An AV Amp that can run 7.1 and bi-amp.

admin_exported

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I'm looking for an AV amp that will be able to run 7.1 at the same time as bi-amping the front L+Rs.

Having perused a few manuals, it seems that this is a rare feature even with 9 channel amps, as they tend to use the rear surround posts for bi-amping. It looks as though the Denon 4311 can do it by re assigning the front height/width output but which other decent sub £2k amps can?

Edit; it appears that the Onkyo 3008 maybe able to but the manual is contradictory on this. It both says that when bi-amping that only 5.2 is possible and then elsewhere that 7.2 is possible [^o)] !
 
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Anonymous

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I didn't think so, but it appears I do
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Forgive my naivety but I always thought that the foundations of any surround system were fronts, centre and rears. So it seems daft to rob you of your rears if you want to bi-amp the fronts, rather than using the sides.
 

The_Lhc

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c0pperhead:
I didn't think so, but it appears I do
emotion-2.gif


Forgive my naivety but I always thought that the foundations of any surround system were fronts, centre and rears. So it seems daft to rob you of your rears if you want to bi-amp, rather than the sides.

Surrounds in 5.1 system generally go at the side of the listening position, Surround Back is the new addition and is the channel that will only be used if a 6.1 or 7.1 soundtrack is present, so it makes more sense to "lose" the Surround Back, rather than the Surround Sides, which is what most of the amps do.
 
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Anonymous

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the_lhc:c0pperhead:
I didn't think so, but it appears I do
emotion-2.gif


Forgive my naivety but I always thought that the foundations of any surround system were fronts, centre and rears. So it seems daft to rob you of your rears if you want to bi-amp, rather than the sides.

Surrounds in 5.1 system generally go at the side of the listening position, Surround Back is the new addition and is the channel that will only be used if a 6.1 or 7.1 soundtrack is present, so it makes more sense to "lose" the Surround Back, rather than the Surround Sides, which is what most of the amps do.

Okay, thanks for putting me straight.

But anyway, which not too outrageously priced amp would give me the ability to run 7.1 with the fronts bi-amped, for when listening to 2ch music?
 
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Anonymous

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Denon 4810 can - it has 9 amps and they are fully assignable (the only limitation being when running an 11 channel settup)

Launched at £2800 - can now be had for well under £2k - has not been superseded by a 2011 model

I had mine running 7.1 and fronts biamped until i turned mine into an 8.1 settup then ran the fronts biwired.
 

rs6mra

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Is there any reason why the Denon 2310/2311 with the pre-outs cannot do what is required or have I misunderstood the entire thread including the one posted today: Oh heck I'm confused?
 
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Anonymous

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rs6mra:Is there any reason why the Denon 2310/2311 with the pre-outs cannot do what is required or have I misunderstood the entire thread including the one posted today: Oh heck I'm confused?

Yes, but he would have to purchase a 2 channel amp to power these, I think the OP wants an AVR with 9 channels of amplification built in, the 2310/11 only have 7, you have to decide between 5.1 with fronts bi-amped or 7.1 no bi-amping, but not both.
 
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Anonymous

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markjaspi:Yes, but he would have to purchase a 2 channel amp to power these, I think the OP wants an AVR with 9 channels of amplification built in, the 2310/11 only have 7, you have to decide between 5.1 with fronts bi-amped or 7.1 no bi-amping, but not both.

But shirley there's no reason why a 9 channel amp couldn't run 7.1 with bi-amped fronts, it would have enough amplifiers.

If most 7 channel amps will run 5.1 with bi-amped fronts, then why won't 9 channel amps do similar with 7.1. To have to lose the rears from 7.1 to bi-amp is just robbing Peter to pay Paul. A 9 channel amp has the numbers on side to keep both Peter & Paul happy by mugging Janet & John for my special needs!
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Anonymous

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c0pperhead:
markjaspi:Yes, but he would have to purchase a 2 channel amp to power these, I think the OP wants an AVR with 9 channels of amplification built in, the 2310/11 only have 7, you have to decide between 5.1 with fronts bi-amped or 7.1 no bi-amping, but not both.

But shirley there's no reason why a 9 channel amp couldn't run 7.1 with bi-amped fronts, it would have enough amplifiers.

If most 7 channel amps will run 5.1 with bi-amped fronts, then why won't 9 channel amps do similar with 7.1. To have to lose the rears from 7.1 to bi-amp is just robbing Peter to pay Paul. A 9 channel amp has the numbers on side to keep both Peter & Paul happy by mugging Janet & John for my special needs!
emotion-5.gif


I like it.

But no, because although they have 9 channels available only 7 of them are separate/ discrete, you have to choose which 7 you want, when you bi-amp the high and low connections each take up one power supply, therefore only leaving 3 for Janet and John, and whoever stands at front centre, let's call him bill.

Now you can however, have a 7.1 configuration with the fronts bi- wired ( just to confusion things further).

