Marantz PM8005 vs PM7001 upgrade?

[Maestroelite]

Hi all, i was here some years back, but my user has expired, so created a new one )

I bought some B&W CM8 speakers around 3-4 years back to go with my Marantz PM7001 from 2006 and CD and tuner from 1999.
Its cabled with Tellurium Q black as i got a good offer.

I have been planning on upgrading for some time now and have been looking at Rotel because of the synergies i have read many people speak about, with B&W speakers.

However i have not found the product i wanted yet, and it has maybe been a bit expensive.

Because i like the Marantz sound still, i have now turned my eye on a PM8005+SA8005 combo which i can get for 1.179 GBP including a Kimber Hero RCA interconnect (Retails alone here in DK for 188 GBP).

Now the question is... being a 10 year newer amp, and from a product line 1 step up, would the PM8005 offer me a significant upgrade in terms of power to drive my CM8's which i hear are power hungry?
Im pretty sure that the SA8005 will be a large upgrade compared to my 1999 CD67-SE.
Furthermore, sometimes i listen to radio, which is also from 1999, Marantz ST-48, and here the store said i would likely not be getting much audible upgrade out of getting a newer one even, as FM radio hasnt changed much in tech. (So they suggest that i save my money and keep the old tuner for now, until a more exciting product comes along).

The store says that the PM8005 has a more powerfull power suply than PM7001 and even though they are both 2x70w 8ohm, it should be more powerfull.
I also wrote Marantz who came with a very conservative reply stating that the PM8005 has some new technology, but they are equal in terms of power.

Whats the view of you Hifi guru people ? )

EDIT: Btw when i talk about "power" i dont mean as in being able to play louder, the PM7001 plays loud enough, but more in terms of control and grip of the CM8, again as i have heard many times that the more power, the better they play!

 

[Covenanter]

Not heard them with your speakers but I think it's a great combo, which is why I bought it.

Chris

 

[emperor's new clothes]

+1

 

[Andrewjvt]

All the people on this forum that have the marantz pm8005 are more than happy with the sound

That may tell you something

 

[Maestroelite]

Thanks for your replies guys so far ;o)

Did you audition the PM8005 along with other amps? If so what were your thoughts in relation to "power"? (and in general how do you view the power of the PM8005).

 

[Covenanter]

Thanks for your replies guys so far ;o)

Did you audition the PM8005 along with other amps? If so what were your thoughts in relation to "power"? (and in general how do you view the power of the PM8005).

I have no issues with power and I have quite chunky speakers.

Chris

 

[emperor's new clothes]

details & images of 625va power supply here:

http://us.marantz.com/us/Products/Pages/ProductDetails.aspx?CatId=HiFiComponents&ProductId=PM8005

Made in Japan high end facility, not Shenzhen. Effortless with my Dynaudio standmounts.

 

[AntAxon]

Very pleased with my system paired with Tannoy Precision 6.2s

 

[Maestroelite]

Hi again

So, i went out and bought myself the system, and thought i would revert with some initial thoughts, which i think in general is lacking from many forums, cant say if its lacking in here though, so i hope i dont offend anyone hehe.

I mean, people tend to ask for advise, being on Hifi, fishing or other forums, but then never come back stating what they did and how it went.

Anyway, after seeing the replies in here and reading general reviews about the PM/SA8005 I soon started to get an itch and went to the store and brought it home, without being able to set it up for days due to lack of time! Was that increasing the itch? YES!

So first of all, it looks great! better than my old amp/CD, had to drill some more holes in the back of our wooden cabinet for cables though so that they would fit without bends.

Second, and more importantly, it does carry more power than my PM7001, even at the same wattage, i may even dare going as far as saying it has significantly more power!? Currently listening to some Era, Mike Oldfield, Vangelis etc at 12 o'clock position where its plenty loud, but with no distortion or other nuisances. (Which the old one did have at these levels).
Havent gone above this setting, and dont see the need to honestly.

In general, also at low volumes, it presents a lot more control and grip of my CM8 speakers.
One can not claim the CM8 to be a "boomy" speaker, so if not using that word, i would say that i now have a lot more grip of the bass than before, slightly leaning towards the bright side, but not in a bad way, but as in a more controlled way. (Makes sense? I hope so).

The midrange which i have always loved in the CM range is now even better, instruments and vocals are more clear and defined than ever, i think.

Now for the CD player, i have unfortunately not had the chance to listen to any SACD's yet, as the ones i ordered are in backorder *cray2*
As for my old CD collection goes, im hearing more definition and details than before.

Much of this can of course be placebo, me wanting it to sound better, but im really happy, and thats the main thing *biggrin*

My wife even said on the first day (And no she is NOT into hifi in general hehe) that it sounded better.

