A couple of questions . . . ?

[CJSF]

Whilst rumaging through verious forums and posts earlier today, I came across a statement that put me back on my heals?

. . . the poster was making a positive coment on the 'Sumiko Celebration pearwood sinature', The coment was that he, the poster, believed the 'Simiko Pearwood' was made under licence by Keotsu and re badged as 'Sumiko'. An interesting thought and consideration . . . 'a poor mans Keotsu' :?

The reason for my digging around on the webb was to reserch the new version of the 'Sumiko Pearwood', try to get an idea of where its 'new sound voice' might sit, if indeed, it has changed significantly?

My thoughts are, after I have completed the in progress TT support re-vamp, would it be worth re tipping my Sumiko Celebration, which was well used when I aquired it, or taking advatage of the 'like for like' cartridge trade in Sumiko offer. Its all about sound change, what type of stylus will the re-tipers use, against the new stylus type Sumiko now fit. I dont want a modern ?!?! sounding catridge that so often come from fancy stylus shapes!

Any one have any ideas on the questions possed: Is the Sumiko Celebration made by Keotsu, any idea if a review has been done on the new one or know how it sounds?

CJSF

 

[floyd droid]

Hmm interesting stuff CJ. Alongside making carts Sumiko are importers and flog it onners , as im sure you well know already.

Koetsu are/ wiz ? one of those products. I wonder if matey has got some wires crossed, dunno to be honest. However i have an hfn review by Kessler in regs to the Palo Santos. Mibbe a bit of insight to how Sumi go about things these days will be in the review.

I will dig it out and get back to you.

Why not call Sumi (510) 843-4500 and ask them who makes it. Tis onny in California so they should have finished their lunch by now,lol.

Edit. The Santos review is on tinterwebbie CJ. References to Koetsu ( regarding presentation ). so sorry mate ,none the wiser.

 

[floyd droid]

Hi Cj. Glad that the wall shelf is getting underway, nowt ventured and all that stuff. Ive been doing a bit of digging regs Sumiko. By all accounts they design their own carts but get them made in the far east, so you can draw from that what you like !.

Ive considered a re-tip/cantelever jobbie (i have a couple of bounced carts knocking around) but havnt got around to it. So i cant pass comment im afraid. I do know a guy who had a top end Shelter re-tipped by Dominic Harper at Northwest Analogue and is well impressed. By all accounts Dom is very busy but it is possible for you to send your cart to him for an assement at a small cost. A trawl around his site is worth the effort.

 

[CJSF]

Hmm interesting stuff CJ. Alongside making carts Sumiko are importers and flog it onners , as im sure you well know already.

Koetsu are/ wiz ? one of those products. I wonder if matey has got some wires crossed, dunno to be honest. However i have an hfn review by Kessler in regs to the Palo Santos. Mibbe a bit of insight to how Sumi go about things these days will be in the review.

I will dig it out and get back to you.

Why not call Sumi (510) 843-4500 and ask them who makes it. Tis onny in California so they should have finished their lunch by now,lol.

Yes Floyd, it went through my mind when I first aquired the Sumiko, it had a Koetsu look about it, it even has a beguiling voice that reminds me of all those years ago, after hours at shows, we used to go listening, I think it was the Koetsu Black that was 'the cartridge' then? To be honest, I have no concern either way, just an interesting snipet that some might have had a handle on? Be interested in KK's coments.

You will be pleased to know I 'finaly' start work on making my TT shelf this weekend. One has put much thought into how? or even if? perhaps a pre made shop bought metal one? . . . .

I have finaly decided to recycile an old cottage chair frame, bade of beech, that has the right dimentions with some very nice bent wood that might do nicly for the under support? Everything to gain, if it turns out to be a goose . . . on to a comercial unit, but try my own thing first.

Then, turn thoughts back to the cartridge, just how worn, or not, is it. Had a session this afternoon with some very old favourits from that 80's period, Pink Floyd, Dire Straits, Pete Gabriel, Simon and Garfunkel, not so sure its that worn, perhaps it just needs the shelf?? Do you have any experiance of retiping, it bothers me, you cant audition, paying £300 blind, I might not like it?

CJFS

 

[floyd droid]

Here ya go CJ

 

[CJSF]

Here ya go CJ

Thanks Flyod, his feed back is impresive, sounds like the sort of guy who apreciates 'music' as we used to hear it in the 80's?

I have sent him an email, requesting some sort of ball park figure to re tip and fully service my Sumiko???

. . . I am real impresed with the coments indicating the sort of voice he gives the cartriges he re tips.

CJS

 

[CJSF]

Here ya go CJ

Whew:O . . . I've had a reply back from Northwest Analogue. It pushes one into the relms 'get a new cartridge' . . . !!!! As I said, a lot of money + another £100 on top . . . buying on spec, with no garentees one will like it?

I will have a word with Expert Stylus & Cartridge Co. see what they offer?

