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New Star Wars Movie is Poor - spoilers thread! Be aware of the dog. Woof.

gel

Moderator
What happened to Jedi training? These new kids just pick up light sabers and know how to work them? Shouldn't be called episode 7 more like new Star Wars with no training.
 
B

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW

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All the Star Wars movies are crap, well except 'Empire', which is ok.
 

strapped for cash

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Again, the thread title might be considered a spoiler, in the sense that expecting the film to be crap might spoil the experience. *smile*

I guess others can dismiss the title as one person's opinion, among the thousands already scattered across the internet.

I still think it's sensible to include "spoiler" in the title. That way others can contribute without worrying they'll give things away.

I purposefully avoided stating even a general view on the film's quality, as I thought this might prompt complaint.
 

Vladimir

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chebby said:
My favourite ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sv5iEK-IEzw

(occasional swearing)
That one is epic, but so are the RedLetterMedia Star Wars Reviews. :)
 

strapped for cash

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gel said:
Check out this R2DT has low power and will not awake, suddenly at the end of the movie R2 regains his powers. That's so poor.
I thought R2D2 could only be rebooted upon return of the missing map section.

I'll still hold off on voicing an opinion until it's clear going in that this thread contains spoilers.
 

gel

Moderator
strapped for cash said:
gel said:
Check out this R2DT has low power and will not awake, suddenly at the end of the movie R2 regains his powers. That's so poor.
I

I thought R2D2 could only be rebooted upon return of the missing map section.

I'll still hold off on voicing an opinion until it's clear going in that this thread contains spoilers.
I didn't read it like that.
 

chebby

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Jun 2, 2008
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strapped for cash said:
gel said:
Check out this R2DT has low power and will not awake, suddenly at the end of the movie R2 regains his powers. That's so poor.
I thought R2D2 could only be rebooted upon return of the missing map section.
No, that's a 2012 iPhone 5 with the 1st release of Apple Maps on iOS 6.
 

strapped for cash

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gel said:
I didn't read it like that.
This wasn't telegraphed, but it makes sense that Luke would conceal his location carefully and that this information would only be revealed once the map sections were united. Shutting R2 down and placing him among the Resistance seemed reasonable in this sense.

Much has been made of apparent plot holes, but these didn't bother me so much.

Even the climactic lightsaber battle makes sense once we appreciate that Ren was very much an apprentice, had little self control, and was injured before the duels began. Finn was easily knocked down and Rey is clearly a Skywalker, who had already got inside her brother/cousin's head.

I also think many questions/open ends will be answered/closed in the subsequent films.

I was more concerned by a lack of originality and attempted use of irony to undercut this problem.

There were so many possible narrative directions, but we got almost precisely the same films we've seen before, compressed into a 135 minute feature. It'll also be tricky to depart from these narrative trajectories to offer anything new. For me, this was the biggest difficulty -- on exiting the cinema it's clear that The Force Awakens had little to say, beyond nudging fans into recalling the earlier films.

Overall, this wasn't a bad film by any means, but it's not the triumph critics would have you believe (I think many temporarily lost their senses and will ultimately moderate their views).
 

chrissy657

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I think Ren will come more fearsome in the next two as it was mentions that he needs to finish his training. I think it also portrayed him as a raw character so that he can grow into the evil leader like Vader was.

I really enjoyed it although I thought they revealed his face to early.
 

Thompsonuxb

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Watched in 2d.

This is a good movie!

Knowing the history of how we got here is very useful and the 'missing years' will no doubt be filled in while building to the light v dark finale.

The premise of this film that 'it does not end happily ever after' adds some depth to the saga.

A's a stand alone movie it's pretty strong - as part of the saga it worked for me.

CGI as caught up with the original vision although the vertigo inducing final battle on the big screen of the original is missing
It works.

The series as stayed true to the original tale.

Worth watching.
 

strapped for cash

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gel said:
What about Ren being able to fly the Millenium Falcon then? It's just ********!
Do you mean Rey?

If so, this again isn't too great a stretch, since Rey's almost certainly a Skywalker, and both Luke and Anakin were accomplished pilots before starting their Jedi training.

I was more concerned that Rey and Finn stumbled upon the Falcon, which allowed Rey to meet her father or uncle, who in turn enabled Rey and Finn to link up with the Resistance.

The original Star Wars film relied on similarly absurd coincidences. It's implausible that R2D2 would crash on Luke's home planet, before being sold to Luke's uncle, setting the whole saga in motion.

Still, these character unions and plot devices were lazy and clumsy. I'm certain I could have found a more convincing way to move the narrative forward, given a little time to think about it.

