Reception Issues - Advice please!

[PJ1200]

Boys and Girls
I moved into a new house over 3 years ago and thought 'I'll sort out the tv ariel myself'! So I bought the biggest ariel from Homebase, and installed it in the attic. I bought a booster/splitter also and installed the 3 ariel leads that had been wired in the house to the splitter box. Job done.
A few months down the line, it became apparent that the reception wasn't very good - signal strength was down and got a lot of noise and cutting in and out whilst watching the majority of channels.
So I paid for some chap to come and sort it out. He did the usual 'oohh that's not a very good ariel, you need one of these'. We talked about putting it inside or outside and he suggested that inside would be fine. Due to cost, and the fact I'd already spent £100 plus on doing a rubbish job myself, he installed a new ariel in the attic. All seemed fine.
That was some time ago (over a year) and now, once again I'm getting poor signal strength. The TVs in built freeview systems suggest the quality of signal is excellent but the strength is not. There appears to be no correlation with other electrical appliances (i.e. when the washing machine is on, it's makes no difference). It's ruining my viewing pleasure. Last night I went up in the attic fiddled around and as a last resort, based on no knowledge whatsoever, decided to rap sheets of tin foil around the end of the ariel in an attempt to try and focus any signal!!
Surprise, surprise, it makes no difference!
So now I don't know what to do! Would spending x on a super dooper booster/splitter box improve things, or should I just admit defeat, learn my lesson and get someone out again - at yet more cost - to install (what will be inevitably the third ariel) on the outside of the house!
Does anyone have any other advice to improve picture??
I'm at my wits end - so any help would be very much appreciated!

 

[Anonymous]

I would have thought indoor aerials are usually having a harder time picking up a signal than outdoor ones; so my best guess is -especially if you live in a house with reinforced concrete walls- that the house acts as a Faraday's cage, i.e. blocking the signal.

Not an expert on this particular problem, though.
Best not to take action before you really isolated the problem.
Other forum members might know more.

 

[daveh75]

a sooper dooper booster wont improve things if the signal being recieved is poor to start with, it will boost it but will boost all the rubbish too, ideally the aerial needs to go outside, quality double screened cable should be used and ideally the aerial should be lined up using a signal meter,loft aerials are never much cop tbh unless you live with close proximity to a transmitter,

 

[PJ1200]

Cheers guys
Looks like it is as I thought - get a guy out to put an external ariel on!
The guy that originally put the one in the attic did use a signal metre, but obviously it wasn't a very good one!
I'm going to get Freesat when the new PVR's come out, but I'll still need an ariel for the tv's in the house that I don't have a box for, so might aswell get it sorted.
Thanks for confirming my suspicions guys.

 

[Anonymous]

In fairness 3 years ago aerial installes didn't understand as much about Freeview as they do today.

Get a certified Digital aerial installer or at least a CAI member to do the work for you.

 

[daveh75]

welshboy:

In fairness 3 years ago aerial installes didn't understand as much about Freeview as they do today.

Get a certified Digital aerial installer or at least a CAI member to do the work for you.
think your wrong imo, since digital terrestrial tv has been round a good 10-12 years now, and freeview to over from were on- digital left off

 

[Anonymous]

daveh75:welshboy:

In fairness 3 years ago aerial installes didn't understand as much about Freeview as they do today.

Get a certified Digital aerial installer or at least a CAI member to do the work for you.

think your wrong imo, since digital terrestrial tv has been round a good 10-12 years now, and freeview to over from were on- digital left off

A fair point. but I was an On-digital user and it all looked fine on my old narrowband aerial. Then just recently I went Freeview with a new Panasonic TV and DVD recorder after having Sky for a number of years. I had several weeks of poor reception and fiddling about before I got a competent pro in. Like the OP I could get the main BBC channels brilliantly even on an indoor aerial but the stuff on some of the other MUX was almost immposible to tune in and the quality was poor with freezing and blocking. Also there was only one aerial installer in our location who has the new digital certification.

 

[daveh75]

i know what your saying, but tbh when on digital was launched they took the if it aint broke dont fix it approach, i,e you only contacted them after you set up your box and couldn't recieve certain channels, then you paid them a fixed £40 fee an then they sent out a cetified installer to do the upgrade, i was indeed one of those installers, and had to spend lots of money on courses etc for the certifications, so we had the knowledge even back then in the early days, thats why i disagreed, so was more to do with on digitals approach than anything else, i suspect they took this approach because it must have been costing them a fortune, as although the customer paid the £40 for the upgrade,on digital paid the rest of the cost for the upgrade

 

[Anonymous]

daveh75:i know what your saying, but tbh when on digital was launched they took the if it aint broke dont fix it approach, i,e you only contacted them after you set up your box and couldn't recieve certain channels, then you paid them a fixed £40 fee an then they sent out a cetified installer to do the upgrade, i was indeed one of those installers, and had to spend lots of money on courses etc for the certifications, so we had the knowledge even back then in the early days, thats why i disagreed, so was more to do with on digitals approach than anything else, i suspect they took this approach because it must have been costing them a fortune, as although the customer paid the £40 for the upgrade,on digital paid the rest of the cost for the upgrade

Interesting- had not realised I was talking to the trade. - But then you did it right clearly. There does seem to be a bit of a problem with a lot of cowboys setting themselves up as installers at the moment when they know little to nothing about the business. I spoke to 4 locally before I found one who convinced me he knew what he was talking about and it's the best £80 I've spent in a long time. He checked everything out and only replaced what was required. Then he spent time with his assistant getting the aerial just right so that all channels could be tuned in with good signal strength and quality.

