Amp and speakers for playing lossless audio from a computer / iPod

[admin_exported]

Hi all

I've read a lot of posts on these forums over the past few weeks while trying to figure out what to buy. I've got about 500 odd quid to spend and was thinking until recently of buying a cd/amp/speaker set. However we have a house full of Apple Macs and I rarely listen to music from CD, as we don't have a decent hi fi at the minute. I don't expect this behaviour to change, itunes is just too useful in managing a music collection.

 So I'm looking at an amp and speakers (interconnects, stands and cables).

I had been looking at the

Cambridge Audio 540c 540A v2 S30 speakers (cheap ish multiroom via incognito appeals)

or NAD 515 315 and Tannoy f1 deal from Superfi.

Given my new found freedom from not spending money on a CD player, what would you recommend?

Richer Sounds, Superfi and Seven Oaks are close by and 500 is the top end.

I'm looking for help from people who listen to computer based audio primarily, not convincing that CDs are better.

Pairings of amps and speakers appreciated,

I listen to a mix of rock and electronica see http://www.last.fm/user/gavinb/library

thanks 

 

[Anonymous]

Sounds to me like you want an Airport Express >> DAC >> amp >> speakers. Have you though about second hand amp/speakers? ÿIs £500 your maximum? It would be rude not to include a DAC in your new set up if you are after CD quality sound, which is very achievable with your lossless files.

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks Octopo,

That seems like a potential approach, any recommendations for DACs? Second baby due soon so budget is fairly fixed,

Buying an amp and speakers with the potential to add a DAC later seems wise though

cheers

Gavinÿ

 

[Anonymous]

In the meantime you could install this on your macs. It's software that adds a little of what DACs can do like better soundstaging and clarity. Definitely look into DACs later though funds allowing, they really do make a big difference. Check this months WHF for a group test on budget DACs, pay close attention to Beresford and the new Cambridge.

I would look into Wharfedale Diamond 9's or Monitor Audio BR2 or second hand for your speakers as the F1's just won't cut it with the detail lossless/DAC can bring.

NAD is not a bad place to start with amps and will suit any of said speakers. Alternatively you could look at the Marantz 6002 or Rotel RA-04, both are fantastic amps and offer a bit more finesse than the NAD. Again, more to be had if you are willing to go second hand.

 

[Binman]

I pretty much listen to the same type of music you do judging by your lastfm profile. I also listen mainly to apple lossless.

I've got a Squeezebox instead of an Airport Express. The Squeezebox is good, but its a little bit touch and go if it'll work. Like just tonight - its stopped connecting to my PC for no apparent reason. Also other people find it difficult to use (its actually easy) but not as intuatuve as Itunes / ipod

I dont think I would recommend a squeezebox to anyone who is not comfortable with computers and network settings. Also, if you and your family love Itunes, an airport express is what you need. If you have a Ipod Touch or Iphone you can apparently control Itunes over WIFI with it.

My amp is a Rotel RA-02 and speakers are B&W 602S3. Sounds good to me, but when I first got it I wanted more bass (like you get in clubs!) but I guess that amount of bass would be seen as a negative for everyday listening. I think the updated versions are Rotel RA04 and B&W 685.

Freind has same set up but with Cambridge Audio Azur amp (negatives - its huge and doesnt feel as well built as my Rotel) and Mission floorstanders (cant remember the model). Sounds very good to my ear and can really pump out the tunes.

I have another system with Wharfdale 8 speakers. They are good, but only for the kitchen, I couldn't live with them in my lounge for my main music, so not sure how the Whardale 9's would compare. With speakers, I definetly belive that bigger is better.

As for cables and stuff - don't go overboard.

 

[Anonymous]

Binman:
I have another system with Wharfdale 8 speakers.ÿ They are good, but only for the kitchen, I couldn't live with them in my lounge for my main music, so not sure how the Whardale 9's would compare. With speakers, I definetly belive that bigger is better.

The 8's are not as good as the 9's.

I would fully disagree with your other point. At this price level bigger is definitely worse.ÿ

 

[Anonymous]

mac's sound any good? i expect the soundcard is nothing a £200 amp can't exploit fully. Then you have another £200 or so for speakers, so you could go cheaper on the amp i reckon. I wouldn'y expect a highly detailed system so a balanced one would be my goal. I dont call small speakers balanced as i also like a club feel when its cranked up.

There is no budgit here for dac's unless a small but refined sound is your goal. Even then pennys will be tight, and its not going to have much grunt. I can live with low quality better than a lack of grunt.

if you do go with a dac, i fear leads will eat your budgit. £30 each, then some speaker wire. Then the cheapest dac and £200 is already gone. You will be left with better future upgrade routes though. upgrades you will want instantly.

 

[drummerman]

Save up a little bit more and buy AVI's original ADM9 either s/h or ex/dem. Add AE. Nothing here mentioned will come even remotely close imo. Add a sub and you have a serious hifi that can stand its own ground with the big boys.

 

[Anonymous]

The DAC onboard the mac isn't too bad, but is no way near the standard of a Beresford. Remember if you don't use AE or DAC a high quality shielded 3.5mm/RCA lead will be needed which aren't cheap. A system of this level may not be able to exploit the full level of detail but there are other things DAC's provide just as greater clarity and soundstaging which you would definitely benefit from.

