Cyrus aCA7.5 replaced with Nad 1240 pre amp

[FennerMachine]

Just tried my system with a 20+ year old pre map, the Nad 1240 instead of my Cyrus aCA7.5.

WOW!

The harshness I was getting has all but gone. The bass is deeper and I can follow bass guitars. Speech/singing range is better, I can hear what is being sung from some artist that were too harsh before.

A bit of speed at the low end has been lost but I think that the quantity of low end more than makes up for that!

Nice!

Early days so far but I am well impressed.

Still want to try the Spendor A6 speakers but hopefully they will be even better with this pre amp!

 

[Anonymous]

NAD are much warmer than Cyrus so this is no surprise!

 

[MUSICRAFT]

FennerMachine:
Just tried my system with a 20+ year old pre map, the Nad 1240 instead of my Cyrus aCA7.5.

WOW!

The harshness I was getting has all but gone. The bass is deeper and I can follow bass guitars. Speech/singing range is better, I can hear what is being sung from some artist that were too harsh before.

A bit of speed at the low end has been lost but I think that the quantity of low end more than makes up for that!

Nice!

Early days so far but I am well impressed.

Still want to try the Spendor A6 speakers but hopefully they will be even better with this pre amp!

Hi FennerMachine

Good to hear that you are enjoying the qualities of the NAD 1240 pre amplifier. I hope you will still also keep a look out for the superb NAD C160 pre amplifier because from what i hear the C160 is significantly better then the already impressive 1240!

I would personally look at getting the C160 first, secondly upgrade to Mono 7.5's and lastly consider alternative speakers.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[FennerMachine]

Update after some time with the Nad 1240.

The Nad is better overall. I can hear nuances to the music I never heard before. I can also have the music louder without hurting my ears! The treble is good without being harsh. The bass is much more lax though. Much more bass overall but not as quick/snappy as the Cyrus amp.

Overall I am please with my new pre amp.

Now I have tamed the treble I need to reign in the bass a bit!

I will keep looking for the Nad C160 before considering new speakers.

 

[bluebrazil]

maybe you went sideways from upgrading your speakers

 

[FennerMachine]

Perhaps you are right bluebrazil. The sound seems to have shifted towards bass and away from treble. There is more detail overall. You have Cyrus kit - how do you find it with your speakers? What other speakers have you tried or demoed? I did like the Spendor A6 on the demo I had but it was with Arcam kit, closest they had to Cyrus. The PMC GB1i on the same kit sounded absolutely precise and spot on but very clinical and harsh compared to the Spendor's.

 

[FennerMachine]

What other pre amps would work well with the rest of my system?

The Cyrus is definitely too bright and bass light but the Nad is a bit too mellow in the treble and a bit too wayward in the bass.

Listened to a few more tracks today, including a live performance of Guns n' Roses November Rain and the guitars were way too soft!

This is the same with many other songs. Seems I need something in between.

What about an older Quad pre amp? Something like the Quad 44? Or would the Nad C160 fix these problems?

 

[MUSICRAFT]

FennerMachine:
What other pre amps would work well with the rest of my system?

The Cyrus is definitely too bright and bass light but the Nad is a bit too mellow in the treble and a bit too wayward in the bass.

Listened to a few more tracks today, including a live performance of Guns n' Roses November Rain and the guitars were way too soft!

This is the same with many other songs. Seems I need something in between.

What about an older Quad pre amp? Something like the Quad 44? Or would the Nad C160 fix these problems?

Hi FennerMachine

The Quad 44 is a very good pre amp however i don't feel it is going to have enough grip.

Ime pre amps such as the NAD C160, Rotel RC995 or RC1090 are the ones you should be looking at with Cyrus power amplifiers. The important points with these three pre amplifiers are that they'll enable source component(s) to see their input stages and breathe far more effectively and their robust output stages will exert far greater grip and drive over your Cyrus power amps.

Btw, from the outset i've recommended a change of pre amp and in the first instance this is still the route which i feel you should pursue.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Frank Harvey]

If you haven't tried a more recent Cyrus pre-amp, then you really should do. Cyrus has changed over the years, and many people regard 'the Cyrus sound' as being thin and bright, but this was based on the fact that most people have heard their older integrated amplifiers. These have vastly changed, but there pre/power combos were far from that undeserved tag - they're smoother with a puncture bass, and have been very popular among those who've heard them in recent years.

It sounds like you prefer a smoother sound but not too smooth - in this case, that'll probably rule out Quad. Try a Rega Cursa, or the ATC CA2, but do also try a Cyrus - maybe the PreXP, or maybe even the PreXPD if you fancy a pre with a built in DAC. If you fancy being extravagant, the DACxp+ is an extremely open and revealing pre-amplifier with a wonderful DAC on board, which has been one of Cyrus' most popular products for us. At least the last few recommendations are in keeping with your current system aesthetics, and will genuinely bring your system up to date as far as the front end is concerned.

 

[bluebrazil]

unfortunately fenner ive never heard cyrus with spendor speakers but have heard good things from others on here. i have heard the pmc db1i's with the pre xpd and 8 powers and they sounded very good, i have heard the pmc baby floor standers and they sounded very nice also. the best sound ive heard tho was with the dynaudio contour 1.4's, guess thats no surprise really as they are a more expensive speaker. from what i can gather the usual suspects to partner with cyrus are atc, spendor, pmc and dynaudio. if i were you i would ask your dealer if you can bring in your pre and power amps to demo the spendors and pmc's with as i dont think the arcam kit is much of a match.

