DVD Player versus dedicated CD player

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I know this has been debated endlessly, but I still can't seem to find a convincing answer. That's because the camp that says a dedicated CD player will always make music sound better than a DVD player, adds that it must be accompanied by a stereo amplifier - not an A/V receiver. Then again, some say that since the CD and DVD are 'written' differently, so the very act of 'reading' the discs requires dedicated players - irrespective of the DACs.

Now here's the practical scenario: Till date, I have been playing both DVDs and CDs on my Sony DVP-NS730P (progressive-scan DVD player), hooked to a Marantz SR-4500 A/V receiver that feeds a 5.1 Wharfedale Diamond 9 setup (using digital coaxial interconnects). For some reason, I have been feeling that the Sony's not doing enough justice to music (may be it's just in my head!). So, I have been looking at the Cambridge Audio Azur 540C V2.

Would the Cambridge make a significant difference to music quality in my kit, if I continued to feed its digital output (coax) to my existing Marantz A/V receiver? Or will I have to invest in a stereo amp as well? Or should I route the Cambridge to the Marantz through line-outs only to bypass Marantz's DACs? Or should I just stay put?

Cheers!
 
Essentially, a DVD player is a cinematic device that plays CD's. So if your priority [and room allows] is for music then a CD player everytime.

If you're a movie-buff and CD reproduction is secondary then the DVD is the ticket.

If you need to combine the two then Marantz DV6001 is ideal, likewise the Cambridge DVD player would be a good at music [IMHO].
 

DistortedVision

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I'd always believed that you couldn't beat a seperate CD player. However, I recently upgraded my DVD player Arcam DV89 to Arcam D135 and I was really impressed by the quality. Bear in mind that I usually listen to CDs on a £6000 CD player. The DV135 It also plays DVD-A and SACD.

I know its kind of exactly what you are trying to upgrade from and so its not the answer you were expecting. But the DV135 is available from SuperFi for £400 making it an absolute bargain.
 

DistortedVision

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The Arcam DV135 was £800 RRP and got 4 stars in the WHF review and was HiFi Choice Editor's Choice. I also know that renowned reviewer Jimmy Hughes (of HiFi Choice and Hif-Fi+) uses the DV135 as his primary CD player.
 
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I think it would be pointless to use the CA 640 just as a transport, feeding the receiver's DAC, which probably is of a much lesser quality than the one the CA uses.

Using the analog outputs of a good CDP will definitely improve your stereo sound, since UPGs are additive. But when using a multichannel receiver for stereo listening performance will always be compromised (unless we are talking of a Bryston multichannel power or something similar).

Used to own a Denon AVR-3806, which retailed for USD 1.400 or so; it was quite good for multichannel. But when I compared it to an Arcam A65 Plus, which retails for half the price of the Denon, the Arcam was far superior: it made music, instead of just playing sounds. The Denon was actually more transparent sounding on the top octave, with a bit more microinformation on hand at really high frequencies; but that was the only thing it did better than the Arcam. Musical it was not.

Same thing with a Denon DVD-3910 universal player. Playing CDs it was actually very good, but only as a CDP at a third of the price or so. There are no surprises here. If you open it, you can see a good Burr Brown DAC chip, but only one! And the power supply sucked: only a smal transformer (not even a toroid), small caps of lesser brands, not very good opamps, etc.

Of course there's always exceptions, and I trust the Arcam DVD135 sounds great. But does it sound as good as the CDP 192? I doubt it.
 
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Anonymous

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DistortedVision:The Arcam DV135 was £800 RRP and got 4 stars in the WHF review and was HiFi Choice Editor's Choice. I also know that renowned reviewer Jimmy Hughes (of HiFi Choice and Hif-Fi+) uses the DV135 as his primary CD player.

DistortedVision, have you done direct comparisons between you T+A / Tag McLaren combo and the DV135? It would be very useful to know how the DV135 compares to a really high-end CDP.
 
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Anonymous

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One of the budget DACs (Beresford, CA Dacmagic) will also bring the level of most DVD players up to scratch in my experience. DVD players often make decent transfers, the only downside is the relatively slow loading times.

ÿFor £120 the Beresford will outperform the CA 540, no question...IMO.ÿBut combined with ÿa stereo amp would make things even better.
 

nads

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if you have a CD and a DVD at the same value and you are not using a DAC then the CD should sound better.

but if you are using a DAC a cheap DVD transport used with a DAC can be a supprise.
 
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Anonymous

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(I have no CDP currently.. but I just spin wax so I'm not being a hippocrit)

Honestly though, if you're serious about sound it has to be a dedicated CDP or solid transport for DAC. Even the DVD players touted as superb cd decks fall on their face compared to entry level mid-fi stuff. imo
 

DistortedVision

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Tannoyite: DistortedVision, have you done direct comparisons between you T+A / Tag McLaren combo and the DV135? It would be very useful to know how the DV135 compares to a really high-end CDP.

