audiolab 8200cd and acoustic energy aelite3 speakers .what amp around £750?

damonster

Well-known member
Oct 30, 2008
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0
18,540
Hi ,I currently have an audiolab 8200cd and acoustic energy aelite 3 speakers running through a Cyrus 6vs2 amp .

I feel the speakers need a lot more power to get the full potential from them as they are 200w rated.

This setup has a nice neutral sound to it but i know the amp is the weak as the speakers feel like they are hardly breaking a sweat , can any one suggest any amps for around the £ 750 mark ( new or second hand ) i was thinking of a different route to Cyrus probably the Roksan Kandy k2 but will the speakers perform ok without bi-wiring them.Or any other amps second hand that would benifit my setup.

Thanks!

Audiolab cd8200>Logitech squeezebox touch>Cyrus 6vs2>Acoustic energy Aelite 3>chord carnival silverscreen cable.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
It'd be handy to know what type of music you generally listen to?

For me the likes of an Arcam Alpha 10, Arcam FMJ A32, NAD C355BEE (or C356BEE new), Rotel RA1520 (new) and possibly the Leema Pulse would be a good place to start

All will drive the Aelite speakers very well; even though they're rated at 200W they're still an easy drive so a good amp will drive them with no issues.

You could consider the Cyrus 6XP (if you can find one 2nd hand); it's definitely a step up on sound quality over the 6VS2 but what about looking to add a power amp such as the Cyrus 8 power amp or maybe a Cyrux XPower if you can find one within your budget 2nd hand?
 

Frank Harvey

Well-known member
Jun 27, 2008
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The matching 8200A will also do well in that system. A demo I did a few days ago really showed how strong a pairing the 8200CD and 8200A is.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
FrankHarveyHiFi said:
The matching 8200A will also do well in that system. A demo I did a few days ago really showed how strong a pairing the 8200CD and 8200A is.
Good call; missed that one out


You could then save a bit more £££ and go for the matching Audiolab 8200 power amp as well
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Its down to power rating, build, features and whether you like the styling or not. If its a decently designed amp with a good technical specification then it will sound as good as any other with a similar technical specification and you probably wont be able to tell the differnece between any 2 amps. The largest variations occurs in the speakers that you buy. This is what determines how your system will sound. Your speakers have sensitivity of 89db so are faily efficient. They have a nominal 8ohm impedance so should not be hard to drive. Your speaker has Power Hanlding of 175 max according to the website. This quoted has always been ambiguous. Your cyrus amp is certainly an excellent performaing amplifier with about 60 watts into 8 ohms. If you want a bigger amp then maybe a quad 909 would suffice. There are a few brand new and second hand 909's on ebay, I bought a second hand quad 909, 6 months old for £600 last year, with still 6 months ganrantee left from a hifi dealer. In perfect conditon. 140 watts into 8 ohms. 230 into 4 ohms. This might be big enough for you. You will need a preamp for this.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
scienceguys said:
Its down to power rating, build, features and whether you like the styling or not. If its a decently designed amp with a good technical specification then it will sound as good as any other with a similar technical specification and you probably wont be able to tell the differnece between any 2 amps. The largest variations occurs in the speakers that you buy. This is what determines how your system will sound. Your speakers have sensitivity of 89db so are faily efficient. They have a nominal 8ohm impedance so should not be hard to drive. Your speaker has Power Hanlding of 175 max according to the website. This quoted has always been ambiguous. Your cyrus amp is certainly an excellent performaing amplifier with about 60 watts into 8 ohms. If you want a bigger amp then maybe a quad 909 would suffice. There are a few brand new and second hand 909's on ebay, I bought a second hand quad 909, 6 months old for £600 last year, with still 6 months ganrantee left from a hifi dealer. In perfect conditon. 140 watts into 8 ohms. 230 into 4 ohms. This might be big enough for you. You will need a preamp for this.
Not sure where you get that information from

I've heard all the above mentioned amps including the QUAD 909 with the QUAD pre and I could tell the difference in sounds between them all!

Some had leaner bass but a more detailed midrange & treble. Some were bassier but more aggressiuve in the treble/midrange etc...

