old Arcam amp may be matched by todays 'entry level' amps.

Any suggestions ideas?

I listen to Alternative, Trip Hop, Hip Hop, classical but mainly stuff like Depeche Mode, Muse, Massive Attack, Chemicals et al and lots of 80s types.

Thanks.

Hi max normal

If you are happy to consider used/discontinued amplification then you can have a significant improvement over the A85. An amplifier such as Rotel's superb RA-1062 is one to look at The RA-1062 was also in production at the same time as the A85. A RA-1062 will simply energize speakers such as the excellent Monitor Audio BX2's, RS6's etc. and happily bounce them around the room :bigsmile:

Depending on condition and finish RA-1062's can be had for £300 - £400.

As for DAC's the DacMagic is an excellent product. For a worthwhile improvement look at Rega's DAC.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

Wondered how long it would take to dish out that old chestnut. The A85, not the most dynamic of amps, will have talents that others will not reach. Yes Rotel RA-1062 is a fab amp but two points I'd like to mention: Firstly, the 1062 is very rarely on auction sites so the likelihood of picking one up in very good condition will be difficult at best. Secondly, Rotel, all Rotels I've heard, is not a good match with MA RS range. Surprised you didn't mention your other play thing: Nads... . Certainly a better match than Rotel.

Hi plastic penguin

Yes, the RA-1062 is a fabulous amp The main reason RA-1062's are rare could be down to owners wanting to hold on to them :bigsmile: Since the last time i asked you have you now heard a RA-1062? If so, have you heard the RA-1062 with any of the RS range?

Btw, over a five year period i demonstrated the A85 on 147 occasions. Not one A85 was sold regardless of source components and speakers used. So, i am intrigued to know as what talents you feel the A85 has which 'others will not reach'?

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

Hello Rick

Yup, agree wholeheartedly that a lack of 1062s on auction sites is because the owners keep hold of them. Nevertheless, the lack of this particular Rotel is not worth the recommendation if you can't source any. Or maybe I'm missing the point?

As I've always said on this forum that most of the "good" brands have their own distinct sound and, therefore, have their own strengths (and weaknesses). Arcam A85 is no different. The strengths are the midrange and top-end, which is sublime. The weakness from the Arcams I've owned and heard - which is most of the Alpha range and virtually all DIVA - is the bass can be slightly lumpy, if partnered incorrectly. The dynamics are good but not brilliant, hence why I never recommend any Arcam if a poster loves classical music. The Arcam in general has a slightly laid back presentation which is fantastic, if like me, the amp used for long periods.

Have I heard the 1062? possibly. Over a 20 year period or so I've heard most Rotel integrated amps with various set-ups, and the most recent was the RA-06 (orignal) with RS6s. Yes, good fast bass but somehow it didn't hang together as it should. For me the top end of a Rotel with RS6 is too spikey.

With MA RS6 I really do believe that a Nad 352 is better.

Cheers.

 

[scene]

Sorry to throw such a spanner in the works, and then not post any further replies

I agree that a P85 is definitely worth considering to accompany your A85, especially if you get some MA RS/X6 to go with it. Don't bi-amp the MA bronze, as I think it does not add anything, and in many way detracts.

And now for another little spanner... I never said keep the arcam, just try it with some better speakers before you look elsewhere. If you like the arcam sound, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised by how it sounds with better speakers, MA silver, or the totems, I agree. If you don't like what you hear, you will probably need to consider a new amp and speakers.

As for the source... Try a C192, as suggested - well worth a demo.