Edit: and stop calling my Shirley (classic)
 

rs6mra

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Sorry to butt in again, but would the Cyrus 6XP be a suitable 2 channel amplifier to run along side a 5.1 set up with the Denon 2310/2311 and thus enable 2 channel stereo solely for listening to music?
 
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Anonymous

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You could use the Cyrus amp but you will have to check the amp has HT bypass with a fixed gain input so the volume is the completely controlled by the AVR. Otherwise you will have to make sure you have the volume on the Cyrus the same every time you use it.
 

The_Lhc

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markjaspi:You could use the Cyrus amp but you will have to check the amp has HT bypass with a fixed gain input so the volume is the completely controlled by the AVR. Otherwise you will have to make sure you have the volume on the Cyrus the same every time you use it.

I've got the strangest feeling I've been here before...
 
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Anonymous

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the_lhc:markjaspi:You could use the Cyrus amp but you will have to check the amp has HT bypass with a fixed gain input so the volume is the completely controlled by the AVR. Otherwise you will have to make sure you have the volume on the Cyrus the same every time you use it.

I've got the strangest feeling I've been here before...

It does seem to be following a familiar pattern! Almost heard a telephone call from a solicitor in my head for copyright infringement when I posted this lol
 
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Anonymous

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the_lhc:markjaspi:You could use the Cyrus amp but you will have to check the amp has HT bypass with a fixed gain input so the volume is the completely controlled by the AVR. Otherwise you will have to make sure you have the volume on the Cyrus the same every time you use it.

I've got the strangest feeling I've been here before...

It does seem to be following a familiar pattern! Almost heard a telephone call from a solicitor in my head for copyright infringement when I posted this lol
 
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Anonymous

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professorhat:
You can say that again.

It does seem to be following a familiar pattern! Almost heard a telephone call from a solicitor in my head for copyright infringement when I posted this lol
 
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Anonymous

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markjaspi: Now you can however, have a 7.1 configuration with the fronts bi- wired ( just to confusion things further).

How then?
 
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Anonymous

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markjaspi:.. and stop calling my Shirley (classic)

Sorry Bill.
emotion-16.gif
 
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Anonymous

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markjaspi:I like it.But no, because although they have 9 channels available only 7 of them are separate/ discrete, you have to choose which 7 you want, ..)

So what do the other two do and why can't I use them?
emotion-42.gif


Edit: Note to self; Must learn to multiquote
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Anonymous

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c0pperhead:
markjaspi:I like it.But no, because although they have 9 channels available only 7 of them are separate/ discrete, you have to choose which 7 you want, ..)

So what do the other two do and why can't I use them?
emotion-42.gif


Edit: Note to self; Must learn to multiquote
emotion-10.gif


Because only 7 are powered idependently, but you tell the AVR which way you want to configure the 7 available when you run the auto setup for example:

Standard 5.1 - you only use 5, so it draws less power or more to the point each speaker will have more power available.

The channels are front L, front R, Centre, surround back L (a) surround back R (a) surrond L, surround R, front height L (a) front height R (a) front width L (a) front width R(a)

(a) = assignable, so out of these 6 there are only 2 powered channels available, so you have to tell the AVR which ones you are using.

5.1 + 2 width = 7 channels used
5.1 + 2 height = 7 channels used
7.1 = 7 channels used
5.1 + bi- amping = 7 channels used

Unless you have 9 or 11 separate amplified channels in the AVR or separate amps feed via the pre- outs.

To bi- wire you si ply take to separate wires to the high and low connections of the back of the same terminal on your AVR, I personally am unconvinced this makes any difference, but others do I'm sure.

The manual will explain how to bi-wire, but basically you run 2 independent wires from the AVR to the speakers, but from the same terminals
 
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Anonymous

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Right. So a nine channel amp is only a nine channel amp until you want to use nine channels, and then it becomes a seven channel amp
emotion-40.gif
.

I do understand how to bi-amp [which is what I want to be able to do, not bi-wire - pah that would be easy
emotion-5.gif
], I just didn't realise it would be so hard to achieve with 7.1 and a single amp
emotion-7.gif
 
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Anonymous

Guest
c0pperhead:

Right. So a nine channel amp is only a nine channel amp until you want to use nine channels, and then it becomes a seven channel amp
emotion-40.gif
.

I do understand how to bi-amp [which is what I want to be able to do, not bi-wire - pah that would be easy
emotion-5.gif
], I just didn't realise it would be so hard to achieve with 7.1 and a single amp
emotion-7.gif


uhm at the risk of repeating myself - it aint hard - buy a denon 4810 - it does precisely what you want.
 
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Anonymous

Guest
Do you reckon that's my only option, will the AVR-A100 do it too?

I would prefer something a bit more future proofed, with Hdmi 1.4 & Audio Return. A pain aren't I
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.
 

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