Thanks again to the ones replying, and maybe someone can get something out of reading this as well.

 

[Covenanter]

Hi again

So, i went out and bought myself the system, and thought i would revert with some initial thoughts, which i think in general is lacking from many forums, cant say if its lacking in here though, so i hope i dont offend anyone hehe.

I mean, people tend to ask for advise, being on Hifi, fishing or other forums, but then never come back stating what they did and how it went.

Anyway, after seeing the replies in here and reading general reviews about the PM/SA8005 I soon started to get an itch and went to the store and brought it home, without being able to set it up for days due to lack of time! Was that increasing the itch? YES!

So first of all, it looks great! better than my old amp/CD, had to drill some more holes in the back of our wooden cabinet for cables though so that they would fit without bends.

Second, and more importantly, it does carry more power than my PM7001, even at the same wattage, i may even dare going as far as saying it has significantly more power!? Currently listening to some Era, Mike Oldfield, Vangelis etc at 12 o'clock position where its plenty loud, but with no distortion or other nuisances. (Which the old one did have at these levels).Havent gone above this setting, and dont see the need to honestly.

In general, also at low volumes, it presents a lot more control and grip of my CM8 speakers.One can not claim the CM8 to be a "boomy" speaker, so if not using that word, i would say that i now have a lot more grip of the bass than before, slightly leaning towards the bright side, but not in a bad way, but as in a more controlled way. (Makes sense? I hope so).

The midrange which i have always loved in the CM range is now even better, instruments and vocals are more clear and defined than ever, i think.

Now for the CD player, i have unfortunately not had the chance to listen to any SACD's yet, as the ones i ordered are in backorder *cray2*As for my old CD collection goes, im hearing more definition and details than before.

Much of this can of course be placebo, me wanting it to sound better, but im really happy, and thats the main thing *biggrin*

My wife even said on the first day (And no she is NOT into hifi in general hehe) that it sounded better.

Thanks again to the ones replying, and maybe someone can get something out of reading this as well.

This is exactly what I reported when I auditioned and then purchased this kit last year. I didn't previously think that a CD player would make much difference but the SA8005 certainly extracts more from CDs than I have heard before. Ok maybe it's expectation, I can't rule that out, but I'm a sceptical git and I don't think so. My example CD is the classic "Deja Vu" by Crosby, Stills, Nash and Young. I'd stopped playing it as I thought it was one of those albums from your youth that time had revealed wasn't as good as you thought it was. The SA8005 changed my mind!

Chris

 

[DIB]

Blimey, set at the 12 Oclock position

I used to have both the PM7001 and PM8003 models a few years ago, and if I'd played either at that volume next door but two would have been banging on my door I think.

.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Blimey, set at the 12 Oclock position

I used to have both the PM7001 and PM8003 models a few years ago, and if I'd played either at that volume next door but two would have been banging on my door I think.

.

My thoughts entirely too!! 12 o'clock on the PM8005 volume dial is anti-socially bloody loud and probably shakes most things in the room and his neighbours room too! Glad I don't have to live next door to this guy.

Hopefully he lives in a solitary detatched property in the middle of a field somewhere.

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Second, and more importantly, it does carry more power than my PM7001, even at the same wattage, i may even dare going as far as saying it has significantly more power!? Currently listening to some Era, Mike Oldfield, Vangelis etc at 12 o'clock position where its plenty loud, but with no distortion or other nuisances. (Which the old one did have at these levels).Havent gone above this setting, and dont see the need to honestly.

A word of advice: I am presuming that the amp has no attenuation on the inputs, if so, then it is probably at it's very limits at 12 o'clock on the volume dial! Go above this volume setting for a sustained period of time with the SA8005 connected at your peril sir; otherwise you'll be looking for new drivers for your speakers and possibly a new amp too. You need a more powerful amp for the kind of volume you like. Your fondness for loud may be the very reason why your previous amp sounded distorted. Ever heard of clipping?

 

[Covenanter]

Yep! I don't think I've ever put mine above 11 o'clock and that is very loud indeed.

Chris

 

[Mr beck]

Hi there,

could you please explain why you can't go over 12 on the volume dial. I know 12 is very loud and not sure I'd ever need to go there, but just so I know because I'm learning everyday what is clipping? And why dose it happen.

Beat wishes

david

 

[Deleted member 108165]

Hi there,

could you please explain why you can't go over 12 on the volume dial. I know 12 is very loud and not sure I'd ever need to go there, but just so I know because I'm learning everyday what is clipping? And why dose it happen.