CJSF

 

[floyd droid]

Wowsie as much as that eh !. Expert stylus are decked out im lead to believe but no harm in trying i spose.

Follow my rules CJ which are 'stuff it you are too long under 6 foot' buy a new cart

 

[CnoEvil]

Follow my rules CJ which are 'stuff it you are too long under 6 foot' buy a new cart

Carpe Diem...now you're talking my language....and as a bonus, I hear the acoustics while living in a cardboard box, are really rather good. :twisted:

 

[floyd droid]

Lol, well yeah Cno. :beer:

 

[CJSF]

Wowsie as much as that eh !. Expert stylus are decked out im lead to believe but no harm in trying i spose.

Follow my rules CJ which are 'stuff it you are too long under 6 foot' buy a new cart

. . . Which tells me they may be less, 12 months ago, Expert Stylus were £300 for a full rebuild. Four hundred squid pushes me towards looking at new? I can get a new Sumiko with my old one as PX for £900 and I get to audition.

I have on my wish list: Lyre, Benz, Sumiko, even a Decca Gold? All but the Benze I can get on sale or return and a trade in against an Ortofon Black that I have, great cartridge that the Black is, to modern and analitical for me.

Does any one have any other sugestions for the wish list? . . . then again, £400 is cheaper than £700-£900, but would you part with £400 without an audition?

CJSF

 

[CJSF]

Wowsie as much as that eh !. Expert stylus are decked out im lead to believe but no harm in trying i spose.

Follow my rules CJ which are 'stuff it you are too long under 6 foot' buy a new cart

. . . Which tells me they may be less, 12 months ago, Expert Stylus were £300 for a full rebuild. Four hundred squid pushes me towards looking at new? I can get a new Sumiko with my old one as PX for £900 and I get to audition.

I have on my wish list: Lyre, Benz, Sumiko, even a Decca Gold? All but the Benze I can get on sale or return and a trade in against an Ortofon Black that I have, great cartridge that the Black is, to modern and analitical for me.

Does any one have any other sugestions for the wish list? . . . then again, £400 is cheaper than £700-£900, but would you part with £400 without an audition?

??? another side to the coin . . . if I had the re tip, did not like it, would I get my money back on fleBay? I notice there is a Koetsu Black, Vanden Hull re tip on there, I bet from the description, it is up because it is not liked, and only at £600 with a few hours to go?

CJSF

 

[floyd droid]

I saw a Koetsu with a 'claimed' 1000 hrs on it earlier CJ but cant find the one you are on about. Off for a smoke to think of more options for ya (within your budget). Could be a toughie

 

[floyd droid]

Yikes scrap that . The carts i had in mind have gone through the roof price wise. Tis all getting a bit silly nowadays methinks.

Alongside the Ortofon do you have any other back up carts Cj ?.

 

[CJSF]

Yikes scrap that . The carts i had in mind have gone through the roof price wise. Tis all getting a bit silly nowadays methinks.

Alongside the Ortofon do you have any other back up carts Cj ?.

I have a Blue and a Black, I prefer the Blue to the Black! The Sumiko is working well enough at present, however my suspision is, the changes are so slow as the stylus wears I'm not noticing it???

New shelf first . . . but, I took the dog for a walk this morning, my knee has given out!!! Its been a problem for 6 or 7 years, so I wont be going to the shed today:wall: hopfully it will improve with a days rest???? cold, damp weather dont help!

110969818516 EB no. of the Koetsu I refered to.

My problem is the sound I like is not how cartridges sound these days . . . from what I read? I just dont have the listening experiance that I had in the 80's . . . I dont have any, and trying to get cartridge auditions is like asking for the crown jewels these days?

:roll: . . . catch 22? Bite the bullett, the feed back/customer coments from Northwest Analogues re-tiping do mention quite a lot, 'the warmth of the sound after his work'. He re builds old vintage decks . . . therefore one has a feeling he might be working on the same hymn sheet as I sing from??? . . . but . . . I think I might have a word with him on the phone next week???:?

CJSF

 

[floyd droid]

Aha i found the sucker ( koetsu) in Vienna. Matey is either loaded or a dealer. Erm or both,lol. Did you have a butchers at his other items ?. Cripes !!!.

My money is on a dealer. Roksan Shiraz ex Dem. Good innit, all from Wien yet he is based in Hungary. Although that aint all that far away from Vienna.

Anyways back on track. Giving Dom a call will at least tell him what hymn sheet you sing from CJ.

Keep us up to speed mate.

 

[CJSF]

Aha i found the sucker ( koetsu) in Vienna. Matey is either loaded or a dealer. Erm or both,lol. Did you have a butchers at his other items ?. Cripes !!!.

My money is on a dealer. Roksan Shiraz ex Dem. Good innit, all from Wien yet he is based in Hungary. Although that aint all that far away from Vienna.

Anyways back on track. Giving Dom a call will at least tell him what hymn sheet you sing from CJ.

