Just had to turn off Dark side of the moon.. Please help!

admin_exported

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Aug 10, 2019
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Good morning to you all on this soggy day.

I just sat down to enjoy one of my favourite albums, Dark Side of the Moon, got half way through and had to turn it off through getting uppity with how it sounded. Don't get me wrong, I could hear every instrument clearly but the sound lacked all emotion, soul or feeling. I therefore thought I would come on here with my pradicament and see what you lovely people thought.

I have Quad 12L speakers, Cyrus 7 amp and an Arcam Alpha 8SE CD player. I am thinking of phasing out my CD player and using all lossless files, so am looking to perhaps change my speakers firstly and then perhaps the amp. I can go up to around £250 second hand so maybe Linn Keilidh speakers, Epos, Castle, Ruark, Monitor Audio or B&W could be the plan.

I've heard the nice poople who create Neat speakers test them by listening, not via super testing equipment. This is what I need although unfortunatly these are a bit out of my price range at the moment.

My hi fi at the moment no doubt would pass all tests by machines, but is a bit clinical sounding. I'm looking for a hi fi system that you turn on, play an album and get lost in the music. Sounds that are warm, rich, full of feeling and beautiful to my ears.

I have a slight feeling that my room is not helping much due to there being vast expanses of hard surfaces. Perhaps I need to fill it with a few cosy rugs to soften the sound up a bit..

Anyway.. I welcome any thoughts you have.

Enjoy your day

Cusious
 

RobinKidderminster

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May 27, 2009
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Dare I mention bass trapping? MS speakers. Do some forum searching and post pix !

dsotm is a good album to find weaknesses in kit. Treble was sweetened with my change of speaker and bass traps have worked wonders with opening the soundstage and separating the sounds with this great album. I too used to lower the volume in places but not now. Wine helps too
 

Overdose

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2008
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Cusious said:
Good morning to you all on this soggy day.

I just sat down to enjoy one of my favourite albums, Dark Side of the Moon, got half way through and had to turn it off through getting uppity with how it sounded. Don't get me wrong, I could hear every instrument clearly but the sound lacked all emotion, soul or feeling. I therefore thought I would come on here with my pradicament and see what you lovely people thought.

I have Quad 12L speakers, Cyrus 7 amp and an Arcam Alpha 8SE CD player. I am thinking of phasing out my CD player and using all lossless files, so am looking to perhaps change my speakers firstly and then perhaps the amp. I can go up to around £250 second hand so maybe Linn Keilidh speakers, Epos, Castle, Ruark, Monitor Audio or B&W could be the plan.

I've heard the nice poople who create Neat speakers test them by listening, not via super testing equipment. This is what I need although unfortunatly these are a bit out of my price range at the moment.

My hi fi at the moment no doubt would pass all tests by machines, but is a bit clinical sounding. I'm looking for a hi fi system that you turn on, play an album and get lost in the music. Sounds that are warm, rich, full of feeling and beautiful to my ears.

I have a slight feeling that my room is not helping much due to there being vast expanses of hard surfaces. Perhaps I need to fill it with a few cosy rugs to soften the sound up a bit..

Anyway.. I welcome any thoughts you have.

Enjoy your day

Cusious
Is this a new phenomenon, has any change ocurred to your system?

Firstly, some cheap, even DIY acoustic treatment for your room could be considered, but most importantly, perhaps you are over analysing the music. The enjoyment you get and the emotion portrayed, is a quality of the music and not the hifi. Obviously lots will disagree, but they are more likely to be listening to their hifi as opposed to the music anyway.

By the way, the sun is shining gloriously here. :)
 

mahlerous

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May 12, 2012
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It seems to me you are craving a valve amplifier that will give you much richer sound without sacrificing dynamics.

I use a Unison Research 'unison secondo' that is a part valve class A 100W per channel Amp. I love it to bits, listening through a pair of Spendor S6e speakers.

I appreciate both are well above your current speaker budget, but if you listen to your Quads through a valve Amp I'm sure you won't be in such a hurry to replace them. I auditioned Cyrus Amps and found them detailed and analytical, but, like you, the sound was too hard and cold.

Anyway, best wishes with your search.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
That album is one of the few non classical cds to have pre-emphasis. As it is a favourite of yours I wouldn't be rushing to get rid of the cd player or upgrading to a newer one. I recently learnt this the hard way when I bought a Cambridge Azur 740c cd player for another room. Most cds sound great but a few sounded awful which I couldn't understand as they are fine on the 21 year old Pioneer player I have in my main system. Then I discovered it was because the 740c cannot deal with pre-emphasis, which was a term I had not even heard of before (google for further info)

I auditioned the Quad 12L when shopping for my second system and I thought they sounded dreadful, although the acoustics of the dealer's demo room was probably a major factor here. I ended up with Monitor Audio BX2s but I had been impressed by the Castle Knight 2, and as you favour a warmer sound these are the ones I would suggest you try first.
 