 

[daveh75]

your right there are a lot of cowboys who think you can bang an aerial point it in the same direction as other aerials in the area and job done, without getting out a meter and checking you've got good signal for all the mux's, that includes guys that are certified too, but there are good guys out there too, who may not have the certifications for what ever reason, i,e financial constraints etc, coz its not cheap keeping up with cia/digital/asha(sky) certifications especially if your a 1 man band for instance,but may been doing the job for years an may have forgotten more than others have ever learnt, so imo a piece of paper saying your competent isn't the be all and end all, sounds like you got 1 of the good guys though, and £80 was very reasonable,

 

[Anonymous]

1. Find out what digital transmitters are available (you can do this over the web by punching in your postcode at http://www.wolfbane.com/cgi-bin/tvd.exe?).

2. If you have a number of transmitters near you that use different bands, then you've got a problem picking which transmitter to buy an aerial for (leave to a pro). A closer transmitter does not guarantee a better signal.

3. If the transmitters use the same band, then get a banded aerial (not a wideband aerial which is the only aerial sold by DIY chains) and try each transmitter in turn.

4. Use double shielded aerial cable (again, not the stuff you buy from DIY chain stores).

5. Don't bend the cable sharply. This includes not using wall mounted aerial sockets.

6. Keep the cable away from any other electrical cables in the loft.

7. Make sure the aerial has a clean a route as possible to the transmitter (ie, no boxes or beams in front of it in your loft). I have to go through a communal part of the loft and found that I originally had the aerial pointing straight down a line of beams. One foot to the right and it's got a clear run and signal improved no end.

8. I'm no pro!!! Good luck!!

 

[Alsone]

Generally good advice Davy but a banded aerial isn't a good idea with Freeview - hence why Freeview recommend wideband themselves. Often the channels aren't in one group and with all the changes scheduled to Freeview over the next few years its quite possible they could move, rendering the aerial useless once more.

Personally, I'd get some advice about reception strength in your area and if you are in a weak area, consider going for a Cat 3 aerial such as a Televes DAT 75 with additional Margin Riser Device - at 31dB gain, this is by far the single most powerful wide band aerial you can buy. That said its large so perhaps not great in very windy areas - it will need strong brackets.

Your other (better) option, is ditch Freeview and go for BBC (not Sky) Freesat. Freeview has bandwidth problems and so is in my opinion, already effectively dead as there simply isn't the bandwidth for future tv developments / multiple HD channels - SD quality is going down by around 33% next year to make room for 4 HD channels. Freesat on the other hand is well equiped for a multichannel HD future and reception is almost guaranteed. By the time you've paid for a new aerial and fitting (with still no guarantee of good reception - a significant number of UK homes will NEVER get good Freeview reception), you might as well have paid for BBC Freesat. Its certainly no more expensive and probably cheaper - HD Foxsat box now down to £127 @ Comet with this code: FREESAT15 , fitting is around £60-70 incl dish, cable etc. SD boxes start around £45.

 

[Anonymous]

Doh! Glad I only paid £25 or so for the aerial then, plus it's in the loft so replacing it will be easy if I need to.

 

[Alsone]

Wavey Davey:Doh! Glad I only paid £25 or so for the aerial then, plus it's in the loft so replacing it will be easy if I need to.

Can't claim to be an expert but generally:

1. Like everything in life, you get what you pay for, cheap "contract" aerials often aren't very well constructed and so fall apart in strong winds easily - not a problem in your case as in the loft! The best aerials tend to use heavier grade aluminium and are of riveted construction rather than wing nut and bolt.

2. Loft is not the best place for an aerial. The roof will severely attenuate the signal you receive. Simply moving the aerial from loft to outside is worth several db's of gain.

3. Good cabling helps (especially in weak signal areas or especially where are long runs). It has better interference shielding and lower losses.

4. The aerial needs to be matched to your signal area as too much signal strength is as bad as too little. You don't want a 31 db Televes DAT 75 with MRD 100 yards from the transmitter and equally you don't want a low gain 8db panel aerial 40 miles out!

5. Banded aerials used to be better as they focus the gain in a particular area of the bandwidth quite tightly. You simply used to buy one that matched the tuning for your area. Many still do recommend these, but with Freeview it all depends on the area. Many areas have channels all over the bandwidth not concentrated together thus making them unsuitable (wideband needed). Other areas still have the channels grouped together but with changes to banding likely in the future, a banded aerial in these areas could become useless if the channels move later on. I think thats why Freeview themselves recommend wideband.

6. Consider Freesat! Almost guaranteed reception country wide, better quality picture, free HD, room for future developments. Only disadvantage is like any satelite service, heavy rain / snow might cause occassional break up. Then again high pressure does on terrestrial. Swings and roundabouts?

6.a) Don't like sat dishes? No excuses, get a see through one!:

This is actually a bigger dish than needed for Freesat mounted on a temporary stand. Picture is linked from the satellite superstore which I have no connection with and I'm neither recommending nor not recommending as a retailer.