MA RS6 Fatigue & Poor Positioning - Time For Change But to What?

[Crocodile]

My current setup is MA RS6 fed from a Rotel RA-1062 with a Squeezebox Touch as the source. Good as this is with acoustic & vocals, I find the presentation on classic rock just too forward. So within a short time of pushing the volume up, I find I'm either reducing it or switching off completely due to fatigue. I was tempted to try getting hold of an Arcam A85 to see how this tamed the MAs but:

To compound this, what was originally supposed to be a temporary move of the kit into a 2M alcove is looking more permanent due to a simple lack of space. Until a Lottery/Premium Bonds win allows me to build a dedicated listening room, I'm stuffed. So it looks like a change of speaker is the only way forward. I'm limited to a space of approx. 42cm wide by 52cm deep for each speaker. I'd prefer to stick with floorstanders as I don't like the look stands & I'm not a fan of vinyl "wood" finishes.

Budget isn't much more than the MAs will realise but I'm happy to go with used. Demos are nigh impossible so again buying used would seem the best option as I can always move on anything that doesn't work out.

My first system had a pair of sealed cab JPW P1s on the end. Whatever I used in the way of amp or source these never sounded forward so I guess that's what I'm trying to recapture. Sadly they went to perished foam heaven before replacements became available.

 

[Rethep]

I have read in "Stereophile" reviews that the RS6 partners well with the Creek Destiny 1 (one) amp which could still be bought as old stock. The sweet Creek compensates for the forwardness of the Monitor audio's it seems. As you do not report problems with bass this might be a solution.

If you still want another speaker, think of secondhand Epos (ES 15, M15 or M16). They are sweeter then your MA's.

 

[Crocodile]

Thanks.

After a LOT of playing with position & bungs, bass isn't too much of a problem (most of the time), but the occasional album still booms like a boomy thing. I think it's safe to say that the RS6s aren't happy being constrained the way they are.

I'd be interested to hear from someone that has experience of that Creek with the RS6 but I suspect I really need a speaker that's both less forward & more tolerant of positioning. I'll do some research on the Epos.

 

[poldo]

dynaudio dm 2/7 is an option.

i had the rs6 for 3 months, positioning is a problem they need 1 mtr

 

[CnoEvil]

See if you can find some Spendor S5e, which are small floorstanders from the previous model, and might make your budget 2nd hand. They will certainly tame your sound.

Edit. When I was doing some digging for another member on here, I came across the Audio Note AZ-1. It is a small floorstander that has been discontinued and the price has dropped from £800 to £500 (new). They are designed to work in corners, sound musical, but are only available in Cherry.
If you are interested, can you let me know and I'll give you contact details.

Cno

 

[Crocodile]

If you are interested, can you let me know and I'll give you contact details. Cno

Thanks but I'd need light oak to fit the rest of the furniture.

 

[the record spot]

I'll trot out my usual line at which most others who know will probably be banging their heads already. Sell the RS6s, or rebox them till you can site them properly again and get a pair of Mission 751s. They'll work a treat with your music tastes (similar to mine) and they're not fussy about positioning. Front ported too, so you cant stand them near to a wall. A big sound, bigger than you'd credit and yours in mint nick for around £100 used.

 

[Anonymous]

within a short time of pushing the volume up, I find I'm either reducing it or switching off completely due to fatigue.

This is a classic sign of your ears telling you there is a high level of distortion affecting the upper odd harmonics. So the question is where are they coming from?

In general there are two sources of this distortion: Tweeters and amps.

1. Sometimes the tweeter is simply overdriven due to the crossover being badly designed so too much midrange causes the tweeter to flap about more than it should, causing huge amounts of IM distortion. I had a Celestion Ditton 110 with a tweeter that did it, I really noticed it when I tried some PA speakers with Piezo tweeters - very low distortion those, funnily enough. The Dittons were sold shortly after..

2. In amps its the classic poorly designed class B transistor amp sound.

So unless you just want to replace both, you need to try a different amp or speaker to check which it is - or if it's both. Also first try an FM radio as a source - just to discount a bad digital moment with the sqeezebox.

Then also try some older music like Pink Floyd and see if that causes the fatigue to see if it's the DAC clipping badly - older stuff should sound OK.

 

[plastic penguin]

The Creek Evo is a much better match than the Rotel. I admire Rotel stuff but not good bed fellows with MAs.

BTW, what is your room acoustics like? how far are the RS6s from the wall?