Every amp, IMO, has it's own soundstage no matter whether they match power output or not
 
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Anonymous

Guest
hifilover1979 said:
Not sure where you get that information from

I've heard all the above mentioned amps including the QUAD 909 with the QUAD pre and I could tell the difference in sounds between them all!

Some had leaner bass but a more detailed midrange & treble. Some were bassier but more aggressiuve in the treble/midrange etc...

Every amp, IMO, has it's own soundstage no matter whether they match power output or not
If the amps did not have a flat frequency response then i would say that what you describe may have been down to the amp, if the amp had a frequncy response with gross peaks at certain frequency that is, but modern amplifiers of good design have a ruler flat frequency response up to and over 20khz, i have measured a few including the quad 909, and the 909 has total distortion less than 0.01% also at 20khz at 100watts which is undetecable by humans that is if you can hear upto 20khz. below 10khz the distortion is even lover 0.005% and continus to drop with frequency. Inaudible levels of distortion.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
scienceguys said:
Its down to power rating, build, features and whether you like the styling or not. If its a decently designed amp with a good technical specification then it will sound as good as any other with a similar technical specification and you probably wont be able to tell the differnece between any 2 amps. The largest variations occurs in the speakers that you buy. This is what determines how your system will sound. Your speakers have sensitivity of 89db so are faily efficient. They have a nominal 8ohm impedance so should not be hard to drive. Your speaker has Power Hanlding of 175 max according to the website. This quoted has always been ambiguous. Your cyrus amp is certainly an excellent performaing amplifier with about 60 watts into 8 ohms. If you want a bigger amp then maybe a quad 909 would suffice. There are a few brand new and second hand 909's on ebay, I bought a second hand quad 909, 6 months old for £600 last year, with still 6 months ganrantee left from a hifi dealer. In perfect conditon. 140 watts into 8 ohms. 230 into 4 ohms. This might be big enough for you. You will need a preamp for this.
Whilst I don't give two hoots about your capabilities as a speller, I must take exception to your stance on amplifiers sounding the same. I for one can tell the difference between my Dynaudio 2/6's being driven by either A NAD 326 BEE, Marantz SA KI Peal Lite or a Technics SU 600. Blindfolded

As David Brent says........................ FACT
 
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Anonymous

Guest
scienceguys said:
hifilover1979 said:
Not sure where you get that information from

I've heard all the above mentioned amps including the QUAD 909 with the QUAD pre and I could tell the difference in sounds between them all!

Some had leaner bass but a more detailed midrange & treble. Some were bassier but more aggressiuve in the treble/midrange etc...

Every amp, IMO, has it's own soundstage no matter whether they match power output or not
If the amps did not have a flat frequency response then i would say that what you describe may have been down to the amp, if the amp had a frequncy response with gross peaks at certain frequency that is, but modern amplifiers of good design have a ruler flat frequency response up to and over 20khz, i have measured a few including the quad 909, and the 909 has total distortion less than 0.01% also at 20khz at 100watts which is undetecable by humans that is if you can hear upto 20khz. below 10khz the distortion is even lover 0.005% and continus to drop with frequency. Inaudible levels of distortion.
In fact it doesn't matter wether you measure it with a ruler, tape measure, feat and inches ohms, or whatever. I can still hear the difference in sound between certain amplifiers driving the same speakers.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
scienceguys said:
hifilover1979 said:
Not sure where you get that information from

I've heard all the above mentioned amps including the QUAD 909 with the QUAD pre and I could tell the difference in sounds between them all!

Some had leaner bass but a more detailed midrange & treble. Some were bassier but more aggressiuve in the treble/midrange etc...

Every amp, IMO, has it's own soundstage no matter whether they match power output or not
If the amps did not have a flat frequency response then i would say that what you describe may have been down to the amp, if the amp had a frequncy response with gross peaks at certain frequency that is, but modern amplifiers of good design have a ruler flat frequency response up to and over 20khz, i have measured a few including the quad 909, and the 909 has total distortion less than 0.01% also at 20khz at 100watts which is undetecable by humans that is if you can hear upto 20khz. below 10khz the distortion is even lover 0.005% and continus to drop with frequency. Inaudible levels of distortion.
Jesus...


Sorry but YAWN...!

What's happened to those days when people just 'listened' to their hifi and enjoyed the music that it kicks out?!?!

