Rega P6 with Exact vs. Project X2B with Ortofon Red Quintet MC vs MusicHall 5.3 With Orto blue vs. Clearaudio Concept with Concept V2 MM cart

[Thomasg76]

Hey everyone,

I am starting my VInyl journey and well too much choice lol. I am eyeing the above as they are available around my area.

My setup is a Hegel H120 and Richter Wizard S6 speakers.

I have auditioned the P3 and the P6 and found the P6 was miles better than the P3 for some reason at my local dealer (which I found odd).
I like the design of all of them but they have pros and cons. Rega cartridge change is more effort as you need spacers etc.

The reason why I am thinking about the project is that my amp has a balanced input.

I am also considering getting a phono stage and would love recommendations for each combo.

 

[Al ears]

Welcome to the forum.
You are right in that whichever turntable you get you will need a separate phono preamp.
Do I take it you are in the States as Musichall decks are rare in the UK.
You are also correct in saying that adjusting VTA on Rega decks can be a tad problematic.
Balanced output from a turntable requires a special phono preamp. Some say it's simply a gimmick while others are convinced it has benefits.
If you simply must have it then the X2B would be the deck to get along with one of Pro-jects own balanced phono preamps. Also it's the only one on your list that has this function.
However, in my opinion, the best deck in your list is the Clearaudio.

 

[Thomasg76]

Welcome to the forum.
You are right in that whichever turntable you get you will need a separate phono preamp.
Do I take it you are in the States as Musichall decks are rare in the UK.
You are also correct in saying that adjusting VTA on Rega decks can be a tad problematic.
Balanced output from a turntable requires a special phono preamp. Some say it's simply a gimmick while others are convinced it has benefits.
If you simply must have it then the X2B would be the deck to get along with one of Pro-jects own balanced phono preamps. Also it's the only one on your list that has this function.
However, in my opinion, the best deck in your list is the Clearaudio.

Thanks. I am based in Australia nd got access to them here.

I was thinking for the Project I would go with the project balanced phone stage, but for the rega they separate them MM and MC which means if I want to go to MC later I have to buy a new amp.

I was looking at the ifi phono 3 which is very affordable but does both, just not sure it would compromise the result with the rega or the other tables..

I agree the reviews for balanced or not balanced phone are very mixed but my AMP supports it.

 

[Al ears]

Thanks. I am based in Australia nd got access to them here.

I was thinking for the Project I would go with the project balanced phone stage, but for the rega they separate them MM and MC which means if I want to go to MC later I have to buy a new amp.

I was looking at the ifi phono 3 which is very affordable but does both, just not sure it would compromise the result with the rega or the other tables..

I agree the reviews for balanced or not balanced phone are very mixed but my AMP supports it.

Rega do make MM + MC phono preamps , there is no reason to believe that the iFi will be any worse.
Unless you have money to burn and can afford around £400 for a cartridge I would suggest you stick to MM cartridges.
I am not aware of how much the turntables you list cost in Australia but I would stick to my original 'best buy' suggestion if it is not overly expensive compared to the others.

 

[Thomasg76]

Rega do make MM + MC phono preamps , there is no reason to believe that the iFi will be any worse.
Unless you have money to burn and can afford around £400 for a cartridge I would suggest you stick to MM cartridges.
I am not aware of how much the turntables you list cost in Australia but I would stick to my original 'best buy' suggestion if it is not overly expensive compared to the others.

The Rega P6 is on special at the moment here with the exact for 2399 AUD (which is the price without cartridge as well), The project is 2590 AUD, musichall 2390 AUD (or demo for 1990) and the Clearaudio is the most expensive at 2899 (without a cover)

Cartridge is an interesting one as the Rega Exact will be replaced with a new one with a Neodymium magnet mosrty used in MC but you can't get them packaged here yet but they are 650 AUD which is nearly the same case the Ortofon Quintent Red which is MC. So I am wondering what performs better a top range MM like exact or ND vs. lowprice/ midprice MC.

