Hello not sure about this one waiting for monitor audio bx2s to arrive as they are new do you have to run them in if so does that half volume only??? for how long?? help me please
thanks Martin...
thanks Martin...
Running in????
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Just use them...
Some people say you should face them towards each other and change the polarity (or similar but someone will be along to correct I'm sure). Others say to get a burn in disc like the one Monitor Audio sell etc...
Personally get them set up where you want them (on stands, shelves etc...); plug them in and enjoy them. Listen to them as much as you can with low to medium levels of volume and then creep it up a bit every so often to give the drivers a good working
When I've had new speakers and I've been out of the house for an hour or so doing chores; I've just left the system running...
Some people say you should face them towards each other and change the polarity (or similar but someone will be along to correct I'm sure). Others say to get a burn in disc like the one Monitor Audio sell etc...
Personally get them set up where you want them (on stands, shelves etc...); plug them in and enjoy them. Listen to them as much as you can with low to medium levels of volume and then creep it up a bit every so often to give the drivers a good working
When I've had new speakers and I've been out of the house for an hour or so doing chores; I've just left the system running...
Thanks for your advice i do get bored asking these questions didnt want to damage them cant wait to gear them!!
chebby
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- Jun 2, 2008
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Wait until all the neighbours are out and 'thrash' them for a few hours. Done.
If this is not feasible (sensitive neighbours who never go out or whatever) face the speakers front to front (about an inch or two between them) and switch the polarity on one speaker only (do this whilst the amp is switched off to avoid any chance of short circuiting).
Now, even if you play them quite loud, the speaker cone movements will 'cancel' (as one moves out the other moves in because they are out of phase and so close to each other) and the sound level should be very low. Leave them like this overnight or whilst you are work.
If anyone tells you a speaker should take some multiple of hundreds of hours to break-in/run-in, then don't bother with them unless the sound is already great. Some people will never even get that much use out of their speakers in a year!
(I have seen figures between 200 - 600 hours quoted for certain brands which is frankly ridiculous.)
If this is not feasible (sensitive neighbours who never go out or whatever) face the speakers front to front (about an inch or two between them) and switch the polarity on one speaker only (do this whilst the amp is switched off to avoid any chance of short circuiting).
Now, even if you play them quite loud, the speaker cone movements will 'cancel' (as one moves out the other moves in because they are out of phase and so close to each other) and the sound level should be very low. Leave them like this overnight or whilst you are work.
If anyone tells you a speaker should take some multiple of hundreds of hours to break-in/run-in, then don't bother with them unless the sound is already great. Some people will never even get that much use out of their speakers in a year!
(I have seen figures between 200 - 600 hours quoted for certain brands which is frankly ridiculous.)
Burn in is a myth, there is no need to burn the gear in, especially electronics. Even with speakers (electro-mechanical devices) they shoud sound the same during the first minute and 1000 hrs later. Even if there are differences in mechanical properties of the drivers between these points in time, they are miniscule and do not matter. Moreover, the drivers are usually tested with (very) high-level signals as part of QC process so any 'break in' happens then.
What really happens during 'burn in' is you get used to the sound (of your new system).
What really happens during 'burn in' is you get used to the sound (of your new system).
The manual of my MA BR2 do give some instruction on running in periode....so, objectively something must happen with the speakers during that periode....
From the monitor audio site Faq section states that: Running in is a very important stage of owning a pair/set of speakers. If the speakers are driven too hard straight out of the box, it can cause permanent damage, much like running in a car engine. The average running in time varies across the ranges from 50 - 60 hours for Bronze up to 70 - 100 hours for Platinum.
bearwolfblade said:
If only MA (or anybody) could clearly explain what actually happens during the run in, i.e. what is actually run in? Which parts specifically? Which property of this part change and how much? And how does it affect the sound, quantitavely. The only flexing parts of a speaker I can think of is the rubber surround of the diafragm, the spider and two wires going to the coil. So, if you flex them by 1-2mm for 50 hrs it will sound noticeably better? come on!
For a car there are hundreds if not thousands of moving parts and tight contact/friction points including metal to metal so a comparison to a car is a bit far fetched.
hifi burn in is part of marketing.
I agree regarding electronics, that "burn-in" is a load of dangly fleshy bits. But I can guarantee my ADM9s were better after a few weeks. The reason I say that is I ran a series of test tracks and noted very carefully how they responded. Especially to deep, electronic bass. Don't get me wrong, they sounded great from day one, but they responded to my test tracks even better on my second run through, 3-4 weeks later.
fr0g said:
maybe. but - are you sure you will be able to blindly tell a 'non-run-in' pair from one that has been playing for 3-4 weeks?
AlmaataKZ said:
No. Not simply listening to music.
That's why I dug out the most stressful recordings I could find. It was the bass I was most concerned with. On certain tracks, all speakers start to get harsh at certain volumes. The Avis are no different (although very high compared to with any of my passives). After 3 or 4 weeks they handled the tracks even better.
If you wish to try a couple of them...
Biosphere – Oi-1
Aphex Twin – Ageispolis
Wow. I have just found out that Spotify from PC to Beresford to ADMs (analogue) distorts quicker than Spotify on Squeezebox to ADMs (optical). Why the hell should that be??*
*edit. doh, it's because on the PC I am using Equalify equaliser. When I turn it off it smooths out. Still odd.
fr0g said:
Frog, are you sure? Are you very sure? that it was not you getting used to the sound or smth else not related to 'burn'in'. And why/how are you sure/not sure?