CnoEvil

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Aug 21, 2009
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Cusious said:
My hi fi at the moment no doubt would pass all tests by machines, but is a bit clinical sounding. I'm looking for a hi fi system that you turn on, play an album and get lost in the music. Sounds that are warm, rich, full of feeling and beautiful to my ears.

I have a slight feeling that my room is not helping much due to there being vast expanses of hard surfaces. Perhaps I need to fill it with a few cosy rugs to soften the sound up a bit..

Anyway.. I welcome any thoughts you have.

Enjoy your day

Cusious
I can throw out suggestions that should help, but it's going to be very difficult to achieve at your budget.

IMO Long term you should be looking at s/hand amps like MF A1/A1000 or Sugden A21; and speakers from Spendor, Opera and Sonus Faber.

Also, as you have rightly said, paying attention to the reflective nature of your room should greatly help.
 

crusaderlord

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Apr 29, 2008
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i would put some of the issue down to the Cyrus as well - a great amp for hearing detail but for me not such a delightful musical experience. i used to have a pair of Quad 9L speakers as well as a second system but i didnt keep them long to be honest and changed them for Epos - i suspect the combination of the two items is a bit too much and needs toning down a bit.

Neat speakers are excellent by the way, generally said to work well with Naim especially but i find Arcam and Neat a great experience too
 

stevebrock

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Nov 13, 2009
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Sorry to gate crash this post!

Crusdaerlord, I demoed the Motive 3..... Yes they are fantastic speakers..... I'm about to pull the trigger on some but can you let me know how big you room is, how far speakers are apart, how far from rear/side walls etc. thanks
 
B

BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW

Guest
Cusious said:
Good morning to you all on this soggy day.

I just sat down to enjoy one of my favourite albums, Dark Side of the Moon, got half way through and had to turn it off through getting uppity with how it sounded. Don't get me wrong, I could hear every instrument clearly but the sound lacked all emotion, soul or feeling. I therefore thought I would come on here with my pradicament and see what you lovely people thought.
Personally I would play some Floyd with Syd Barrett, will sound much better.
 

omnibeard

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Dec 7, 2010
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BIGBERNARDBRESSLAW said:
Personally I would play some Floyd with Syd Barrett, will sound much better.
+1

Mostly I just can't get along with Pink Floyd post Syd, but I guess Mr Bresslaw and myself might be in a minority there!
 

plastic penguin

Well-known member
Cusious said:
Good morning to you all on this soggy day.

I just sat down to enjoy one of my favourite albums, Dark Side of the Moon, got half way through and had to turn it off through getting uppity with how it sounded. Don't get me wrong, I could hear every instrument clearly but the sound lacked all emotion, soul or feeling. I therefore thought I would come on here with my pradicament and see what you lovely people thought.

I have Quad 12L speakers, Cyrus 7 amp and an Arcam Alpha 8SE CD player. I am thinking of phasing out my CD player and using all lossless files, so am looking to perhaps change my speakers firstly and then perhaps the amp. I can go up to around £250 second hand so maybe Linn Keilidh speakers, Epos, Castle, Ruark, Monitor Audio or B&W could be the plan.

I've heard the nice poople who create Neat speakers test them by listening, not via super testing equipment. This is what I need although unfortunatly these are a bit out of my price range at the moment.

My hi fi at the moment no doubt would pass all tests by machines, but is a bit clinical sounding. I'm looking for a hi fi system that you turn on, play an album and get lost in the music. Sounds that are warm, rich, full of feeling and beautiful to my ears.

I have a slight feeling that my room is not helping much due to there being vast expanses of hard surfaces. Perhaps I need to fill it with a few cosy rugs to soften the sound up a bit..

Anyway.. I welcome any thoughts you have.

Enjoy your day

Cusious
Everything about your set-up and room screams *bright* The Arcam CDP is the only component that'll tame the system, but either the amp or speakers will have to change. Personally I'd go for amp change. The likes of Nad 352, Arcam Alpha 8 or early Yamaha should solve the problem.
 

danrv

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Sep 17, 2010
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Cusious said:
I'm looking for a hi fi system that you turn on, play an album and get lost in the music. Sounds that are warm, rich, full of feeling and beautiful to my ears.
Sounds like you need a Roksan Kandy K2 amp & CD player if you decide to stick with CD. Together with my Dali Lektor 2s I'm now hearing exactly the sound qualities you describe.

Previously had a Rotel RA-01 amp and CA Azur 640 CD player plus the Lektors and I did like that setup but couldn't tame the brightness no matter what. The upgrade to mid - level source and amp has brought a richness to the sound that I was unable to get with the upper end budget components. It would probably sound even better with similarly priced speakers.