My other complaint is that I would have liked to spend more time with the characters, since the film rushed from action sequence to action sequence, presumably through fear of audience boredom if more than ten minutes passed without laser fire. I liked Ridley's character (and her performance was solid; not that Star Wars is the greatest test of one's acting chops). The potential for genuine pathos was squandered here, while the film's emotional beats were too heavily derived from familiarity with established characters. I'm hoping Disney, Johnson, and Kasdan (if he's still involved) will slow things down next time and pay greater attention to character development.

Oh, and the sequence after the Falcon was captured, when the cast was chased by a CGI monster, should have been ditched completely.
 

gel

Moderator
strapped for cash said:
gel said:
What about Ren being able to fly the Millenium Falcon then? It's just ********!
Do you mean Rey?

If so, this again isn't too great a stretch, since Rey's almost certainly a Skywalker, and both Luke and Anakin were accomplished pilots before starting their Jedi training.

I was more concerned that Rey and Finn stumbled upon the Falcon, which allowed Rey to meet her father or uncle, who in turn enabled Rey and Finn to link up with the Resistance.

The original Star Wars film relied on similarly absurd coincidences. It's implausible that R2D2 would crash on Luke's home planet, before being sold to Luke's uncle, setting the whole saga in motion.

Still, these character unions and plot devices were lazy and clumsy. I'm certain I could have found a more convincing way to move the narrative forward, given a little time to think about it.

My other complaint is that I would have liked to spend more time with the characters, since the film rushed from action sequence to action sequence, presumably through fear of audience boredom if more than ten minutes passed without laser fire. I liked Ridley's character (and her performance was solid; not that Star Wars is the greatest test of one's acting chops). The potential for genuine pathos was squandered here, while the film's emotional beats were too heavily derived from familiarity with established characters. I'm hoping Disney, Johnson, and Kasdan (if he's still involved) will slow things down next time and pay greater attention to character development.

Oh, and the sequence after the Falcon was captured, when the cast was chased by a CGI monster, should have been ditched completely.
Yep, that's the one, I have already forgotten their names, says much about the movie. Look at Anakin Skywalker and all the training he had and Luke, I am not buying into it. The humour was poor too. Lucas should've done this movie.
 

strapped for cash

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gel said:
Look at Anakin Skywalker and all the training he had and Luke, I am not buying into it.
But Anakin was the best pod racer in the galaxy by age 10, with superhuman reflexes, zero force training and an abundance of midichlorians.

Luke, Anakin's son, destroyed the Death Star after a couple of lessons from Ben (Obi-Wan). This was before Luke encountered Yoda and began his force training proper.

Anakin is almost certainly Rey's grandfather, while Rey is either Luke or Leia's daughter, meaning her piloting skills can be explained by lineage.

gel said:
The humour was poor too. Lucas should've done this movie.
Honestly, the biggest laughs the prequels generated were unintended.

I agree, though, that some of the jokes in The Force Awakens were ill-judged and included to gloss over narrative problems and derivation.

Some of the humour worked. I enjoyed BB8's thumbs up, Rey's first Jedi mind trick, and Ren's initial tantrum.
 

bigboss

Moderator
Only skimmed through the thread as it contains spoilers.

Reviews don't agree with gel, 95% on Rotten Tomatoes which is a compilation of 275 reviews:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_episode_vii_the_force_awakens/

That's one of the best scoring I've seen in a while.
 

MajorFubar

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BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW said:
All the Star Wars movies are crap, well except 'Empire', which is ok.
To be fair it's all a matter of taste, I gave up following the Film Club thread very early on because I realised I'd probably prefer to lever my toenails off with a rusty nail than sit through some of the films rated highly in that thread. Takes all sorts, 'tis all I'm saying. :)
 

strapped for cash

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bigboss said:
Only skimmed through the thread as it contains spoilers.

Reviews don't agree with gel, 95% on Rotten Tomatoes which is a compilation of 275 reviews:

http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/star_wars_episode_vii_the_force_awakens/

That's one of the best scoring I've seen in a while.
Initial critical responses to Star Wars movies are odd phenomena, probably because of unparalleled hype and fervour. It can take months, even years, before some kind of equilibrium is achieved. Even then the initial crop of reviews creates some imbalance.

Each of the prequels garnered four and five star reviews from multiple established critics, who later revised their scores and opinions.

None of this means The Force Awakens is a bad film. It certainly isn't the abomination Gel's remarks suggest. But the current RT score (can a film's quality be measured in percentage terms?) points to a hype-induced, temporary loss of critical faculties, in my view. More balanced appraisals of The Force Awakens will emerge over time.

All that said, the film's fine. It's fun. Watch it. Just don't anticipate the second coming.
 

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