Heavy Metal Listening

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Does anybody have any opinions on what they believe to be the best amp/cd player/speaker combo for listening to heavy metal? I'm talking anything from early Black Sabbath to Cradle Of filth. The reason I'm asking is because I love Hifi and have been buying nd swapping equipment for more than 20 years and I find that good hifi rarely gets mentioned in the same sentence as heavy metal! Its always the latest Jazz sensation or Blues genius. I know the whys and wherefores as to why these types of music are synonymus with hifi but heavy metal/hard rock must be as popular. I would love to go to the next Sound and Vision show and hear Iced Earths latest album or Rob Halfords kevlar vocal cords screaming from Naims/Meridians latest equipment!
So, anybody out there playing air guitar to Yngwie Malmsteens Marching Out listening to it on something other than a micro system or £20 mp3 player?!

Audiolab 8000s Amp, Marantz CD6002, B&W 683 speakers.

 

[AEJim]

I think there are a few conflicts between Heavy Metal music and the traditional Hi-Fi values which always leads to some elitist snobbery from those who listen to "tinkly piano jazz". It's usually down to the recording quality/production, which in many cases is a completely unjustified criticism.

It's been a few years since I've been into "real" heavy metal so I'm not too familiar with the newer material but I can tell you that, for example, Pantera have some brilliantly made albums which really do sound amazing on a good system. We use AC/DC, Sabbath, Rage Against the Machine and Nirvana as part of our program of test material when developing new speakers. Saying that - there is some awfully recorded stuff around, in particular a large portion of 80's albums are highly compressed and not worth a listen (the same can be said of any genre though!).

It's very easy to produce a good sound when you only have one cleanly recorded instrument playing, hence that kind of material being the most prevolent in Hi-Fi show demonstrations - it's far harder to make a group of overdriven guitars, pounding drums and gravelly shouting sound "pleasant". In my opinion this is actually a far sterner test of your system - the old Hi-Fi benchmarks of soundstaging, separation, depth, timing and tonal quality are actually still evident on many of these recordings! You don't always get the huge dynamic swings of Classical music but some of the bass guitar/drum solo's are equally revealing of a system's capabilities.

The other consideration when listening to Heavy Metal/Rock is volume of course! This kind of music just doesn't sound right when it's quiet, many perfectly good systems just aren't so good at higher levels and the sound can harden up noticeably. You're probably best off aiming for as much power as possible in an amp, speakers with larger/multiple drivers and a source component which isn't too harsh and thin with good midrange attack for those snares and guitar solo's. This is generalisation at it's best of course since there are always exceptions to the rule.

As ever you're always better off trying out the recommendations of a good local dealer who should have experience of many systems and styles of music - if they turn their nose up at your tastes walk away, there are always others more willing to put in time the effort to satisfy a customer whatever their demands.

 

[Andrew Everard]

This page should give you some ideas on where to start

"The whole system operates on 26,400 Watts of continuous (RMS) power,
producing in the open air quite an acceptable sound at a quarter of a mile and a fine
sound up to five or six hundred feet, where it begins to be distorted by wind. A sound
system could get the same volume from half as much power. but it wouldn't have the
quality. "

 

[Anonymous]

I can confirm from first hand experience that a 26kW system will set off a car alarm at 15 feet.

 

[Andrew Everard]

...And while 26kW may seem a lot, when I saw The 'Oo at Madison Square Garden several years back courtesy of JBL, I was reliably informed they were using 120kW. Indoors.

 

[chebby]

RainMeister:I can confirm from first hand experience that a 26kW system will set off a car alarm at 15 feet.

LOL!

Is that the most 'evil' claim that can be made for a 26kW system?

A small child with a football can set off a car alarm at 15ft too.

If it could bend the 'fabric' of space-time inside out I would be impressed.

 

[the record spot]

That sounds about right; they held the record for blasting out 76k at Celtic Park in the 1970s. People in Carlisle phoned up to complain. At least they're consistent!

 

[chebby]

Should be measuring in more useful units like Dbt's (Deaf by thirty.)

 

[Andrew Everard]

chebby:Should be measuring in more useful units like Dbt's (Deaf by thirty.)
Speak up, young man...

Quite possibly the loudest, cleanest live system I've ever heard.

Odd really: sounded horrid during the support act - some bloke who used to sing with Led Zeppelin -, then suddenly became fabulous when The Who came on.

 

[the record spot]

Hmmm, wonder if they had a plant in Plant's camp...?

(Okay, coat, get, exit, taxi....)

 

[John Duncan]

Anyway, back to the question. Best 'rock' system I've heard was Rega.....

 

[Anonymous]

chebby:

RainMeister:I can confirm from first hand experience that a 26kW system will set off a car alarm at 15 feet.

LOL!

Is that the most 'evil' claim that can be made for a 26kW system?

A small child with a football can set off a car alarm at 15ft too.

well, my claim was slightly misleading really. This system was being driven through the streets on a type of trailer, spread out of a length of 100 feet. The cars were behind 6 rows of people, so the 15 feet measurement was actually just a "guestimate".

I'd also like to see how a child with a football can set off a car alarm from 15 feet. Sure, if the child stuck the ball in such a way that it then proceed to impact upon the car, I can understand it. However, in that situation I suppose that the action to set off the alarm is at considerably less than 15 feet from the car, regardless of where the child stands! I digress...