Sorry; but really NOT interested in measurements etc... FACT (as The Limey said haha
) that the amps mentioned DO have a different soundstage to ME and that was without 'measurements' but actually sitting down, getting some good CD's together and using a good CD player and some good speakers!
 
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Anonymous

Guest
[/quote]

Jesus...


Sorry but YAWN...!

What's happened to those days when people just 'listened' to their hifi and enjoyed the music that it kicks out?!?!

Sorry; but really NOT interested in measurements etc... FACT (as The Limey said haha
) that the amps mentioned DO have a different soundstage to ME and that was without 'measurements' but actually sitting down, getting some good CD's together and using a good CD player and some good speakers!

[/quote]

Amplifiers dont create a sound stage as you put it, they just amplifier an anlogue signal with very low distortion.

The music on the cd creates the soundstage
 

damonster

Well-known member
Oct 30, 2008
30
0
18,540
Thanks for your input so far guys .I listen to indie music mainly but also anything that is well recorded. i want to improve the soundstage ,make it wider with more air and space beetween instruments .

so am i already limited by my speakers.

I was on the understanding when reading reviews on different amps ,always mentioned are bass ,midrange,soundstage and air between instruments.and soundtests are done with same speakers and source.so surely different amps must drive speakers in different ways.

thanks for all your varied views ,all imput is welcome.

A salesman from seveoakes said that the amp is the most important part of your setup.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
No, you're not limited by your speakers. They're good speakers so dont worry about that

In all fairness; dont worry about the 'every amp sounds the same' comment as well.

The amp is important yes as a poor amp wont be able to drive the speakers as well as they deserve but a good source (CDP, DAC etc...) is as important as you need it to replicate the music well. But, in sayinb that, a poor recording is a poor recording and you'll find that a lot of CDP's (whether they're budget or mid/high end), if any good, will reply poor recordings as poor recordings and not glamour them up!

Your speakers and CDP are good so they deserve a good amp; for new amps, the Audiolab 8200A would be right up there to demo straight away along side the Leema Pulse, Creek Evo II, NAD C356BEE and Rotel RA1520 IMO

If your prepared to look at 2nd hand amps then the Arcam Alpha 10 or FMJ A32 amps, NAD C355BEE, Cyrus 8VS2 or 6XP and the Musical Fidelity XA200 amps would be well worth considering

I do still think though that a Cyrus power amp such as:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cyrus-Audio-X-Power-Stereo-Power-Amplifier-/110726246662?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Amplifiers&hash=item19c7cc7106

OR

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cyrus-8-Power-Amplifier-Stereo-Mono-Brushed-Black-/280719292945?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Amplifiers&hash=item415c2c7a11

or even the 6 power amp:




http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Cyrus-6-power-Brand-New-2-years-warranty-Silver-/320731453958?pt=UK_AudioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Amplifiers&hash=item4aad159a06

should be worth considering. Bi-amping your AE speakers will really bring them to life and with the money you save you could consider upgrading your interconnects/speaker cables or just buy yourself some new music


These are all superb amps (new, 2nd hand & eBay examples) and can drive speakers very well indeed. They all, however, have a different sound to them so a demo is a muct. Ideally you should be able to get a home demo so do that if you can. Nothing better than hearing new/potential equipment in your own home as this will let you know how it'll sound straight away whereas demo rooms can be far from what you're set-up is in at home!
 
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Anonymous

Guest
damonster said:
Thanks for your input so far guys .I listen to indie music mainly but also anything that is well recorded. i want to improve the soundstage ,make it wider with more air and space beetween instruments .

so am i already limited by my speakers.

I was on the understanding when reading reviews on different amps ,always mentioned are bass ,midrange,soundstage and air between instruments.and soundtests are done with same speakers and source.so surely different amps must drive speakers in different ways.

thanks for all your varied views ,all imput is welcome.