 

[Al ears]

The Rega P6 is on special at the moment here with the exact for 2399 AUD (which is the price without cartridge as well), The project is 2590 AUD, musichall 2390 AUD (or demo for 1990) and the Clearaudio is the most expensive at 2899 (without a cover)

Cartridge is an interesting one as the Rega Exact will be replaced with a new one with a Neodymium magnet mosrty used in MC but you can't get them packaged here yet but they are 650 AUD which is nearly the same case the Ortofon Quintent Red which is MC. So I am wondering what performs better a top range MM like exact or ND vs. lowprice/ midprice MC.

Low price hi output MCs are best avoided in my opinion. Until you can spend over £400 on an MC cartridge it is better to stick with moving magnet types.
I haven't heard the latest Rega ND cartridges so cannot comment on those.
NOTE: the Project comes with a cheap MC as these are the only type of cartridge that can be made to work with balanced output.
Hope this helps.

 

[daytona600]

XLR required for fully balanced ,
Project Melbourne ask to borrow one from your local dealer for the weekend

True Balanced Audio

One of the major challenges when designing a system that's built around vinyl listening is achieving clean, noise-free musical reproduction. At Pro-Ject we're always chasing the best possible analogue sound, and we’re excited to enhance that with our True Balanced Concept. At its core True...

www.projectaudio.com.au

Pro-Ject X2 B/Phono Box S3 B Turntable/Phono Preamp

Moving-coil pick-ups are inherently 'balanced' and Pro-Ject is determined to reveal them at their best with this balanced-wired version of the X2 deck and phono preamp One burning question is begged by the arrival of Pro-Ject's X2 B turntable and Phono Box S3 B phono stage: why did it take so...

www.hifinews.com

 

[Integralista]

Hi Thomas, I use mainly Rega turntables yet (some 26 years) and I am still happy owner. From my experience and looking on your very good amp/speaker combo I will recommend for you:

1. Rega Planar 3 with new MM cartridge Rega Nd 03 or Nd 05, both you can buy directly from Rega distributor in your area for a nice discount. This is simply awsome combination. As phono preamp I will recommend their Rega MM mk5 preamp. Here is serious review: https://www.whathifi.com/reviews/rega-planar-3nd3

2. Or in case you want to get higher with vinyl combo: Rega Planar P6 and cartridge Rega Nd 05 or 07. Both turntable and cartridge are a big improvement over P3/Nd 03. P6 is more close to P8 than to P3. But P3 is excellent anyway. Cartridges from new Nd line are their MM masterpieces. Nd5 is better than old mm Rega Exact. And Exact was also very good. Or you can opt for some Ortofon MM in version 2mr which means it has reduced "body height" and equals to dimensions of Rega cartridges. So instalation is also very easy on Rega turntables. In general Ortofon Black 2mr is direct competitor for Rega Nd 07 for around 600 eur. Ortofon has a bit more cold neutral sound. But very good indeed. Or you may take Rega Ania MC cartridge. I think better is more mature mm than "entry level" mc cart in this case. Rega is also very curious about response from market, if they will stop selling Ania or continue. ND 07 is very close to Ania or better in many aspects. But than you need very good phono preamp. I recommend to look on level like Rega Aria mk3. This is truly outstanding and durable, reliable phono. I have used Aria mk1 for some 9 years. Pls. think about phono preamp like about separate component, if you plan serious turntable like Planar 6 or better later. You run Hegel Amp, their Hegel V10 is also very, very good phono. Or Primare R35 mm/mc is also direct competitor for Rega Aria, or Vertere Acoustics Phono 1mk2L are best ones in this class.

Now, it is up to you to select some very good Turntable/cartridge/preamp combo. BR.

 

[Thomasg76]

Low price hi output MCs are best avoided in my opinion. Until you can spend over £400 on an MC cartridge it is better to stick with moving magnet types.
I haven't heard the latest Rega ND cartridges so cannot comment on those.
NOTE: the Project comes with a cheap MC as these are the only type of cartridge that can be made to work with balanced output.
Hope this helps.

