Arcam A19 vs Creek Evolution 50A (or Marantz PM6005?)

[obsidyen]

I'm setting up a hi-fi system for my bedroom. It's a small room, 12 squaremetres. I'm going to use it for music listening, gaming and films. I have a DAC (Teac UD-H01) and speakers (Monitor Audio BX2). I had a stereo receiver but it wasn't very good so I sold it. I want a midrange amp that can deliver good sound at a reasonable price. I want to spend 750 pounds at most.

What I want: Exciting, energetic sound with enough punch and attack. But I may also listen to relaxing music sometimes. I want good bass because it makes games and films more fun.

Marantz is obviously the cheapest. Could it be because it lacks some attack and is dull? Some say it's too warm.

Arcam is said to be a good amp, but then some say it's too clinical and laid back. Some say the bass is boomy.

Creek Evolution 50A is said by many to be the best amp in its price range, and to me it just looks amazing. Such a beautiful device. But I wonder if it would be overkill for a small bedroom?

I will audition the Marantz and Arcam myself, but I can't audition the Creek. Why, you may wonder. I live in Turkey and it's easy to find Marantz and Arcam products but Creek is only sold by one hi-fi store in the capitol, Ankara (also the importer). It's ridiculous but the owner says it's because hi-fi stores in other cities want too much profit. Maybe he's right though, because he sells Creek products as the same price in the UK. Usually we pay more than you guys.

My speakers, the BX2s are said to be bright by some. I agree but they never sounded harsh to my ears, I enjoy their sound. There's better speakers though, you get what you pay for after all. But I'm not thinking about changing them for now. Some say BX2s are a good match with Arcam.

What do you think?

 

[bigfish786]

Buy the creek. From what you say it is the one you want.

Whos to say in the future, it could be the amp in your living space.

 

[obsidyen]

Maybe I should travel to Ankara for an audition.It'd take a day to go and get back but it might be worth it.

What would be good speakers with the Creek? Creek says Epos is good with them but I kind of like the new B&W 685 S2. I wonder if they'd be an improvement on BX2s (I said I'm going to keep BX2s for now but if they don't match well with the Creek, I might have second thoughts about it).

 

[BigH]

I would get the Creek as well esp. if its cheaper than the Arcam. Bass is a bit lighter than Arcam but in your room should be OK. Epos is same company as Creek so should be a good match but best to audition, other to try Kef R100s.

 

[unsleepable]

Arcam is said to be a good amp, but then some say it's too clinical and laid back. Some say the bass is boomy.

I've got the Arcam A19 and I find its sound quite different to what you describe. I don't think it is clinical at all. While it is detailed and reaches far into the high frequencies, it has a rather warmish presentation.

I also don't think its bass is boomy at all—actually the bass of my Kef R100 used to have a tendency to be boomy with certain tracks, and I found that it improved quite noticibly from my previous Naim XS.

Recently I auditioned the Creek Evo 2, which according to reviews has better bass than the 50A. And while it wasn't so different to the A19 in this regard, I found the bass of the A19 was still a bit tighter and reached lower than that of the Evo 2, although it wasn't an obvious difference.

What I agree with is that the middle frequencies are a bit recessed—I guess this could be what you refer to as lean.

Anyways, since you are going to audition it I will be very much looking forward to knowing your opinion also.

 

[Happy_Listner]

Hi,

Are you planning on upgrading your speakers in the near future? Do you use a record player? Do you like to listen to the radio?

If you have no plans on upgrading your speakers or front end then save some money and buy the Marantz PM6005. Otherwise, I think you can get a little better sound quality from the other two integrated amps.

Both the Maratnz and the Arcam have a built in phono stage so you could play a record player straight away.

The Creek is interesting in that you can buy a phono module latter if you want and you can also buy a tuner module turning it into a receiver. If money is no object then out of the three I would choose the Creek. The sound is really good and it is something that the rest of your system can grow around.

Also think about the Exposure 1010 integrated amp it has good reviews and it is less expensive, the NAD stereo receiver, and the Yamaha R-N500 network receiver. Not sure what the price for the Marantz PM8005 is in the UK but here in the States it is the same price as the Creek and the Arcam units.

Hope this helps

 

[Al ears]

I don't think the Creek would be overkill for a bedroom, you should see what I've got in mine.

Maybe not too helpful but if you can I would also consider the Exposure 2010S2 amp.

This might prove a better match to your existing speakers.

Welcome to the forum by the way.

 

[obsidyen]

Thanks for all the replies. I'm going to audition the Arcam and Marantz this weekend. I can audition the Creek 7-10 days later because the dealer says all Creek amps are sold out and it'll be in stock again in 10 days time. I might buy new speakers than can match the new amp's quality. I'll let you know.

Sadly Exposure doesn't have a dealer in my country, apparently they're looking for one.

 

[obsidyen]

I auditioned the Arcam and the Marantz today. I liked them both, both are very good amps. But I think they were a bit laid back. I didn't quite feel that punch, that exciting sound. Speakers were KEF R300. Very good speakers also, possible candidates for an upgrade.

Then I went to another hi-fi store. I auditioned Hegel H80 there and fell in love with it instantly. It had the best of both worlds. Detailed, yet not clinical, good bass, exciting sound etc.. Ticked all the boxes for me. Also it has a DAC so that was a plus. The DAC in it is of very high quality so I can sell my DAC. I bought it and now my BX2s sound lots better. Less bright, more neutral, more detailed, open and airy. I know I can't hear the full potential of the amp and the dac without higher quality speakers though. Speakers in the store were Q Acoustics Concept 40. They're big for my room so I'm considering KEF R 300 which I really liked. I want to hear the new Focal Aria 906 as well.