I should clarify the way everything is setup. I don't use the Tag DAC with my D10. It would make no sense to do that. The D10 has a quadruple converter i.e. eight Burr Brown D/A converters - acknowledged as the best of all types. It also has an analogue valve-based output and filter stage. Using my Tag DAC would bypass all of this.

I have my DV135, Sony Freeview box and Pinnacle Showcenter media player all feeding into the Tag DAC. I also have the DV135 directly connected to my V10 amp by interconnects because DVD-A won't work with digital out.

Anyway, to answer your questions yes I have done direct A to B comparisons. When I first got the DV135 I played Depeche Mode's Ultra which I have on SACD and CD on both the DV135 and the D10 with a 10 second lag. I used the CD layer on the SACD to make it a fair comparison. I also played it on my Gyro SE turntable as I have Ultra on 180gsm vinyl.

Listening to the DV135 directly connected to the amp it sounded pretty good. It sounded better through the DAC but still no where near as good as the D10. The difference in resolution is substantial and the DV135 just couldn't compete on dynamics and soundstage. Interesting I watched the DVD that came with the SACD about the making of the album and they used a a valve pre-amplifier when recordng it.

In case you're interested in how the T+A compared with my Michell Gyro SE. Well that's a harder comparison. I think each has there own merits but I think I preferred the turntable on that particular recording. There was more warmth and depth to the sound. This isn't always the case and alot depends on the shortcomings on current vinyl pressings.

Anyway back to the OP's original question. Giving it more thought I'd have to agree with Joel and say go for the CD192. It will sound better on CDs and I assuming you aren't interested in SACD and DVD-A. Also the CD192 will have much better resale value than the DVD player when you come to upgrade.
 
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Thanks, DistortedVision, that was very interesting. You've got a really enviable system!
 
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Anonymous

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Ive just replaced my main music source from a denon 2930 to a roksan kandy mk111 and the differnce is clear! The soundstage is the most obvious improvement, i keep thinking my center speakers kicking out the vocals on a lot cds, and it just simply boogies harder and puts a smile on my face which too me is everthing.
 

Gerrardasnails

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garethwd:Ive just replaced my main music source from a denon 2930 to a roksan kandy mk111 and the differnce is clear! The soundstage is the most obvious improvement, i keep thinking my center speakers kicking out the vocals on a lot cds, and it just simply boogies harder and puts a smile on my face which too me is everthing.

"i keep thinking my center speakers kicking out the vocals on a lot cds" - I think that is the marker for me. I always feel like walking over to my centre speaker to double check that there is no sound coming from it!
 

Gerrardasnails

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raypalmer:(I have no CDP currently.. but I just spin wax so I'm not being a hippocrit)

Honestly though, if you're serious about sound it has to be a dedicated CDP or solid transport for DAC. Even the DVD players touted as superb cd decks fall on their face compared to entry level mid-fi stuff. imo

I have to strongly disagree. The FMJ DV27A I had was superb. The Arcam FMJ DV139, Naim DVD5 and any number of Meridian dvd players (to name just a few) would be the match for many many cd players. Obviously a dvd player and same price cd player will not be a match (as I was saying with Joel's equipment). However, top end dvd players from the more musical companies, will match up with cd players at half the price. I'm calling Arcam's FMJ DV139 will cope with the CD192 for instance.
 

D.J.KRIME

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I have a Denon DVD3930 and IMHO it is a very capible machine at spinning CD's. When listening to a CD I switch the Denon to Direct Mode which turns off all video on the Denon and output to my amp via stereo RCA's as opposed to Coax digital as for when I am watching a DVD. I also use my AV amp in its Pure Direct mode.

Now yes I know a "propper cd and stereo amp" on a simular budget would sound better but as for most of us in the real world neithet budget or space will alow this so its a case of getting the best DVD player you can find in your budget that will also do a very good job with CD's, as its not possible to get a CD player that can do both jobs now is it!
 
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Anonymous

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I think it really depends what money you are going to throw at it. I use an arcamdiva 137 dvd with cyrus amplification and b&w 704's and the sound quality is a good match for anything around the £1000 IMHO. If only having one box is important which it was to me at the time and you do not wish to compromise then I do not think you will be dissapointed with this type player.In fact I demo'd a new cyrus 8se+psxr in my sysem to compare the two (you know curoisity and all that)and found that a subsequent interconnect lead and speaker lead upgrade had a far bigger result . This was a big surprise as a £600 total lead upgrade left a £1600 cd upgrade for dead. Thats not to say I will not re-demo the cyrus or the new meridian at around £2200(heard it at my local dealer....ahhhh wow) with the new leads at some time in the future .

If the arcam diva 135 is available at present really cheap and has the same sort of sound as my 137 then I feel you perhaps are in for a bit of a treat if you give it a wizz.

Alan.
 
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Anonymous

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How will the Denon DVD3800BD compare with the CD players mentioned here? If you have to go for one box to play all silver disks, which would it be?
 
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Anonymous

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Hi will canta answer your question excactly but i can tell a roksan kandy murders a denon dv2900 and the dv2930! although both the denons arnt bad as far dvd players go!
 

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