NAS recommendation ..has to do gapless

[SiUK]

Hello

As I have now exceeded the USB folder / file limit on my new M-CR610 (displays max of 5000 files/folders via USB attached devices) I need to sort out a NAS server for storing my music. So if anyone has any first hand experience I'd be grateful for input.

Basically I don't want to leave my PC on 24/7 with Serviio running..same kind of scenario as the majority I'd imagine. Music format will be flac only. Not bothered about anything else really. Oh, except I do rip the occasional DVD to mpeg or VOBs so that would be useful (usually because of NTSC region 1 discs as udp player not multiregion..).

I read somewhere that some of these devices don't support gapless flac, but as the CR610 does how does that work? I thought the point was to to 'stream' the bits to the Marantz and then the Marantz takes care of things after that? Bit confused about that bit. Anyhow, anything that messes with gapless is no good at all. I have just under 700 CDs so need space for them and for more as I am always adding to the pile.

I don't want to cobble anything together though but I'm not looking to spend a fortune either. Of course once music is in flac then redundancy is vital. How do you handle that aside of raid? Make a master backup and store it somewhere? Wouldn't ever want to rip all my music again - haven't even finished the move to flac yet...I did the whole lot a few years ago to 320kbps MP3s using EAC and LAME so this will be a one time only thing. Not enough hours in my life to keep repeating this procedure.

 

[SiUK]

Sokay. I read somewhere on these forums that there's been a gapless update for Synology NAS and they seem to have very good reviews, so will probably head towards a Synology DS213+ DiskStation and add 2 x 3TB WD Red drives to it. Strange how the enclosure complete with the same drives is so much more expensive than it is buying the enclosure and drives separately. £610.06 including 2 x 3TB WD drives but bought separately it would be approx. £260.97 + £108.91 x 2 for the drives so £478.79. That's a difference of £131.27. Seems a bit rich?
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[AnotherJoe]

Gapless playback is dependant on the mediaserver and the playback software - not the NAS itself.

 

[fr0g]

Exactly.

 

[SiUK]

So what media server does the Synology NAS run? Can you install any media server on it?

 

[nads]

So what media server does the Synology NAS run? Can you install any media server on it?

nope you are missing the point.

what are you going to use to "play" your music? that is what you need to consider as it may reqire some software on the NAS or it might not.

 

[SiUK]

I will be playing music via a Marantz M-CR610. I want to be able to use a tablet and or smart phone (or even TV) to select the music and be able to see the embedded artwork/ folder artwork rather than use the Marantz M-CR610 to navigate through all the music folders using the remote control and the limited OLED display.

As for missing the point, quite possibly. At the present time I can browse an attached USB drive (connected directly to the Marantz) and choose music to play from the folders on the drive. Not ideal, but okay. I have the Marantz remote app on my phone and I'm therefore able to select which music I'd like to play on the Marantz but the apps isn't great and you don't get to see the embedded artwork until after you have chosen music to play. I can also connect to a DLNA server running on my PC (called Serviio). I connect to it directly using the Marantz M-CR610 and again use the remote control to browse the flac library on the PC. It's okay, but not exactly what I am looking for, So I am therefore thinking that the NAS server replaces the PC and therefore has on onboard media server but if it is literally just network attached storage then it's not what I was thinking it was. I thought I'd seen a demo somewhere showing the Synology with a load of installable apps for that purpose. Perhaps I've got it all screwed up.

Anyhow, if you could spell it out for me I'd be much obliged.

 

[professorhat]

I think some people are confusing you unnecessarily. Yes, the Synology has its own media player called Audio Station, and yes, it recently got an update which means it supports gapless playback (link).

I think that's all you needed to know?

 

[nads]

I think some people are confusing you unnecessarily. Yes, the Synology has its own media player called Audio Station, and yes, it recently got an update which means it supports gapless playback (link).

I think that's all you needed to know?

and here we have the confusion between hardware and software a media player can be both.

so again you need to decide what is going to play the music.

as your CR610 can do you dont need a NAS that can. Your privious USB device did not but your CR610 did with no problems?

a NAS is just a big storage box in its most basic and does not need to do anything other than hold 1 and 0s

so do you want a NAS that will play the music or not?

yes run raid so that if one disc fails you can swap out the failed disc and not lose the data.

also have a copy on another disc somewhere else.

 

[professorhat]

With the replies SiUK has got on this thread, is it any wonder they're confused!

What is being asked is, what are you intending to use to play back music i.e. what will your interface be when choosing what music to play. If you're looking for something that can provide media server, then the Synology will do this with its Audio Station software, and this now supports gapless playback.