 

[FennerMachine]

Thanks for the replies.

Rick - I think you are right! What a change the Nad 1240 has made! I have been keeping an eye out for Nad C160 and the Rotel's.

David - Rega Cursa & ATC CA2 are well within my original budget of about £1500.00. I should really pay a visit and demo them. I should have waited a bit on getting my Cyrus pre amp serviced as I could have got it upgraded to a Pre XP d for an extra £589.00 but didn't think of upgrading any of my kit until it was sent off! Hind-site is a wonderful word!

bluebrazil - good suggestion, I could take my Cyrus amps to test the Spendor's. Could kill two birds with one stone perhaps?

Thanks all of you!

 

[mrc]

....but hindsight is an even more wonderful word!

 

[FennerMachine]

That it be, that it be!

 

[Singslinger]

I'm not familiar with that NAD model or how NAD matches with Cyrus but the new NAD C165BEE is quite a highly-rated preamp...maybe worth considering?

 

[FennerMachine]

Another option to look at. If the C160 works better than my 1240 then in theory the C165BEE should be even better...

On the other hand as David said I probably want something closer to the Cyrus pre amp I currently have so NAD might not be for me.

Worth demoing though.

 

[MUSICRAFT]

FennerMachine:
Another option to look at. If the C160 works better than my 1240 then in theory the C165BEE should be even better...

Hi FennerMachine

You've already got an excellent source in your cd player. What the cd player now ideally needs in particular is a pre amp which it can easily 'see' and ultimately for the pre amps output stages to be robust and powerful enough so as to drive and grip the interconnect cable and the Cyrus power amps as effectively as possibly. In this respect (as a former Cyrus dealer, owner and user of Cyrus components including aCA7.5 with PSX-R) i can honestly tell you Cyrus pre amps can be improved upon by other manufacturers pre amps such as the ones which i've recommended to you. I think the C160 will offer you the ideal compromise and for not too much money. The C160 will energise your power amps and offer long term satisfaction with a sound which you can 'feel'.

I tell you what find a C160 and if you are not happy with it after a couple of months then i'll take it off your hands. Fair enough?

Btw, just to be clear i don't deal with used components.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Frank Harvey]

This is going too far now.

As a Cyrus dealer from 1990-1996, then 2002-present, a Cyrus user, and someone that is familiar with the current range (and every model since 2002) of Cyrus pre-amplifiers, I would question some of the ludicrous claims made in the previous post.

ANY pre-amplifier can be improved upon - nothing is the be all and end all.

 

[FennerMachine]

Whoa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Rick & David,

Both of you, thanks for you suggestions.

Both of you have personal experience with different kit and different clients.

I am open minded, I don't mind spending a bit of money to improve my hi-fi, but obviously want to save where I can.

I will consider both of your various suggestions.

Again, Rick & David thank you.

 

[Frank Harvey]

A pleasure, FM.

 

[FennerMachine]

Just an update on what I have done to my system.

The NAD pre amp got a bit boring, put the Cyrus back on.

I had the speakers toed in at about 30 degrees, now firing straight forwards. This took some of the harshness off but still felt like a change of components, whether pre amp or speakers.

Then I put the PSX-R from the CD player to the pre amp, no point having it on the CD player if the pre amp is restricting it!

So far very impressed with the change. Bass is a bit firmer and the harshness has gone.

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Then I put the PSX-R from the CD player to the pre amp, no point having it on the CD player if the pre amp is restricting it!

Hi FennerMachine

Adding the power supply to the pre amp does help lift the performance and i am glad you are now happier with the performance of your system. However i will just say this matter regarding the pre amp is not just about a case of subsituting the PSX-R from your cdp to the pre amp or even for that matter having both the cdp and pre amp having their own PSX-R's. If it was this simple i would have suggested this route to you earlier on. Even in its existing configuration the pre amp is still restricting the performance capabilities of your source and power amplifiers and i still feel this is what you should ideally look at addressing first.

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[Frank Harvey]

Just an update on what I have done to my system.

The NAD pre amp got a bit boring, put the Cyrus back on.

I had the speakers toed in at about 30 degrees, now firing straight forwards. This took some of the harshness off but still felt like a change of components, whether pre amp or speakers.

Then I put the PSX-R from the CD player to the pre amp, no point having it on the CD player if the pre amp is restricting it!

So far very impressed with the change. Bass is a bit firmer and the harshness has gone.

This is the problem with 'nice' sounding products. For some people they're just not exciting enough to listen to. They may initially be a nice change, but once settled in, it's easy to realise the change was superficial, and it's not really what's needed long term.
Adding PSXR's will improve the performance of the products they're plugged into - they have to. This will bring about definite changes to the existing products. It's actually quote surprising what differences the PSXR's make to the pre-amplifier in particular. Of course, you're free to upgrade the actual items later on and still retain the PSXR's. One point on the upgrading - how many manufacturers allow you to post your item back, upgrade it to the next model up, or even higher, and give you a fresh two year warranty?

 

[FennerMachine]

Indeed!

I am fairly happy with my system now but have tasted the Spendors!

I still plan on demoing the Spendor A6 and SA1 against my speakers.

If needed I will also upgrade my pre amp.

I WILL go over budget, but I always set my budget bellow what I can spend as it always goes over!

 

[MUSICRAFT]

Hi FennerMachine

Fair enough.

Fwiw, my offer still stands

All the best

Rick @ Musicraft

 

[FennerMachine]

Thanks Rick!

If I find a NAD C160 I might get one anyway. Havn't stopped looking for one yet.