KEF KHT-3005SE vs MKSound M5/M4

[ErwinC]

I am considering replacing my KEF KHT-3005SE by an MKSound M-5/M-4 set. Has anyone compared these two sets?

 

[Frank Harvey]

They're quite different price points - any reason for this comparison?

And which receiver are you going to be using?

 

[ErwinC]

They're quite different price points - any reason for this comparison?

And which receiver are you going to be using?

The reason is i need front right and left speakers not higher than 22 cm that can be placed inside a cabinet.

I currently own a Denon AVR1909, but i plan to upgrade soon.

 

[Frank Harvey]

The M Series is a 4ohm load and not particularly sensitive, and can present problems for your receiver. I've used quite a few other receivers in the past with 4ohm M&K and MK speakers and have ended up with them getting rather warm or even cutting out due to their demands on the receiver. While the M5's will sound better than the KEFs, your 1909 will be much happier driving the 3005SE's. Ask too much of the receiver and it doesn't matter how god the speakers are, the system won't sound like it is worth its cost and won't sound its best either. Unless of course you're looking to upgrade your receiver at some point in the future.

 

[bigboss]

Unless of course you're looking to upgrade your receiver at some point in the future.

I currently own a Denon AVR1909, but i plan to upgrade soon.

 

[Frank Harvey]

 

[ErwinC]

The M Series is a 4ohm load and not particularly sensitive, and can present problems for your receiver. I've used quite a few other receivers in the past with 4ohm M&K and MK speakers and have ended up with them getting rather warm or even cutting out due to their demands on the receiver. While the M5's will sound better than the KEFs, your 1909 will be much happier driving the 3005SE's. Ask too much of the receiver and it doesn't matter how god the speakers are, the system won't sound like it is worth its cost and won't sound its best either. Unless of course you're looking to upgrade your receiver at some point in the future.

Thanks for the useful feedback.

If i go for the M&K speakers, what level of surround amplifier do i need?

Will the M&K be a clear improvement over the KEF set with a new capable surround amp?

 

[Frank Harvey]

You'll need to be looking at the £800-1,000 receivers ideally as the M Series are a 4ohm load.

Just to clear up the confusion, you're looking at MK Sound speakers, which are a different company to M&K (Miller & Kreisel), which ceased to trade in 2006/2007. Ken Kreisel Professional Sound is the company that is now run by the Ken Kreisel, who co-founded and owned M&K - Ken had nothing to do with MK Sound.

The KHT3005SE package works out about £400 cheaper than the M Series speakers, and also includes a sub, so you're getting more for your money with the KEF's, but if you don't need a sub, then you're paying for something you won't need. You could get about £300 for the sub, which means you'll have had the five speakers for about £500, which is less than half the price of the MK's - you just have to decide which suits your requirements better. At the end of next month, the KEF E305 speaker package will be available - probably a little more than the current price of the 3005's, but should sound better as they're based around better technology.

 

[moonfly]

You'll need to be looking at the £800-1,000 receivers ideally as the M Series are a 4ohm load.

Just to clear up the confusion, you're looking at MK Sound speakers, which are a different company to M&K (Miller & Kreisel), which ceased to trade in 2006/2007. Ken Kreisel Professional Sound is the company that is now run by the Ken Kreisel, who co-founded and owned M&K - Ken had nothing to do with MK Sound.

The KHT3005SE package works out about £400 cheaper than the M Series speakers, and also includes a sub, so you're getting more for your money with the KEF's, but if you don't need a sub, then you're paying for something you won't need. You could get about £300 for the sub, which means you'll have had the five speakers for about £500, which is less than half the price of the MK's - you just have to decide which suits your requirements better. At the end of next month, the KEF E305 speaker package will be available - probably a little more than the current price of the 3005's, but should sound better as they're based around better technology.