Keep us up to speed mate.

Thanks for the interest. My knee seems to have settled with an afternoon of rest, I will cut the dog walking down a bit tomorrow!

Having had time to sit quietly and ponder, re read the 're-tip customer feed back' on the MWA site . . . and get my head around a large 'blind' outlay . . . its the blind bit that bugs me. I dont think there are many . . . if any . . . good options at the price? A man who can revitalise/improve (acording to feed back) a Koetsu with out destroying the original Koetsu signature sound, has to be very special . . . :?

So, start on the new TT shelf, changing the cartridge seems like a pointless exercise with out knowing just how good the TT realy is as it stands, create a bench mark. I have some sort of comparison as my recording of The Tallis Scholars Allegri Miserere does not have the openess and deep, high image it exhibeted in the early days of the Sumiko . . . Thinking about it, the same applies to a lot of my church organ music, I dont play it so often. Creeps up on one, that etherial accustic is not evident. Strange that, the heavier stuff still has its image, Peter Gabriel, that I listend to yesterday for instance . . . but it needed more volume, another '5 minuets' on the knob.

Interesting how the mind can become focused, and what was the norm might actualy be a problem?

CJSF

 

[chebby]

Creeps up on one, that etherial accustic is not evident. Strange that, the heavier stuff still has its image, Peter Gabriel, that I listend to yesterday for instance . . . but it needed more volume, another '5 minuets' on the knob.

Interesting how the mind can become focused, and what was the norm might actualy be a problem?

Did that 'norm' start to become 'a problem' before or after you began contemplating an upgrade?

 

[CJSF]

Creeps up on one, that etherial accustic is not evident. Strange that, the heavier stuff still has its image, Peter Gabriel, that I listend to yesterday for instance . . . but it needed more volume, another '5 minuets' on the knob.

Interesting how the mind can become focused, and what was the norm might actualy be a problem?

Did that 'norm' start to become 'a problem' before or after you began contemplating an upgrade?

Upgrade Chebby, what upgrade, a re-tip is not an upgrade, just replacing a worn stylus that I new would need replacing sometime when I aquired the cartridge a year ago. Equaly, I am considering changing 'like for like' with the Sumiko PX scheem, or even buying a less expensive cartridge? . . . Have you not read the thread and properly understood? I dont want anything different to what I 'had'. Maybe the TT shelf will make all the differance?

You dont get away with a cheap shot on me like that Chebby!!!!!

CJSF

 

[shropshire lad]

Creeps up on one, that etherial accustic is not evident. Strange that, the heavier stuff still has its image, Peter Gabriel, that I listend to yesterday for instance . . . but it needed more volume, another '5 minuets' on the knob.

Interesting how the mind can become focused, and what was the norm might actualy be a problem?

Did that 'norm' start to become 'a problem' before or after you began contemplating an upgrade?

Upgrade Chebby, what upgrade, a re-tip is not an upgrade, just replacing a worn stylus that I new would need replacing sometime when I aquired the cartridge a year ago. Equaly, I am considering changing 'like for like' with the Sumiko PX scheem, or even buying a less expensive cartridge? . . . Have you not read the thread and properly understood? I dont want anything different to what I 'had'. Maybe the TT shelf will make all the differance?

You dont get away with a cheap shot on me like that Chebby!!!!!

CJSF

CJ ,

I didn't read Chebby's comment as a cheap shot , unless I'm reading it wrong , just trying to ascertain how your mind is working .

 

[CJSF]

Creeps up on one, that etherial accustic is not evident. Strange that, the heavier stuff still has its image, Peter Gabriel, that I listend to yesterday for instance . . . but it needed more volume, another '5 minuets' on the knob.

Interesting how the mind can become focused, and what was the norm might actualy be a problem?

Did that 'norm' start to become 'a problem' before or after you began contemplating an upgrade?

Upgrade Chebby, what upgrade, a re-tip is not an upgrade, just replacing a worn stylus that I new would need replacing sometime when I aquired the cartridge a year ago. Equaly, I am considering changing 'like for like' with the Sumiko PX scheem, or even buying a less expensive cartridge? . . . Have you not read the thread and properly understood? I dont want anything different to what I 'had'. Maybe the TT shelf will make all the differance?

You dont get away with a cheap shot on me like that Chebby!!!!!

CJSF

CJ ,

I didn't read Chebby's comment as a cheap shot , unless I'm reading it wrong , just trying to ascertain how your mind is working .

My mind is working just fine Shropshire lad, I have said in the past, once I get there I will be satisfied. I am satisfied, which is why I dont want to change the sound. However, a stylus is a hifi consumable, my Sumiko was well used when I aquired it, its time to consider 'change' not time to 'upgrade', simples; more of the same.

I have been considering the TT shelf for a long time, in fact it was schedualed for summer, unfortunatly Hazel broke her hip in June so the shelf was side lined . . . . :? . . . why do I have to explain my self!!!!!!!!

CJSF