AlmaataKZ said:
Well it's impossible to prove (easily). But I am pretty sure. I turned up the volume until they started to distort a little each time. The second try (seemed) to be quite a bit louder, but of course I am operating from memory. The only way to be sure would be to get 2 pairs side by side.
To add to that, when they were new, and pushed hard with such music, they emitted a slightly pongy smell. That's disappeared now.
Just to add, that with 90+% of my music they go too loud to be comfortable without a hint of audible distortion.
i think i know what avi would say! 
i would tend to agree with Almaatakz though, it's a long time with only your memory of how loud something was.
i would tend to agree with Almaatakz though, it's a long time with only your memory of how loud something was.
Craig M. said:i think i know what avi would say!
i would tend to agree with Almaatakz though, it's a long time with only your memory of how loud something was.
Possibly. But while I wouldn't bet my house on it, I reckon I'd risk a pair of used ADMs
And as for the smell. I could definitely blind test that!
This is a quote from Monitor Audio Platinum series manual:Running-In
As with all loudspeakers, the Platinum Series Loudspeakers require a certain amount of
running-in time before the very best and optimum performance is achieved. A running-in
period of approximately 100 hours should be adequate. A gradual improvement will be
noticed throughout this period. The time required will depend on the conditions in which
they were originally stored (cold or warm), and general household conditions (again, cold
or warm).
During the running in period play them at approximately half of your normal listening level
so that the drive units are not overstressed.
I take it as marketing speak, carefully worded to avoid any commitment or specifics. 'very best and optimum performance achieved' - no info on what performance parameters are meant and wehre these are best or optimum.
'gradual improvement will be noticed' - improvement of what? how much?
'100 hours should be adequate' - for what?
'time required will depend on...' - how will it depend?
'overstressed' what does that mean? some forces in the driver parts would go over design limits if I play them 80 or 90dB? nonsence.
excellent example of weasel wording
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weasel_word
As with all loudspeakers, the Platinum Series Loudspeakers require a certain amount of
running-in time before the very best and optimum performance is achieved. A running-in
period of approximately 100 hours should be adequate. A gradual improvement will be
noticed throughout this period. The time required will depend on the conditions in which
they were originally stored (cold or warm), and general household conditions (again, cold
or warm).
During the running in period play them at approximately half of your normal listening level
so that the drive units are not overstressed.
I take it as marketing speak, carefully worded to avoid any commitment or specifics. 'very best and optimum performance achieved' - no info on what performance parameters are meant and wehre these are best or optimum.
'gradual improvement will be noticed' - improvement of what? how much?
'100 hours should be adequate' - for what?
'time required will depend on...' - how will it depend?
'overstressed' what does that mean? some forces in the driver parts would go over design limits if I play them 80 or 90dB? nonsence.
excellent example of weasel wording
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weasel_word
It's just a hifi old wives story, spread by word of mouth, internet, dealers etc. Use logic not heresay.
I bought a pair of Mission M35s and a Marantz PM7200 about 10 years (ish) ago. In the shop, the setup sounded warm as a blanket (I liked big bass and a warm sound at the time, so this setup was perfect). When everything arrived, it sounded pretty harsh tbh. Then over the course of a month (without moving anything I might add) everything warmed up quite nicely, and sounded like it did in the shop.
Elastomers and rubbers have very complex deformation behaviours. Their physical links are not permanent, and the chains of monomers are subject to deformation. This may manifest in a reduction in stiffness in use over time, effecting the inertia of the speaker cone. Its only logical to assume a bedding in period as the material moves from its static and unused state to its deformed state after use. Its been a loooong time since Ive worked with materials though, so I may well be very rusty
Elastomers and rubbers have very complex deformation behaviours. Their physical links are not permanent, and the chains of monomers are subject to deformation. This may manifest in a reduction in stiffness in use over time, effecting the inertia of the speaker cone. Its only logical to assume a bedding in period as the material moves from its static and unused state to its deformed state after use. Its been a loooong time since Ive worked with materials though, so I may well be very rusty
Paul Hobbs said:I bought a pair of Mission M35s and a Marantz PM7200 about 10 years (ish) ago. In the shop, the setup sounded warm as a blanket (I liked big bass and a warm sound at the time, so this setup was perfect). When everything arrived, it sounded pretty harsh tbh. Then over the course of a month (without moving anything I might add) everything warmed up quite nicely, and sounded like it did in the shop.
Elastomers and rubbers have very complex deformation behaviours. Their physical links are not permanent, and the chains of monomers are subject to deformation. This may manifest in a reduction in stiffness in use over time, effecting the inertia of the speaker cone. Its only logical to assume a bedding in period as the material moves from its static and unused state to its deformed state after use. Its been a loooong time since Ive worked with materials though, so I may well be very rusty
Paul, I am not saying there is nothing happenign with materials (in the first hunderd or whatever hours of use). What I am saying is that nobody could describe in specific terms or demonstrate otherwise that these changes affect sound to any material degree. If change in the material in such short period of time/use was so significant the product is flawed. I am saying is that these changes are not audible and maybe even not measurable. I am also saying that if you tested yourself blind you would not be able to tell a difference between an out of the box speaker and one that has been 'run-in'.
AlmaataKZ said:
An easy boast to make, as it would be impossible for me to test a brand new pair of M35s agains a bedded in pair. I am not disagreeing with your experience however, bearing in mind your system is much higher spec than everything I have owned. I respectfully disagree however, as it was not a small diference between the shop speakers and the new pair. Sad face on christmas day, Paul was disappointed
I have had my dali lektor 2's since tuesday, i have noticed a steady improvement in sound quaility, they sound warmer and more smooth, is it the speaker breaking in? or perhaps my ears getting used to them? whatever it is, clearly something happens.
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