If you can't afford this at this stage I would wholeheartedly recommend you upgrade at a later stage if you want the most from your set up.ÿ

ÿ

 

[Anonymous]

drummerman:
Save up a little bit more and buy AVI's original ADM9 either s/h or ex/dem. Add AE. Nothing here mentioned will come even remotely close imo. Add a sub and you have a serious hifi that can stand its own ground with the big boys.

Good idea but will be pushed to find any / around this price when everything else has been taken into account.ÿ

 

[drummerman]

Correct but its surely worth to save a couple more weeks or so when looking at the alternatives! As always, my opinion only.

 

[John Duncan]

Yup, but Airport Express is just so neat, I think you have to have one. If I had 500 quid, and wanted to buy new, I would get AE, a Marantz PM7001 (currently 250 quid at Richer Sounds, if you're quick), 150 quids worth of speakers to your taste and a 35 quid pair of atacama stands off eBay. The DAC can wait.

Drummerman is probably right, but the only ex-dem AVIs I've seen were 700 quid.

If s/h is an option, there's a whole new world.........

 

[drummerman]

JD, how can you possibly compare a 7001 and 150 pound speakers with AVI's ADM???

I know its a bit more but you do get a built in DAC, Pre-amp and a lot of power. Never mind the quality. I know £200 can be a lot of money but if you're willing to spend 500 on entertainment I'd say there's no problem with finding the other 200. Again my opinion only and you'd obviously would have to listen to a pair first which may be a problem depending where you live.

 

[John Duncan]

I wasn't, but am reading between the lines about his budget limit. If he can stretch to 700 quid (which he categorically says he can't), then there's a pair of white exdem ones next door which he could snap up. Or maybe they're 800, I forget (andsee, I'm creeping his budget up even more).

And I did say you were probably right (not having heard the ADMs)

 

[drummerman]

Fair enough, you are so sensible its impossible to argue ... . Did I mention linn's new classik, a grand with built in dac too

 

[John Duncan]

Yeah, and cooler looking. I always liked the old one - if it had knobs, I'd be first in line.......

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all your advice.

Current plan is to spend 500 on amp and speakers, buying cables stands etc from other cash, then buy a DAC later on, either the Beresford or the CA DacMagic.

ÿthis is a really helpful community

will try the BR2s and a Rotel at ÿssav etc.

cheers

Gavinÿ

ÿ

ÿ

 

[Anonymous]

@drummerman theÿAVI ADM9 is definitely an interesting option, there is one set in white on ebay at 750 odd.

 

[drummerman]

Imo you cannot do better for that money. They are very revealing and powerful with an extended (not bright) treble and a sense of 'live' music. They dont have a lot of bass but whats there is solid. You can add a good sub later which puts them into a different league again but many punters seem to use them without. Word of warning, they dont impress immediately like some cheap (and expensive) bad hifi. Listen to them for a couple of hours though and the penny will drop. After that, I'd almost guarantee it, you'll find most conventional hifi sound boomy, boxy, veiled and artificial. There are exceptions of course but imo they cost considerably more.

Still, as with everything, I recommend auditioning first which is difficult with ebay stuff. They pop up on a regular basis though as owners upgrade to the 9.1s. If you're not in a hurry I would suggest to go on some different forums and see if you have an owner nearby which could dem you the things. I certainly would'nt buy a cheap rotel and MA's!

 

[Anonymous]

The AVIs look like a great buy, I'll see what comes up on ebay. However the EOS 5D mk2 is also catching my eye

 

[Anonymous]

EOS 5D mk2 ÿ << ÿ ÿWhat is this?

 

[John Duncan]

Octopo:EOS 5D mk2 ÿ << ÿ ÿWhat is this?

About a Plinius.

 

[Anonymous]

Given your Macs, I would strongly recommend an AirPort Express with whatever amp / 'speakers you choose. ÿI use them in three locations (into an old Linn 5103, a CD player with an optical digital input, and a radio in the kitchen that happens to have an aux input). ÿThey are great! ÿHaving this doesn't stop me playing CDs (and records ...) too, but it's a great facility to have.

And whoever said mentioned the iPod Touch / iPhone remote control application was spot on; that makes it much easier to drive iTunes (simply because you don't have to be in the same place as the computer).

 

[Anonymous]

I don't blame you for wanting one then. I was about to google and then it clicked (no pun intended), ÿ ÿ say cheese... ÿ .

 

[Anonymous]

So I went to seven oaks in Holborn

Tried the marantz 6002 and the rotel ra04, plus the B&W 686 and the BR2s.

Marantz seemed overly bright, didn't try the 685s, as they were 150 quid more which is the best part of the DACmagic. Also those tweeters looked child unfriendly I figured the DAC would make more of a difference than posher speakers

settled on the rotel ra-04 and the BR2s, I liked the sound. got a set of nexus 6s too

They had a sale set of avi adm9s in white, which we considered, but decided against, trying to stick to budget and I wasn't that keen on white. Also wanted something I can upgrade etc

picking up on wednesday or thursday.

thanks for your help everyone

Gavin