Sorry Creek, Hegel was very good so I can't go to Ankara, even for you.

Ps: In the end I spent much more than what I originally planned to. I know I can keep this amp for at least a decade though. It's that good.

The amp is also very good with my Playstation 4. It has two optical inputs so I connected it to the amp with a regular fiber optic cable.

Thanks for all the help.

 

[Happy_Listner]

Congrats on your Hegel H80 purchase Obsidyen! You made a wise choice.

I would have mentioned that one to you but it was in another price class. Now you really got an amp you can grow your system around. I heard that H80 about two weeks ago hooked up to a pair of the new B&W CM10's, old Theta CD transport using Hegel's internal DAC and also fell in love with that amp. It has to be the best value around. I would say that the amp alone is as good or better than anything in it's price range plus you get a great DAC with USB inputs for free!

You are right in that it sounds smooth while still being detailed. It has a damping factor over 1000 so the bass always feels tightly controlled, and seems more powerful than its 75 watt rating.

Don't forget to hook up your PC or laptop via USB and play some music files though it.

I might buy one as well. If I do I figure that I'll be downloading some hi resolution files more often then buying CD's anymore. The only thing I will have to buy then is a phono pre as the Hegel lacks a phono input.

Let us know what speakers you buy in the future. Try the B&W PM1's along with those KEF's.

 

[BigH]

How much is the Hegel H80?

They seem to have any dealers in the UK?

 

[obsidyen]

I bought them for 1600 Euros in my country (about 1350 pounds). The dealer made a 10% discount. It might be cheaper in the UK, if they have a distributor.

 

[davedotco]

I bought them for 1600 Euros in my country (about 1350 pounds). The dealer made a 10% discount. It might be cheaper in the UK, if they have a distributor.

Hard to find in the uk, but can be bought out of Europe for about £1300-1400.

A good reputation in europe but none at all in the uk. Rather more expensive than the Creek with onboard dac, but at least you can go out, dem it and buy one, unlike the digitally equiped Creek.

 

[csq2]

Creek 50A is bright sounding, lacking richness. Hegel H80 is excellent for the price since it has built-in dac, but there are better amps like the Naim 5si out there.

 

[Happy_Listner]

The Hegel H80 costs $2000 here on the States.

From the above post I disagree very much that the Nait 5 sounds better than the Hegel H80.

I have heard them separately but not side by side. Still from memory I would choose the H80 over the Nait 5 any day. Plus, I would basically be getting an on board $1000 DAC for free.

 

[csq2]

Are you refering to Nait 5i or 5si? The new 5si is much better than the old 5i that you're talking about.

 

[letsavit2]

"punch and attack" you're going to have to trade them speakers mate. They are good speakers but punk and attack they are not.

 

[Happy_Listner]

The Hegel H80 sounds better than the Naim Nait 5si in my opinion. Have you listened to the H80 before?

 

[lpv]

Are you refering to Nait 5i or 5si? The new 5si is much better than the old 5i that you're talking about.

H80 is a class above the cheap loudness effect of 5i & 5si.

 

[obsidyen]

Thanks for the advice, I'm going to do just that. Besides, they're many steps down the budger ladder compared to Hegel H80 so the amp can't do its best with them.

 

[BigH]

I looked on the Hegel website and they have no dealers in the UK, if you put UK it comes with somewhere in Norway I think?

I never thought the Crrek sounded bright but maybe depends on the speakers you used?

Not sure it fair to compare a £1350 amp with £750 ones?

 

[rainsoothe]

Are you refering to Nait 5i or 5si? The new 5si is much better than the old 5i that you're talking about.

H80 is a class above the cheap loudness effect of 5i & 5si.

Yea, i've read the document with that classification, and your statement is 100% accurate and in conformity with it...

To the OP: go listen to this stuff and let your ears decide - best advice I ever got and, innitially, failed to follow. Screw 5 star ratings and all that jazz, if you have a good dealer and u explain what kind of music and what kind of sound you like, they will guide you on your way

goodluck

 

[jesmat]

To the OP: go listen to this stuff and let your ears decide - best advice I ever got and, innitially, failed to follow. Screw 5 star ratings and all that jazz, if you have a good dealer and u explain what kind of music and what kind of sound you like, they will guide you on your way

Seconded.

I'm a novice with a 'budget' system of Concept 20 speakers, Marantz CD6005, QED Signature Revelation speaker cable and Atlas Equator III connects. I've tried it with a Creek 50a, Marantz PM6005 and my 20 year old Denon 350SE.

Despite the Creek being by far the most expensive of the amps - and having the best reputation - it was easily the worst sounding of the three. It lacked punch and musicality - very underwhelming indeed given the price tag and recommendations. The PM6005 and Denon brought music to life in a way that the Creek didn't.

So certainly don't rely solely on the recommendations before spending big money.

 

[matthewpiano]

I agree with jesmat.

It is all too easy to get tied up with all the 5-star ratings, reviews, opinions of other people on forums etc. and in the end none of it actually matters a jot. Ultimately, go with what keeps you and your ears happy, and allows you to enjoy the music. That is the only way to ensure that it continues to be about the content rather than the equipment.

Trust me, the whole hi-fi thing starts to wear very thin long before the music does.

 

[Vladimir]

Are you refering to Nait 5i or 5si? The new 5si is much better than the old 5i that you're talking about.

H80 is a class above the cheap loudness effect of 5i & 5si.

:clap: Agreed!