Its also worth notting that since M&K became MK Sound, the entire product line has improved, and not just by a little bit. The new speakers and subwoofers are head and shoulders above the models they had when Ken was there. The guys runnin the show now have improved everything by a remarkable amount, and dont seem to be missing Ken at all.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Dan, the following quote from myself was to clear up the confusion between the two companies (who have/had different owners), and there was no mention of quality at all on my part at any point.

Just to clear up the confusion, you're looking at MK Sound speakers, which are a different company to M&K (Miller & Kreisel), which ceased to trade in 2006/2007. Ken Kreisel Professional Sound is the company that is now run by the Ken Kreisel, who co-founded and owned M&K - Ken had nothing to do with MK Sound.

Its also worth notting that since M&K became MK Sound, the entire product line has improved, and not just by a little bit. The new speakers and subwoofers are head and shoulders above the models they had when Ken was there. The guys runnin the show now have improved everything by a remarkable amount, and dont seem to be missing Ken at all.

Debatable subject, and "head and shoulders" is a tad strong. Initial improvements were minor, and not applicable to all models, as MK Sound were just working to Ken's existing specifications, changing the look of the cabinets a little and maybe changing a driver here or there depending on which drivers were still available. Even now, existing models are derivatives of Ken's original designs.

And of course, they wouldn't be 'missing Ken' because he never worked for MK Sound! Ken shut down Miller & Kreisel in 2007 and went on to open up Ken Kreisel Professional Sound in 2011.

 

[JohnHolmes]

I wasn't aware the new MK subs have been released yet? Seems since you've started working for the mk distributor geko moonfly you've been singing their praises.

 

[moonfly]

I dont work for Gecko and i never have

 

[jcshutts]

JH are you planning to buy the KK range?

 

[JohnHolmes]

Yes not sure if I'm going wait for the next range up from the quattros yet. Would like to read some reviews, have read positive things about the MK s150s mkii lately so they are also an option. They have been out for a while though and I'm yet to find a review. I think Ken's new designs will be superior though and I'm in no rush, interesting times ahead.

 

[JohnHolmes]

Double post.

 

[Frank Harvey]

I dont work for Gecko and i never have

But you are in partnership with Gecko's owner, so in a way, you do.

 

[Frank Harvey]

Yes not sure if I'm going wait for the next range up from the quattros yet. Would like to read some reviews, have read positive things about the MK s150s mkii lately so they are also an option. They have been out for a while though and I'm yet to find a review. I think Ken's new designs will be superior though and I'm in no rush, interesting times ahead.

Where are you based John?

 

[jcshutts]

Yes not sure if I'm going wait for the next range up from the quattros yet. Would like to read some reviews, have read positive things about the MK s150s mkii lately so they are also an option. They have been out for a while though and I'm yet to find a review. I think Ken's new designs will be superior though and I'm in no rush, interesting times ahead.

I don't think I will be able to afford 7.1 in the next range up from the 125s KK.

The Mk 150 range are definitely interesting from the testimonies from various forum but like you, I dont often see reviews for this type of product. It would be good if WHF took the plunge and reviewed upper end dedicated movie speaker systems.

Will this new purchase of yours be within a TV set up or projector?

 

[JohnHolmes]

I live near Chester David.

Think Ill be sticking with my Kuro for a while JC. HCC did review the S150s a while back, if they have really improved that much with I'd have thought MK Sound would be pushing for them to be reviewed again. They have been out a while now and I can't even find one review.

 

[ErwinC]

You'll need to be looking at the £800-1,000 receivers ideally as the M Series are a 4ohm load.

Just to clear up the confusion, you're looking at MK Sound speakers, which are a different company to M&K (Miller & Kreisel), which ceased to trade in 2006/2007. Ken Kreisel Professional Sound is the company that is now run by the Ken Kreisel, who co-founded and owned M&K - Ken had nothing to do with MK Sound.

The KHT3005SE package works out about £400 cheaper than the M Series speakers, and also includes a sub, so you're getting more for your money with the KEF's, but if you don't need a sub, then you're paying for something you won't need. You could get about £300 for the sub, which means you'll have had the five speakers for about £500, which is less than half the price of the MK's - you just have to decide which suits your requirements better. At the end of next month, the KEF E305 speaker package will be available - probably a little more than the current price of the 3005's, but should sound better as they're based around better technology.