If however, you only really need the NAS to "store" the music, then the Synology will do this for you, but whether or not the NAS itself offers gapless playback is irrelevant as you won't be using its media server software in this case e.g. if you use a Sonos system as I do, it literally just reads the music from the NAS and the Sonos software is key as to whether it offers gapless playback - the underlying music store / NAS is irrelevant.

Hope this helps!

 

[Hi-FiOutlaw]

Two thing can happen if you buy a NAS:

- use it as a storage and audio player through is DS Audio player and control it with the app in your ithing.

but the Marantz need to have a USB input or a COAX ( but you'll need a USB/S/PDIF converter) because the NAS only has USB output, one way or another you'll be using the Marantz internal DAC.

- or use the NAS as a storage and use the Marantz as a Audio player. The Marantz need to have a ethernet (LAN socket) input.

If yes you can use it as a streamer and he will pic up the content in the NAS.

and a NAS is a bit more that a box to store 0 and 1.

 

[The_Lhc]

as your CR610 can do you dont need a NAS that can. Your privious USB device did not but your CR610 did with no problems?

He knows that but he doesn't like the app.

a NAS is just a big storage box in its most basic and does not need to do anything other than hold 1 and 0s

so do you want a NAS that will play the music or not?

I think he's made it quite clear that he does and has offered a suggestion (the Synology).

What I don't think he'll be able to find is an app that lets him use his TV for choosing the music etc, although I might be wrong, I've never used the Synology app, seems unlikely it offers that functionality though.

 

[AnotherJoe]

The only downside for Synology is an enthusiast. Most people will just use the DS audio app, and that will do what they want,

For the more advanced user with Linux skills....

The custom version of Linux they run (DSM) does not make it easy to install apps on it outside of what Synology offer.

If you want to install non-standard packages you need to use ipkg or rebuild them yourself. There is also a list of supported PHP apps on Synologys wiki page.

 

[SiUK]

Thanks for everyone's input. Appreciated.

@professorhat

Yes, the Synology has its own media player called Audio Station, and yes, it recently got an update which means it supports gapless playback. I think that's all you needed to know?

Yep, that's about right, thankyou for that.

@The_Lhc

What I don't think he'll be able to find is an app that lets him use his TV for choosing the music etc

I was actually thinking that might be the case, The _Lhc. But it wasn't essential...it was an afterthought tbh - my new TV has a web browser so was thinking I might be able to access the media server that way. But I'd be quite content being able to use a tablet and smartphone, so it isn't something I'll give any more thought to really. Thanks.

 

[SiUK]

@AnotherJoe

Thanks for that. I shall definitely investigate and evaluate options..

 

[Magic 99]

The Zyxel NSA325 is a cracking little NAS and I have been using two of them for a year. Has the Squeezebox server built in and this beams everything through Ethernet to my Marantz m cr510 beautifully. It also serves an Onkyo crn 755, Squeezebox and of course all PC's on the network being fast enough to serve the lot all at once without problem. It also has the Twonky media server (which I hate)

All of the music side goes from Zyxel, through Squeezebox server doing the DLNA bit, where it is picked up by my phone/Nexus 7 running Bubble UPNP which controls the Marantz. Works a treat!

I haven,t bothered with RAID, preferring to keep a separate backup of the library/disk elsewhere, for two underpant levels of safety.

 

[stevenjonas]

May I ask 2 questions, please?

The 1st relates to music.

I have the below equipment, which should be in the new lounge, once our new extension is built. Our computer is in 1 of our bedrooms that we use as a study. We have a BT Home Hub.

I was thinking of buying a Synology DS213+ DiskStation & adding 2 x 3TB WD Red drives to it, placing it in the loft & hard wiring it to the BT Home Hub. Then I was going to connect a Sonos Bridge to the BT Home Hub & connect a Sonos Connect to a DAC which I was going to connect to my amp. Then I was going to copy our CD collection on to the Synology unit using our computer. Is there any reason why that layout won't work? (I was also going to have a couple of Sonos 5 speakers configured for stereo in the kitchen.)

The 2nd question relates to all my DVDs. I was going to copy them on to the Synology unit too. If I buy a new TV, such as the samsung 7000 series, or equivalent, which I was going to hardwire to the BT Home Hub. Can I not just stream my stored films to my TV?

 

[The_Lhc]

I was thinking of buying a Synology DS213+ DiskStation & adding 2 x 3TB WD Red drives to it, placing it in the loft & hard wiring it to the BT Home Hub. Then I was going to connect a Sonos Bridge to the BT Home Hub & connect a Sonos Connect to a DAC which I was going to connect to my amp. Then I was going to copy our CD collection on to the Synology unit using our computer. Is there any reason why that layout won't work? (I was also going to have a couple of Sonos 5 speakers configured for stereo in the kitchen.)

