30 year old hi-fi ! Options for replacements.

[admin_exported]

Dear all,

this is probably going to make a few of you laugh and take a few more on a trip down memory lane. Recently, I got my old hi-fi separates from 30 years ago out, played a few records and cds and thought 'actually, that doesn't sound too bad', set up in a high-ceilinged large volume room, with bay window and curtains behind, wood floors and soft furnishings.

The system consists of:

Rega Planar 3 turntable/RB100 arm/Goldring G1010 stylus

Rotel RA-820BX Amp (30W rms I think)

Rotel RA-965BX CD player

Rotel RA830-AL FM/AM tuner

JPW P1 speakers and Target Speaker stands/Turntable Stand.

I've identified a problem with the speakers, in that the foam surround on the 8" drivers is perishing, and have sourced replacements via Good Hifi in the Netherlands, although the drivers are still made and available if replacing the surround doesn't work. There is a comment on the internet that if I replaced the drivers and the capacitors in the speaker crossovers, then to get an equivalent speaker today I would need to spend £6-800. Is this really the case? If so, what are the equivalent speakers?

So, the options then. I realise there will be many different opinions here.

1. Commit the lot to ebay and start again. (Actually, I am keeping the turntable, as there's a lot of vinyl I haven't yet bought on cd/mp3 (and the stuff that is on vinyl isn't 're-mastered', but that's a separate argument)).

2. Start with an upgrade to cd player (I've been listening via a sony 5.1 dvd/cd/sacd/dts system), followed by amp and keep the speakers. Ancient wisdom 30 years ago suggested to buy the best source (ie cd player) that you could afford, followed by the best amp and then the speakers - is this still the accepted mantra or is a more equal distribution of the cash a better bet today? I would need a phono stage on the amp and CD/SACD/mp3/USB playback on the CD player. So, Marantz 6003 or Audiolab 8200 ?

3. Replace the speakers as well.

Budget for the lot would be £1000 (as long as my wife doesn't see this <g>)

I listen to a wide range of music from classical to rock, and being a bass player, I quite like to hear the bass. I'm not too keen on glassy treble, a more laid-back feel to the sound works for me.

Thanks for reading this marathon post. Thanks in advance for your help.

Ralph

 

[Anonymous]

Rotel gear from that time was pretty good - I'd be inclined to keep the amp, which I presume has a phono stage, but am a little more dubious about the CD player. NAD would be a good replacement.

The tuner's not going to be worth much so I'd keep it.

The speakers are a question mark. The JPWs aren't worth a lot, and they were originally budget I think - have vague memories that Richer Sounds used to sell them. I'd re-foam them and see how they go. The problem you'll have, if you want to change, is that laid back speakers aren't in fashion at the budget end of the market, so you have to pay a lot to get suitable replacements.

 

[gregory]

Keep the lot, all very good componenets, just get them serviced maybe a new stylus or cartridge, but for the Rega about £30 to £50.00 if that to get a service, find a Rotel dealer for the electronics if they need it but keep the speakers , if you are capable of doing the foam surrounds which is not to difficult go for it, you would be hard pressed to find a better speaker today especially for the sound quality you are after or contact wilmslow or wembley loudspeaker co and they may do if for you for a price but a lot cheaper than the grand or so you would expect to spend on new gear, i have heard the exact set up many years ago and if i could have afforded it at the time i would quite happily have lived with it to this day and beyond, i will not knock the gear you have mentioned but is it any better than what you already have, i think not, as for new speakers only pro ac's i feel come close if not slightly better but they are quite hefty in price. Keep us informed i would like to see how you get on, i for one like to see more vintage equipment popping up on this forum.

 

[matthewpiano]

In many ways gregory has a very good point. The Rotel stuff of that period, and particularly the RCD965BX, was excellent and you are going to have to buy some pretty serious kit to improve on it.

However, if you are determined to change, here are my suggestions. If you like a listenable but involving sound that avoids glassy or uncomfortable treble I would look at Arcam or Creek kit. If you want to spend a little less, NAD would be a good option. I've been through far too much kit to mention over the last couple of years, trying to find something musical and involving with plenty of guts but suitable for long listening periods, and my current Arcam/Dali combination gives me this superbly. A Creek/Epos combination would work similarly well. NAD is probably the closest you can get at the cheaper end, although generally their kit lacks the finesse and control of Arcam and Creek (unless you go much further up the range).

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all the replies. I am planning on doing the foam surrounds on the speakers myself, I'll let you know how it goes.

Regarding the CD player, I am surprised that the Rotel 965BX CD is rated so highly by you all- I know it was good at the time (about 1992) because I listened to it first and paid heed to the reviews, but I didn't think it would stand the test of time. I mean, you can still get one on ebay for about £50 or less! Have we had so much 'progress' in hi-fi in the time I've been away from the scene. I don't mind not spending £1000, but I am surprised so far. I thought there would be much more progress in DAC design/performance in current designs.

I don't suppose What Hi-Fi would be interested in a vintage versus current kit comparison article, especially if it is the case that the old stuff is 'better'. Emperor's new clothes anyone?

Please keep the comments coming. If there's anyone with a good 'modern' setup near Glasgow that would let me listen to their set up, then please PM me.

regards

Ralph

 

[strobo]

Join the Audiokarma forums for loads of useful information about your old gear - http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/index.php

I own a couple of bits of vintage gear (A&R Cambridge, Yamaha etc), and their forums have been invaluable for those little tweaks that help improve the sound.