To the OP, I suppose the best piece of advice would be to listen with your own ears.

 

[chebby]

JohnDuncan:Anyway, back to the question. Best 'rock' system I've heard was Rega.....

Probably because the MD is a keen guitarist and rock fan. (Still plays in a band according to the most recent interview of Roy Gandy I read.)

 

[Anonymous]

RE - AEJIM...

You can get Nine Inch Nails on SACD!

Rock/metal gets a bad press for sound quality. In my experience of mostly Rock (i.e. not much metal) sound quality is as good as if not better than "POP" as a genre.

 

[Andrew Everard]

the record spot:Hmmm, wonder if they had a plant in Plant's camp...?

Well, I think things weren't helped by the fact that the venue was half-empty, so there was some evil reflection coming back from the far end of the arena.

Have to admit we didn't last the whole of the fairy/hobgoblin-riddled set, but by the time we came back from the bar, where we spent some time wondering if The Who was going to sound as bad, the place had filled up, the sound crew had changed, and as one of our group said 'it sounds like all the limiters have come off'.

 

[chebby]

RainMeister:I'd also like to see how a child with a football can set off a car alarm from 15 feet. Sure, if the child stuck the ball in such a way that it then proceed to impact upon the car, I can understand it

Yep. Kids kicking their footballs around in our road often set off car alarms. The local kitchen and bathroom showroom's alarm is offten set off too when a ball bounces off the large plate glass window with enough force.

The wheelie bin recycling/refuse lorry generates enough noise/vibration to regularly set off a few also. (That could just be careless operatives hurling the wheelie-bins back on the pavement and hitting cars in the process.)

 

[Anonymous]

but, back to the question....

Pretty sure you can use the 8000s as a reasonable pre-amp or get it modded by IAG to operate only as a pre (or do it yourself!). Is your amp pre or post Tag takeover?

Then you could buy two 8000m monoblocks...should be pretty loud and composed. I'm thinking of that upgrade path myself and Rock is certainly on my test list.

For me the pre-tag audiolab stuff is very clear and composed, particularly in the bass region which for me is what you need. Bass should be fast and attacking - never slow else you'll loose the detail of the sound. This applies to all genres but more for Rock/metal, IMHO.

 

[chebby]

What about these with their dedicated 300watt monoblock Bryston amp packs built in?....

 

[Anonymous]

That'll do it!

 

[idc]

Chasw, I think that AEJim's response is spot on in that few systems can handle metal of any type without it becoming a muddle and metal albums often suffer because they were not that well recorded in the first place. I do not think that that is down to classical snobbery, classical musicians pay more attention to accoustics, metalists pay more attention to volume and impact. JD's suggestion of Rega I agree with, you want kit that handles bass. Ultimately, since you mention the likes of Naim and Meridian I would head to the US and look at Krell or Bose. My experience of American kit is that there is more emphasis on bass. Partner such with floor standers, no particular recommendations there, and time to rock.

P.S - Iggy Pop, Glasgow Barrowlands, painfully loud.

 

[manicm]

Yeah, when I took Bowie's Scary Monsters (my treble test disc you see) to my dealer he was subtly horrified, especially since his warm and cuddly Naim sampler disc was playing before. He must have thought me to be some juvenile nut when I played the song Fashion.

Sometimes dealers really need to give their systems a good workout.

 

[idc]

manicm:

Yeah, when I took Bowie's Scary Monsters (my treble test disc you see) to my dealer he was subtly horrified, especially since his warm and cuddly Naim sampler disc was playing before. He must have thought me to be some juvenile nut when I played the song Fashion.

Sounds like you need to try another dealer manicm, they should never react negitively to anyone's choice of music and test disc. In any case Scary Monsters came out in 1980, how old is your dealer if you appear to be some 'juvenille nut'?! A really good dealer should have a selection of everything from jazz to metal and be satisfied with the look of joy on a customer's face when their music sound's great. I am adding Sepultura, my favourite metal band and Chaos AD to my tester music from now on.

 

[Anonymous]

I listen to both Rammstein and Slipknot through my system and love them both (I also use them to audition new kit). I even listened to Dave Lee Roth's Skyscraper the other day and was pleasantly surprised at how listenable it was as was the first Boston album.

 

[Alec]

ashworth_rich:but, back to the question.... Pretty sure you can use the 8000s as a reasonable pre-amp or get it modded by IAG to operate only as a pre (or do it yourself!). Is your amp pre or post Tag takeover? Then you could buy two 8000m monoblocks...should be pretty loud and composed. I'm thinking of that upgrade path myself and Rock is certainly on my test list. For me the pre-tag audiolab stuff is very clear and composed, particularly in the bass region which for me is what you need. Bass should be fast and attacking - never slow else you'll loose the detail of the sound. This applies to all genres but more for Rock/metal, IMHO.

Exactly what im after (for all types of music too, but ive realised lately my system is laking with harder edged music), but i think many rock fans want big boomy warm bass.

 

[idc]

al7478:

but i think many rock fans want big boomy warm bass.

I would have said that that is exactly what should be avoided! A boomy sound muddies everything and warm suggests a lack of power and attack. With heavy metal and rock I want a bass that drives the music along, but is not overbearing so that other instruments are lost in the noise.