Thanks for that. I thought every MC is balanced in nature

 

[Al ears]

Thanks for that. I thought every MC is balanced in nature

That's what I said.
All MC cartridges are of an intrinsically balanced nature, however you also need a balanced phono stage to make full use of it.

 

[Thomasg76]

Hi Thomas, I use mainly Rega turntables yet (some 26 years) and I am still happy owner. From my experience and looking on your very good amp/speaker combo I will recommend for you:

1. Rega Planar 3 with new MM cartridge Rega Nd 03 or Nd 05, both you can buy directly from Rega distributor in your area for a nice discount. This is simply awsome combination. As phono preamp I will recommend their Rega MM mk5 preamp. Here is serious review: https://www.whathifi.com/reviews/rega-planar-3nd3

2. Or in case you want to get higher with vinyl combo: Rega Planar P6 and cartridge Rega Nd 05 or 07. Both turntable and cartridge are a big improvement over P3/Nd 03. P6 is more close to P8 than to P3. But P3 is excellent anyway. Cartridges from new Nd line are their MM masterpieces. Nd5 is better than old mm Rega Exact. And Exact was also very good. Or you can opt for some Ortofon MM in version 2mr which means it has reduced "body height" and equals to dimensions of Rega cartridges. So instalation is also very easy on Rega turntables. In general Ortofon Black 2mr is direct competitor for Rega Nd 07 for around 600 eur. Ortofon has a bit more cold neutral sound. But very good indeed. Or you may take Rega Ania MC cartridge. I think better is more mature mm than "entry level" mc cart in this case. Rega is also very curious about response from market, if they will stop selling Ania or continue. ND 07 is very close to Ania or better in many aspects. But than you need very good phono preamp. I recommend to look on level like Rega Aria mk3. This is truly outstanding and durable, reliable phono. I have used Aria mk1 for some 9 years. Pls. think about phono preamp like about separate component, if you plan serious turntable like Planar 6 or better later. You run Hegel Amp, their Hegel V10 is also very, very good phono. Or Primare R35 mm/mc is also direct competitor for Rega Aria, or Vertere Acoustics Phono 1mk2L are best ones in this class.

Now, it is up to you to select some very good Turntable/cartridge/preamp combo. BR.

Thanks Integralista for the detailed writeup.

The Exact comes pretty much free with the P6 so I was thinking keeping it as a backup or as a start and then upgrade to the Nd5 or ND7. THe more I read the more it seems MC is a bottomless hole lol and very needs to be dialed in with the phono amp.

I would love to the V10 as phono or the R35 but that's way above budget at this stage unfortunately.
Still trying to be able to actually listen to the project somewhere as it surely has a different sound as well. ALso wondering if the P3 with Exact actually;ly sounds good too as I didn't like it with the elysis 2.

 

[Thomasg76]

Well i managed to audition the X1-b vs the P6 side by side hooked up to the rega mm phono and into a hegel amp. I must admit I was impressed with the X1 considering its quite cheaper than the P6.
I listened to Moonaghe Daydream which was super clear and crisp on the project and mantra from Sound CIty which sounded great too.
Mantra I must admit though sounded better on the P6 vs Bowie was better and super clear on the X1.
So I am wondering what the X2 with the MC would sound like 🤔

 

[Al ears]

Well i managed to audition the X1-b vs the P6 side by side hooked up to the rega mm phono and into a hegel amp. I must admit I was impressed with the X1 considering its quite cheaper than the P6.
I listened to Moonaghe Daydream which was super clear and crisp on the project and mantra from Sound CIty which sounded great too.
Mantra I must admit though sounded better on the P6 vs Bowie was better and super clear on the X1.
So I am wondering what the X2 with the MC would sound like 🤔

Much like the X1b I would imagine, depends on the cartridge fitted although I wouldn't be spending money on it unless you are going to use it with a Project balanced phono preamp.
Which cartridge was fitted to the X1b?