 

[Anonymous]

matthewpiano:In many ways gregory has a very good point. The Rotel stuff of that period, and particularly the RCD965BX, was excellent and you are going to have to buy some pretty serious kit to improve on it. .

Yeah it is a reasonable player, I have one,, but,,,, best used with a separate dac I think..

mine [ I guess they all do ] has a co-ax output and it sounds much better than the ordinary connections. Maybe you could try one out at the local hifi shop It is a bit reluctant with copied discs etc though unlike some modern ones but the best of these also might not play mp3 anyway.

The Rega deck is worth keeping and getting serviced, don't know about the rest of the bits and pieces tbh.

 

[mitch65]

Got to echo most of the sentiments, The Rega is a very good deck and a service should dust the cobwebs off, the rotel amps from that time were highly regarded and still perform well today as do their CD players (I have a 9 year old one and it would take a fair amount of beating) but certainly consider a seperate DAC if you feel the need. I would say maybe look at changing the tuner and speakers so overall looks like your original investment was a wise one, me thinks

 

[the record spot]

Only three things I would change here; a better arm for the Rega - think RB301 to replace the basic RB100. Thereafter, keep the Rotel, which is a good player, but have a think about a new DAC if you can add one to the player. Musical Fidelity's M1 DAC (£399) has enjoyed some good feedback and I imagine would be a good upgrade on the onboard Rotel DAC, good though it was in its day.

Lastly, an upgraded amp - in a digital platform, I think the amplifier holds sway here (for vinyl, I prefer to concentrate on the turntable). In terms of priorities, with £1000, you're looking at around £300 for the RB301, £399 for the DAC and that leaves about £300 for the amp. In those terms and as you're looking to upgrade the digital side of things, I'd leave out the arm upgrade for now and work towards the other two. This suddenly gives you about £600 for the amp and depending on what you're looking for, there are a number of options, both new and ex-dem.

If it were my cash, I'd be looking at getting the Harman Kardon HK990 on a deal (price ranges from £899 to £1200) as it's a fine amp with a great spec. 150wpc, dual mono design and - incidentally - an onboard DAC, but not up to the M1 I imagine. I heard this amp last year and was very impressed with it. Rather neutral, doesn't impose its character too much but ample power.

EDIT: Speakers: I'd hang fire on changing them unless they're beyond repair, or you change your mind. Otherwise, try them out and see what you think.

 

[Anonymous]

Given the speakers, I wouldn't go overboard. I've only heard JPW P1s once, a long time ago, and thought they were very good for the price. I heard them with NAD amp and CD, which I thought made a good, well balanced combination, something you'd not want to change in a hurry.

I'd still be inclined just to re-foam or, if necessary, re-cone and only change the CD for a new NAD, but I'm not that familiar with the Rotel CD player in question. It does have a digital output, so you could go the DAC route. I'd suggest the V-DAC over the M1, partly on cost grounds and partly because (and I have the upgraded power supply) I couldn't reliably hear the difference between it and the M1.

 

[cse]

I would spend the £1000. Replace the amp with the new Yamaha which is about £300, the CD player with either the Yamaha or Marantz models or possibly a good deal on an Arcam. Try and get SACD if you listen to classical. Keep the turntable and Tuner. Upgrade the speakers as well to BW's or something else that you like at your dealers for around £400, possibly Rega. Don't waste money on interconnects, but speaker cable is important. Negotiate with the dealer to include some in the deal, especially if you buy all of the components from the same store. Try and get him to include good speaker stands as well. I believe that you will find this solution more satisfying. Do you really want a DAC? One or more of the above amps/CD players might include one, or at least mp3 playback.

 

[Anonymous]

Lots of food for thought here. Thanks for all the help. I knew that there would be 1000 ways to skin a cat and I appreciate the time taken for all of you to post.

I hadn't even considered keeping the CD player and getting a separate DAC - another option to consider

So, decisions I have made so far:

1. Keep the turntable, get it a service and investigate upgrades to deck and arm in the medium term.

2. Keep the tuner. It's good enough for the moment.

3. Refoam the JPW P1s and see how they go after 'running in'.

4. Find a decent dealer near Glasgow and go and use my ears to compare some options.

Well, that's it so far, a bit more thought and listening required for the rest. . .

cheers

Ralph

 

[simon3102000]

cse:I would spend the £1000. Replace the amp with the new Yamaha which is about £300, the CD player with either the Yamaha or Marantz models or possibly a good deal on an Arcam. Try and get SACD if you listen to classical. Keep the turntable and Tuner. Upgrade the speakers as well to BW's or something else that you like at your dealers for around £400, possibly Rega. Don't waste money on interconnects, but speaker cable is important. Negotiate with the dealer to include some in the deal, especially if you buy all of the components from the same store. Try and get him to include good speaker stands as well. I believe that you will find this solution more satisfying. Do you really want a DAC? One or more of the above amps/CD players might include one, or at least mp3 playback.

I wouldnt scrimp on the interconnects to much in my opinion, good qaulity ones make all the difference, chord crimson plus cost about £30 a pop and work wonders

 

[Anonymous]

simon3102000:

I wouldnt scrimp on the interconnects to much in my opinion, good qaulity ones make all the difference, chord crimson plus cost about £30 a pop and work wonders

I second that, the connectors make a hell of a difference, more than speaker wire by a long way. 30 quid is a bargain for such a big difference in sound over the cheapo leads you get with the hifi kit.

I would say any leads that you have to pay more than a tenner for are going to make for a better sound than the freebee ones .