I did consider the award winning Marantz CD6004 amp and CD player as they work well with Dali speakers but this would have been more of a sidewards step from the Rotel/CA.

I've no experience of the equipment you have but it may be a matching issue as with my previous system. If you could up the budget though to £500 per item (used) I think you would hear the difference.

The room acoustics as mentioned play a big part in the sound and the hard surfaces will cause a fair bit of sound reflection so some treatment of some sort would help.

Good luck!

Dan

Roksan Kandy K2 amp / Roksan Kandy K2 CD player / Dali Lektor 2 / Chord Chrimson Plus / Chord Carnival Silverscreen / Atacama Nexus 6 / Target Hifi stand.
 

crusaderlord

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Apr 29, 2008
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stevebrock said:
Sorry to gate crash this post!

Crusdaerlord, I demoed the Motive 3..... Yes they are fantastic speakers..... I'm about to pull the trigger on some but can you let me know how big you room is, how far speakers are apart, how far from rear/side walls etc. thanks
Hi - well i am right in the middle of moving house at the moment so i will need to do some of this from memory. My room was about 4m x 3m. I had them either side of a fireplace and about 2m apart and 1m from each side wall. From the back wall i found them best at around 30cm from the wall. You can go closer to c25cm but this was the optimum for me v the distance i sat from them too. I demod a few speakers when i bought them and the Neats won, i have never felt the need to change them apart from considering the Neat Petite SX and look foward to trying them in my new house very soon. For me they are perfect for that size of room but i was in a terraced house and never really needed to push them hard.

My original demo post can be found here if anyone is interested > http://www.whathifi.com/forum/hi-fi/standmount-speaker-demo-700-1250
 

stevebrock

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Nov 13, 2009
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Thanks for that your rooms is very similar to mine, anyway I have got them on demo now, should get delivered tomorrow so I guess I will find out if they suit my room.

Good write up on the Neat as well, I've already decided on them, just need to make sure they sound good in my room
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
I think you could be right here. I do really want a valve amp and the Unison sounds like a goodun. I also am after some Spendor speakers although a bit too many shekels I fear. Let me know if yu fancy seling yours and the amp! ;)
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Evening to you all.. Many thanks for all your replies and ideas. It seems I should be replacing the Quads and Cyrus with speakers and amp that are not so bright.. Think I will search around, see if I can find a Rocksan, Nad, Unison Research would be good or Sugden. I see Spendor seem to be mentioned a few times. I definitely need to try and warm/soften up the accoutics in the room a bit..

How about Epos or Linn speakers?
 

shooter

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May 4, 2008
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Cusious said:
I definitely need to try and warm/soften up the accoutics in the room a bit..
I would look at this first before changing any equipment. The room and speaker combo is essential is getting the sound you would like and a merry-go-round of product change will ensue before it is.

Just remember though a compromise is always needed :)

Cusious said:
How about Epos speakers?
Lively treble accross the board and not a good combo with Cyrus or any forward amp.
 

NHL

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Nov 12, 2009
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Have owned a pair of ProAc's. One bass driver element blew during a party (way to high music). When replacing the element, we saw that the magnet was as large as the driver! Have never seen anything like it, quite simple, ProAc play in a league of their own.
 

BenLaw

Well-known member
Nov 21, 2010
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NHL said:
Have owned a pair of ProAc's. One bass driver element blew during a party (way to high music). When replacing the element, we saw that the magnet was as large as the driver! Have never seen anything like it, quite simple, ProAc play in a league of their own.
You *really* need to look at some ATC drivers. Proac may play in a league of their own, but it would be in the second division.
 

MajorFubar

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Mar 3, 2010
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Cusious said:
I just sat down to enjoy one of my favourite albums, Dark Side of the Moon, got half way through and had to turn it off through getting uppity with how it sounded. Don't get me wrong, I could hear every instrument clearly but the sound lacked all emotion, soul or feeling.
I've owned two different CD pressings of DSotM, separated by a period of some 25 years, and your description there sums-up my opinion of both, no matter what CDP/amp/speakers/room/house I have used to listen to them. God alone knows I don't want to kick-off any digital vs analog debate yet again, but I've yet to hear any DSotM CD which comes close to conveying the soul and emotion of a good LP pressing of the same album. It's one of the albums which just does not come across well on CD, and I have no idea why. Many albums transfer just fine to CD, for example The Wall: 1994 remaster is fantastic imo, easily as good as the vinyl. But not DSotM. I think you could spend all your money and the remainder of your days devoted to the cause of trying to make the CD sound thrilling and emotional, and you would die an unfulfilled, destitute old man.
 

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