 

[daytona600]

Pro-Ject X2B + Ortofon Quintet Red + S3B will be the same price as a P6/with cart

Pro-Ject X2 B / Phono Box S3 B review

Pro-Ject backs balanced XLR connections for this turntable and phono amplifier pairing

www.whathifi.com

 

[Thomasg76]

Much like the X1b I would imagine, depends on the cartridge fitted although I wouldn't be spending money on it unless you are going to use it with a Project balanced phono preamp.
Which cartridge was fitted to the X1b?

Yes, i am planning on the Project DS3B for both players tbh as it has the most setup versatility for any cartridge down the track.
The X1B had the the Pickit 2 balanced on it factory fitted.

 

[Thomasg76]

Pro-Ject X2B + Ortofon Quintet Red + S3B will be the same price as a P6/with cart

Pro-Ject X2 B / Phono Box S3 B review

Pro-Ject backs balanced XLR connections for this turntable and phono amplifier pairing

www.whathifi.com

View attachment 7278

In Oz the X2B with S3B is 3150 AUD vs the P6 with Exact and S3B would be 3130 AUD so pretty much the same, but its MM vs MC.

 

[Thomasg76]

Should i worry about sellability when i want to upgrade lol? Rega seems to pop up more on stereonet etc. Haven't seen to many Projects. Is it because they are too good ;-)

 

[daytona600]

P6 with Exact and S3B would be 3130 AUD
3149 AUD Pro-Ject X8 Evolution
Project TTs offer Future upgrade path upgrade Tonearm , Cartridge , Balanced XLR cables , PSU etc

Pro-Ject X8 Evolution Turntable

Pro-Ject X8 Evolution Turntable. Order online or purchase in-store at Melbourne Hi Fi. Shipping available Australia-wide.

www.melbournehifi.com.au

Pro-Ject Audio Systems X8 Turntable

Inspired by the longstanding Xtension 9 turntable, the new X8 features a 9cc EVO arm with balanced connections to better serve the 'bundled' Ortofon Quintet Blue MC Launched in 2022, the X8 is the new LP spinner that Austria's Pro-Ject is betting on to entice vinyl lovers onto that next step...

www.hifinews.com

 

[Thomasg76]

P6 with Exact and S3B would be 3130 AUD
3149 AUD Pro-Ject X8 Evolution
Project TTs offer Future upgrade path upgrade Tonearm , Cartridge , Balanced XLR cables , PSU etc

Pro-Ject X8 Evolution Turntable

Pro-Ject X8 Evolution Turntable. Order online or purchase in-store at Melbourne Hi Fi. Shipping available Australia-wide.

www.melbournehifi.com.au

Pro-Ject Audio Systems X8 Turntable

Inspired by the longstanding Xtension 9 turntable, the new X8 features a 9cc EVO arm with balanced connections to better serve the 'bundled' Ortofon Quintet Blue MC Launched in 2022, the X8 is the new LP spinner that Austria's Pro-Ject is betting on to entice vinyl lovers onto that next step...

www.hifinews.com

View attachment 7279View attachment 7280

Would love that, but its as much just for the table as my budget is for tt and phono

 

[nopiano]

In Oz the X2B with S3B is 3150 AUD vs the P6 with Exact and S3B would be 3130 AUD so pretty much the same, but its MM vs MC.

For that expenditure I’d be very tempted by the Pro-ject X2.

In 2011 I looked at the Rega at P3 level and above but chose the Michell TecnoDec with a Rega oem arm, as the engineering and finish was far superior. Unfortunately the Michell has now doubled in price and is around £2,000. In any case it may not be available to you.

 

[Thomasg76]

Well, its on order and waiting to get the call from the dealer. Project X2B, Ds3B phono and Conect it DS balanced cable.

 

[Al ears]

Well, its on order and waiting to get the call from the dealer. Project X2B, Ds3B phono and Conect it DS balanced cable.

Certainly hope you enjoy your purchases