Beat wishes

david

You can go over 12 on the volume dial if you want to, nobody is going to stop you *smile*

There are many on here who are far more technically astute than I. Whilst we wait for their input the following link goes some way to explain this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clipping_(audio)

In essence Marantz amps are probably near their power limit at 12 on the volume dial when connected to their cd player siblings. Marantz do have a very sensitive protection circuit that will put the amp into stand-by mode if clipping approaches dangerous levels for the amp. However, continual forays into this zone can harm not only the amp but also seriously damage the speakers. There is an example in another thread on here where a guy's amp appears to have been damaged by excessive volume; there have also been examples of blown speaker drivers too.

You may ask then why does the volume dial go all the way to 5pm when max output is only at 12am - It gives the impression that the amp is more powerful than it actually is. You must have noticed how small the volume dial movement is for such a large increase in ouput. If you are sensible with the volume dial then there's nowt to worry about. 12am on your Marantz amp is ridiculously loud.

I have the previous models to your current set-up and I've actually added passive attenuators to all the line inputs on the amp, it gives me a larger sweep on the volume dial, (approx. +2hours), and greater control, plus equalises the volume dial for vinyl playback too; just my personal preference.

Hope this helps.

 

[Maestroelite]

Just a note, the 12 o´clock thing was merely testing for a few minutes, i do not have it that high when listening to music or TV which is through my amp.

Im usually at around the 9 ish or below when family is home, and sometimes around 10-11 when alone.

 

[Maestroelite]

I never went beyond 12, and as far as i know, which i can now hear may not be true, then as long as nothing sounds wrong or struggling, no damage will occur... Il be more carefull for sure hereafter.

So it did not clip nor distort anything. (As far as i know).

Speakers sounded good, and sounds was clear and crisp.

 

[GCE]

Marantz Pm 6004 vs Quad 34 + 306 ( and Yam AS 500 ) on B&W 603 floorstanding

In essence Marantz amps are probably near their power limit at 12 on the volume dial

when connected to their cd player siblings

Yes , it depends from cd player ( my is a Philips ) and musical program ...Some months ago I did some measures: CD PinkF Dark Side otm - absolutely high volumes ( there were no neighbors! ) , with vol knob at 15 o'clock , (max is 17 hours) and source direct ; in the peaks I digitally tested (average) : Vmax = 14 V/ch and Imax = 1.7 A, for a maximum power of almost 25 W/ch; I generally listen to 9:30 hours max, with my wife coming & asking me for a lower volumes....I've to say that, while the Quad 34 + 306 that I owned before for 20 years , with the same B&W towers, and at a little lower volume, was going in protection (I had to unlock it using the back button) and also warmed up a bit on the smart front radiator, the Marantz instead was almost cold and never gone + in protection. The Quad was also sounding a little harsh and with harder highs, at these levels, while the Pm 6004 has retained a good liquidity on the mid & highs, which were still confortable...; anyway, in everydays normal cd listening, at 9:30, I get only an output of 1 W/ch max on peaks, more punchy bass and similar mid vs Quad!

-------------------

Yam as 500 has loudness too and in direct comparison with pm 6004 shows more dry, although more diffuse and detailed high frequencies, similar bass punch, but more fatiguing listening overall, for me. Marantz drives my old B&W 603, like 684, and a ASW 610 sub linked at spkB - highlevel - my room= 30 mq and 90 mc with ease. Just a few thoughts . bye

 

[GCE]

... and did you tested what level reaches

your amp when it goes in protection?

 

[Blacksabbath25]

sorry i disgree with 12 o'clock it depends what speakers your using amp your have as i take mine past 12 o' clock sometimes you just have use you brain how far you can go . i have been into hifi 25 years and in that time i have had 20 or more amps in that time and never blown a amp or speakers in that time yes it can be done if you turn volume that far till they start making cliping sounds your gone to far you just back off on the volume its easy and most of have cranked it up before .

 

[Deleted member 108165]

sorry i disgree with 12 o'clock it depends what speakers your using amp your have as i take mine past 12 o' clock sometimes you just have use you brain how far you can go . i have been into hifi 25 years and in that time i have had 20 or more amps in that time and never blown a amp or speakers in that time yes it can be done if you turn volume that far till they start making cliping sounds your gone to far you just back off on the volume its easy and most of have cranked it up before .

Regarding the Marantz I think you'll find that it's more to do with the output from the matching cd player and the input sensitivity on the amp inputs that can catch the unwary out. I'm not sure of the exact position of the volume dial on the Marantz as to when it enters clipping but my guess would be somewhere past the noon position. The good thing about Marantz is that they do have a very sensitive protection circuit. But would add that past noon on these matching amps/cdp's are insane levels of volume.