 

[Anonymous]

Arcam A85 is warmer and more laid back than Rotel RA-1062. Actually I find the latter a bit fatiguing because its bright tonal balance.

Anyway, the main source of the brightness is Squeezebox Touch. Your upgrade should start from this point. Get a real hi-fi digital source before changing things in your system.

By the way, unless you've got bullets to afford a pair of high-end loudspeakers, there's nothing wrong with Monitor Audio RS6. If you keep the duet Squeezebox and RA-1062, there's no loudspeakers which will solve your problem. A warmer amp should improve the final result but the main guilty for the brightness is Squeezebox.

 

[plastic penguin]

Arcam A85 is warmer and more laid back than Rotel RA-1062. Actually I find the latter a bit fatiguing because its bright tonal balance.

Anyway, the main source of the brightness is Squeezebox Touch. Your upgrade should start from this point. Get a real hi-fi digital source before changing things in your system.

By the way, unless you've got bullets to afford a pair of high-end loudspeakers, there's nothing wrong with Monitor Audio RS6. If you keep the duet Squeezebox and RA-1062, there's no loudspeakers which will solve your problem. A warmer amp should improve the final result but the main guilty for the brightness is Squeezebox.

Spot-on about the source. Not heard the Squeezebox myself, but with the right source it can influence the sound more than most components. I've had the old Cyrus 8VS2 with my RS6s, connected to the 73T, and there was no real hint of brightness.

 

[Anonymous]

the main source of the brightness is Squeezebox Touch.

If you are using the analog outputs then this could well be true. The fix then is cheap and simple:

1) Buy a Behringer src2496 ultramatch pro (this is an upsampling DAC)

2) Buy an optical lead

3) Plug the DAC into your amp and the optical lead from the DAC to the squeezbox

Set it up for upsampling (88.2kHz) and internal clock, input digital output analog and your music will be transformed.

 

[Anonymous]

So many times room acoustics are never addressed in these threads and its actually one of the most significant problems with the sound and a root cause of many problems. I recently moved house and I had the pick of three rooms in which to set up my hi fi, and in each of the three rooms the sound was significantly better or worse.

Try a google search on acoustic room treatments, bass traps, diffuser and absorption panels, these are more likely to address some of the problems than just changing equipment. I'm afraid this is not a simple fix but long term it can prove more rewarding solution as my recent experience has proved.

 

[plastic penguin]

So many times room acoustics are never addressed in these threads and its actually one of the most significant problems with the sound and a root cause of many problems. I recently moved house and I had the pick of three rooms in which to set up my hi fi, and in each of the three rooms the sound was significantly better or worse.

Try a google search on acoustic room treatments, bass traps, diffuser and absorption panels, these are more likely to address some of the problems than just changing equipment. I'm afraid this is not a simple fix but long term it can prove more rewarding solution as my recent experience has proved.

I'm always banging on about room acoustics (yawns)... my room is well damped but I'm not talking about expensive panels. Just moving some furniture or adding a couple of rugs or bookcase... curtains are the best tamer of frequency nasties.

 

[dannycanham]

The main source of your problem is the MA's, awful speakers. One of the worst purchases I have ever made, no matter what I tried pairing them with and what positioning I gave them. Get some speakers with soft dome tweaters.

Tested them in a medium sized bedroom, very large front room & a large listening room. With the usual beds, rugs & sofas providing some damping.

Tested them with Roksan caspian, Roksan kandy, Cyrus 8, marantz, cambridge audio & rotel CD player & amp pairings & on a sony amp & blu ray player.

Tried them 30cm to 1.5 metres from a wall. 2 metres to 5 metres apart.

They are cr...something. But detailed.

 

[the record spot]

Get some speakers with soft dome tweaters.

I know I've picked this out in isolation, but it's something that gives the impression that metal dome tweeters are harsh. If a tweeter is done well, correction, if the speaker design is done well, then the materials used won't make a difference - the music will likely sound pretty good.

Metal dome tweeters aren't by their nature harsh, bright, or whatever. No moreso than soft dome tweeters are overly warm. I find with the Missions I have now and the 751s I had many years ago, they were wonderfully balanced and deeply musical. They have a mesh domed metal tweeter. This isn't an exception, just good design.

 

[noogle]

+1. There are a lot of similar hi-fi misapprehensions based on what sounds very plausible, such as "silver cables sound bright"...

 

[Inter_Voice]

Very well said Spectre, +1

Just see the link in my signature .