A salesman from seveoakes said that the amp is the most important part of your setup.
The amps you mention have good specifications and are well designed and you wont be able to tell the difference between them audio wise. It realy does come down power, features, looks, build quality in the end. The golden eared members on here want you to beleive otherwise but there have been decades of research into the distortion levels the human ear can and cant detect and and the fact is that humans canot detect distortion levels less than 0.1% at any frequency. The amplifiers you are considering are about 0.01% at 20khz and much less at lower frequencys. We cannot detect this. So if you are comapring two amps with good specifications then you can be assured that they will sound the same.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Dude... No offence but you're not helping the OP

instead of going on about how no one can hear the difference between amps blah, blah & blah; why don't you offer some advice of which amp you think the OP should consider OR leave the thread be & start your own thread about amps & how they all have the same sound & see where you get with that!
 
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Anonymous

Guest
hifilover1979 said:
Dude... No offence but you're not helping the OP instead of going on about how no one can hear the difference between amps blah, blah & blah; why don't you offer some advice of which amp you think the OP should consider OR leave the thread be & start your own thread about amps & how they all have the same sound & see where you get with that!
Actually i am helping him, I am giving him information based on facts and years of research that has been carried out.

what i am not doing is giving him advice which is purely subjective as you are.

Any amps from the following manufacturers would be an excellent choice. Nad, Audiolab, Rotel, Creek, Quad, Cyrus.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
scienceguys said:
hifilover1979 said:
Dude... No offence but you're not helping the OP instead of going on about how no one can hear the difference between amps blah, blah & blah; why don't you offer some advice of which amp you think the OP should consider OR leave the thread be & start your own thread about amps & how they all have the same sound & see where you get with that!
Actually i am helping him, I am giving him information based on facts and years of research that has been carried out.

what i am not doing is giving him advice which is purely subjective as you are.

Any amps from the following manufacturers would be an excellent choice. Nad, Audiolab, Rotel, Creek, Quad, Cyrus.
Please can you provide links to these facts & research then please!

My advice isn't subjective as such; it's through experience of knowing the speakers & hearing the various amps with them
 

chebby

Well-known member
Jun 2, 2008
1,246
14
19,195
daskeg said:
I don't think so.

Just someone recycling the same old "amps is amps", "cables is cables" and "bits is bits" arguments as if they were newly discovered pearls of wisdom that we sad, uninformed peasants haven't already had to sit and read through a thousand times before.

I don't object to the lectures. It's knowing exactly what they are going to be - word for word - before I even start reading them that I object to.

Can someone from the "scientific measurement vs listening" camp please find a new or entertaining angle on this poor, flogged horse of an argument?

I don't even care who is right anymore.
 

matthewpiano

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2007
494
330
19,270
I would be tempted to audition the Audiolab 8200A, a Creek Evolution 2, and the Naim Nait 5i to see which suits you the best. All three are excellent amps but offer different presentations and much will come down to the synergy with your CD player and speakers. See if you can get a home demo of the amp you like best just to make sure you are happy with it at home before making a final committment.

Another option would be to try the XTZ amp. The specs are good and I've read some good reviews of it, and the home trial facility means you could send it back if it doesn't suit you or your other equipment.
 
T

the record spot

Guest
I have no idea what "air" and "soundstage" mean from one person to the next in the context of what you're looking for in the music you listen to.

That said, you'd want your system to do a decent job of capturing the music to a certain standard that will fit how you'd like to hear it.

With that in mind, brands are almost irrelevant. Do you like your music loud, quiet, orchestral, solo, choral, fast, slow, rock, pop, chamber music...you could go on for ages.

You have an incredible amount of stuff out there that you could try. For the older used Japanese behemoth amps, Sansui to absolutely nobody's surprise on here, is my pick. They do music from the AU-n17 series that blows anything else away. Currently using an AU-217, but there's a 717 that's going to a repair shop soon for another stay more than likely.They do music better than anything I've heard.

Newer stuff, well, there's XTZ and Harman/Kardon. Both will do you a good job of serving up good control, power and a contemporary touch with onboard DACs in addition to the usual vanilla intergrated amp roster. AV amps will give you the means to bi-amp. After that, the choice is yours.
 
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the record spot

Guest
chebby said:
Can someone from the "scientific measurement vs listening" camp please find a new or entertaining angle on this poor, flogged horse of an argument?
Is that the same flogged horse that rides into town with people its back from a variety of audio forums that can hear by no shortage of miracles stuff that's outwith the bounds of typical human hearing capabilities?
 

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