No reason I can think of to suggest that wouldn't work, there have been suggestions that earlier BT Home Hubs can cause issues with Sonos but the new one is supposed to be ok, should be fine, although the usual advice about making sure you're not on conflicting wireless channels (set the Sonos to 1, 6 or 11 and the HH to a different number out of those three option, turn off all 40MH, turbo, wideband, 300MB/s options on the HH), reserving IP addresses for the NAS and Sonos on the HH etc all apply as normal.

 

[Hi-FiOutlaw]

May I ask 2 questions, please?

The 1st relates to music.

I have the below equipment, which should be in the new lounge, once our new extension is built. Our computer is in 1 of our bedrooms that we use as a study. We have a BT Home Hub.

I was thinking of buying a Synology DS213+ DiskStation & adding 2 x 3TB WD Red drives to it, placing it in the loft & hard wiring it to the BT Home Hub. Then I was going to connect a Sonos Bridge to the BT Home Hub & connect a Sonos Connect to a DAC which I was going to connect to my amp. Then I was going to copy our CD collection on to the Synology unit using our computer. Is there any reason why that layout won't work? (I was also going to have a couple of Sonos 5 speakers configured for stereo in the kitchen.)

The 2nd question relates to all my DVDs. I was going to copy them on to the Synology unit too. If I buy a new TV, such as the samsung 7000 series, or equivalent, which I was going to hardwire to the BT Home Hub. Can I not just stream my stored films to my TV?

Well if you are going to rip the dvds into the NAS then why not buying 2x4tb hard drives, the 213+ support them and tha way you'll have more storage space!

and yes you can connect the wifi hub of your home and tream mkv files into the smart tv, although you can have a better external player like WD TV live or the new Asus ( http://www.asus.com/Multimedia/OPlay_HD2/ ) and have a better picture quality.

regarding streaming Into Sonos I don't have any experience with Sonos, but someone will jump in...

I do stream my music files (Flac) into my DAC, it has a USB input and i use the Synology DS Audio app, it works very well and simplify the process.

 

[stevenjonas]

Thanks both, very helpful.

Whether I go for the Syndergy DS213+, the WD TV live or the new Asus (I presume that they'll all take music files in the way I described?) can I configure 2 x 4TB discs to RAID?

 

[Hi-FiOutlaw]

Thanks both, very helpful.

Whether I go for the Syndergy DS213+, the WD TV live or the new Asus (I presume that they'll all take music files in the way I described?) can I configure 2 x 4TB discs to RAID?

I have a 213 with 2x3tb but soon will upgrade to 4tb HD and i've got mine in RAID 1.

I only use the WD live for movie playing, for music playing i need to have the tv on and i think that is a waist of electric energy. So, for music i use DS audio App in my ipad, you can use what ever ithing you got.

 

[Hi-FiOutlaw]

The WD live is just a bridge to play digital contend within your home network the same as the Axus, but the Axus can store a 3,5 HD, in that case you wont need it.

I just advise you of the WD tv live as I have a smart TV as well and the player in it is not a good one, but mine is one of the first models, so maybe the new models have a better one. You can always try, and if don't like add a player later on.

 

[stevenjonas]

Am I correct that the Syndergy DS213+ is 'just' a NAS box, which allow one to add up to 2 x hard drives, whereas the WD TV live & the new Asus O!Play HD2 are music servers which will only allow the addition of one 3.5" disc or one 2.5" disc?

Also, the DS213air also allows for WiFi too. That seems to be the best NAS solution around at the moment?

In saying that, I'm very aware that we are already talking about yesterday's technology. Today's is cloud storage. As a dinasour, I'm still not keen on leaving everything on a cloud & having to pay for the priviledge.

 

[stevenjonas]

Many thanks for your advices. Having considered them & done a bit more research (with more to do before I put my hand in my pocket) I'm inclining towards the Syndergy DS213air with 2 x 3TB HDD (something like the WD Red) RAID 1 configured. 3TB HDDs seem much cheaper than 4TB HDDs at the moment. Is it easy to insert the HDDs in to the Synergy unit? & is it easy to configure the RAID1? I have Windows 7 on my computer, to which I will connect my Synergy unit via an ethernet hard wire as I suspect that will be quicker than doing so wirelessly.

 

[spockfish]

I think you made an excellent choice. Synology is one of the best (or even the) solutions for a NAS right now. Don't be worried about the configuration, it's a breeze, 15 minutes work. And I don't know where you from, but my dealer in the NL offers to install the disks and configure it for free.

Only remark from my side: go for the 214 if your budgets allows you to.