I have been looking at the Ken Kreisel web page, but for the moment there are no small HT speakers to be found .

And performance wise, is the M4 a clear upgrade from the 3005 setup?

 

[Frank Harvey]

I have been looking at the Ken Kreisel web page, but for the moment there are no small HT speakers to be found .

And performance wise, is the M4 a clear upgrade from the 3005 setup?

It depends what you mean by small. There are the Quattro Q85's which are a similar size to the TRiFX surrounds - these are smaller than the Q125's. there will be the Duo range coming out below the Quattro range in a few months, and then a range or two above the Quattros. There will be other products that may well suit what you're looking for if looking at something about the size of the M's, but they won't be available just yet.

Yes, the M's will be better than the 3005's, but they will need a suitable subwoofer.

 

[moonfly]

I dont work for Gecko and i never have

But you are in partnership with Gecko's owner, so in a way, you do.

I am in the process of setting up a new venture with the owner of Gecko, but Geckos main business and distribution and dealership business is nothing to do with me and I have no involvement with.

Having visited Gecko HQ I just had the chance to listen to the latest MKS offerings, including the new X series subwoofer, which is indeed now out.

I sing the praises of speakers I have heard and like, and I think thats what everyone does really, it just so happens that I dont sell any speakers or rely on that for a living. I used to sing the praises of the old M&K stuff as well. The thing for me is that the old mk1 S150's were a very good cinema speaker, but they were never good enough all round for them to be on the cards for me.

The new speakers, the ones that have been ugraded, are a definitive improvement, so much so that I would now be more than happy to invest in them. The same goes for the new subs, although I would personally never purchase an off the shelf subwoofer product because custom ability give such advantages. All that said though, the qaulity is there and the newer offerings are a big difference, technology has certainly moved on.

Ive no qualms about stating I am positive I would love the new KK speakers as well, its just that I have never heard them. I used to pass comment on the DXD saying how I thought its design was excellent and the resulting sound and performance would also be excellent, but I was shot down for doing so having never heard it. So now, I simply reserve passing comment on products until I can hear them for myself.

The fact of the matter is, the new MK Sound stuff is very very good, and just because the company was formed from another, and some people dont work there anymore, doesnt mean the products cant possibly have been improved, because they definitely have. Everyone that has listened to them agrees, but ultimately it boils down to one thing, you need to get to hear these products for yourself and decide for yourself. I'm convinced that no matter what the OP buys, be it MK or KK, he would love either.

 

[Frank Harvey]

The fact of the matter is, the new MK Sound stuff is very very good, and just because the company was formed from another, and some people dont work there anymore, doesnt mean the products cant possibly have been improved, because they definitely have. Everyone that has listened to them agrees, but ultimately it boils down to one thing, you need to get to hear these products for yourself and decide for yourself. I'm convinced that no matter what the OP buys, be it MK or KK, he would love either.

Again Dan, I was clearing up the confusion between the two companies. Nothing about quality was mentioned.

 

[ErwinC]

The thing for me is that the old mk1 S150's were a very good cinema speaker, but they were never good enough all round for them to be on the cards for me.

I have the same experience. Fantastic speakers for HT but not really suited for hifi.

But i still love the looks of the S150. :bounce:

 

[moonfly]

The thing for me is that the old mk1 S150's were a very good cinema speaker, but they were never good enough all round for them to be on the cards for me.

I have the same experience. Fantastic speakers for HT but not really suited for hifi.

But i still love the looks of the S150. :bounce:

Ive always been big on music, and the reason I never invested in the older models was because for music, they just didnt cut it for me. This is the main area I feel the new 150's have been improved vastly. All new drive units and the results really do stand out. They are much smoother and much more natural. They are better in films as well, but I think the real benefits are from the musical POV.